ahsingjai said:
DO you believe the intial release of the game was any where near the problems Half life 2 had? Besides, Valve constantly release patches 10 times faster then Firaxis.
Valve constantly released patches for their multi-player components when HL2 was first released. It took them around a month for a patch to be released to fix some of the more "serious" issues such as audio stutter (using Miles sound system) and gameplay lag, even in single player games. But guess what, according to some people (myself not included), the game is still not perfect. It never will be.
In so far as asking if I think cIV was as good/bad a release as HL2, well I dont know if I can comment generally. I can only comment on my
own problems with both and I'd have to say that Civ4 wins, hands down. Let me guess? You knew I was going to say that? Well it is true. I struggled with HL2 for a while there, depending on the level I was playing at the time. With Civ4, I have had the crash to desktop a few times (largely because I think of the bug where you have a unit moving (or their animation is playing) and I give the unit another order - bang! Back to desktop), I have had a couple of BSODs (fixed by using the manufacturer video drivers

), and I have had other issues, and now, the voice-overs dont work anymore. Me thinks it is something I've done anyway as I have been frigging with the Civ4.ini file for some time now. Not saying this is you, but with some people's posts on these forums, they would be screaming bloody murder at the fact their voice-overs once worked and now they dont. I'm not. I am 99% sure I stuffed it up. Should I fix it? Do I care? Not really. I've heard them all before anyway.

But back to comparing, I just dont think, in my case, that these problems were as serious (besides the BSODs) as what was occurring in HL2. Just my opinion!
There is one thing when comparing (and it is kind of like apples to oranges) and that is that Valve were a
year late with HL2. Civ4 was early. Hrmm. Civ4 was "rushed" out the door and HL2 wasnt. What had bugs and problems? Both. Interesting point...
ahsingjai said:
If the game was final, it should have miminal problems. And besides, Civilization IV wasn't even an high end system hog, it should work 95% of all customers' systems. I mean I would understand why it wouldn't work for Civ2 or Civ3 PC users because those didn't require much, but a lot of people have fairly new computers and still claim the game doesn't work or it's too buggy.
I totally agree (@ face value) with your statement regarding if you have a top-of-the-line system, then any program
should work without performance issues. But once again, we are delving into the dark, murky world of PCs here in that, my system might be a PoS but can still out-perform yours (even though your PC might be considerably higher spec) in some areas. Why is that so? Configuration, maintenance, driver levels, and overclocking just to name a few. Just because a PC is top of the line does not necessarily mean you are going to get the "best" performance in any game. We are talking hardware here when it comes to a "top-of-the-line" machine (like how we all love notifying everyone of our specs of our PCs and ramble on that everything should work fine) but forgetting about software that plays an integral part in overall stability, and performance. Off-topic slightly --> Remember, Windows = Bloatware and it is going to get a lot worse in Pista.
ahsingjai said:
You can't compare today's gaming industry to yesterday's. The competitiveness and the the acknowledgement of gamers today, the gaming industry know gamers would not accept this kind of quality in today's games.
Yes I can. Even though we have newer technology, better and newer APIs (in most respects), higher performing systems, we also have this thing called the internet. We also have this thing called "big-business". Years ago, PC gaming was a niche market, as compared to now. Games
were less complex back then, mainly due to the hardware around at the time. Games didnt have 3D graphics to the extent we have today. In other words, in many respects, games actually were simpler however they were still a lot of fun (and personally, a lot more original than today's copy-as-many-ideas-as-we-can market). Without the internet, developers tried their hardest to release a game to market without any bugs. There still were games with bugs. Games still crashed. This is part of the reason why I can compare as it really is no different - just the technology has changed.
I am not saying that developers don't debug anymore. Of course they still do. Of course they still beta-test. But what the marketing companies know, besides the fact that it is the $$$$$ (substitute your national currency here

) that counts, that the developers can always release now and patch later. After the game is "fixed", all will be forgotten in due course and it starts over.
This has been said before and I am sure some people wont agree but I have faith in Firaxis to fix and patch this game until it is right. They have done it before and they will continue to do it. Otherwise they do face a loss in sales (and reputation) in the next project they decide to release. Firaxis to me just doesn't seem like the company that doesn't give a sh.. damn about their customers. Unlike EA, fake-Atari, QSI, and HB Studios.
Not in the games market, but the more important business market, Microsoft has been doing this for years. Are people complaining? Are YOU complaining, ahsingjai? Look, professional matters, as far as I am concerned dont come into any conversation here as they are largely irrelevant, however I will use this as a final point and then I'll drop off, and go to bed :yawn: I have a lot to do with supporting, implementing, designing infrastructures and recommending Microsoft products (well as little as possible

). As compared to Civ4 and Firaxis, what Microsoft can get away with is pathetic in terms of the quality of some of their software. People are complaining louder here about some bugs/configuration issues than they do about security holes, interoperability between microsoft products and a plethora of other problems. Aren't these more serious? You are paying a LOT more money for Windows than Civ4...
Will Microsoft fix these issues? Yes they will.......But you'll have to buy Vista to get those fixes.