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Gator01 - Team B - 100K
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mad-bax said:Sorry everyone. Haven't been able to play over Easter. Will play tonight. Don't know how far I'll get. Probably just declare war on Persia and hadn the game back....
I think space is up next, so that is fine with me. She is the one who keeps hurrying this thing along.
That's just to give you a taste of what's in store in Space-3... 
Actually I'm only trying to keep this game alive now that we've breathed some life into it. Trust me, once MB has declared war he wouldn't dream on leaving the actual fighting to someone else...
Actually I'm only trying to keep this game alive now that we've breathed some life into it. Trust me, once MB has declared war he wouldn't dream on leaving the actual fighting to someone else...
Northern Pike
Deity
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On reflection, I think Ainwood's idea of going into communism to whip is clearly the right one, even though we don't really know how bad communism is in PtW. Considered as an ordinary deity game, this is a won position; but thinking of it as a 100K challenge, we aren't making sufficient progress.
Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
I hope this doesn't qualify as spoiler info for SGOTM 6, but we (Team Peanut) found out that PTW communism is absolutely wretched for this type of game. With a huge number of cities, you quickly approach a point of every city being 95% corrupt and having no way of maintaining all those culture buildings. If we're going to want to whip, despotism is actually the better choice.
Northern Pike
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Oh, OK. I'm glad someone on the team has meaningful experience of PtW communism.
A carefully timed one-turn communist era for whipping purposes might still help us. As a religious civ we can try ploys like this.
A carefully timed one-turn communist era for whipping purposes might still help us. As a religious civ we can try ploys like this.
Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
Thats a very interesting concept. Certainly worth consideration.
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>>THE SAVE<<
I apologise for having the save all this time and only playing 5 turns. Easter was difficult and my boss has been with me at work this week, so I have to wine and dine him in the evenings.
This is how far I got.
850AD: Pre-turn.
Well... It looks to me like our only chance of a cultural win is a military victory first. I intend to gear for war with Persia and then Rome. Egypt is more obvious, but the territory is horrible.
Decide to trade iron to Liz for incense and wm. I doubt we'll fight her, but maybe she can help us with Rome.
Since the game will drag on a little I decided to short rush some courts, and switched some towns on expensive culture builds to military. Hope this is OK. My intention is to go for Persia and sign an MA with Egypt.
860AD:
870AD:
Establish Embassy with Egyptians, who have learned ToG this turn.
Buy Magnetism from Japan for WM + 1470g
Trade Spices and Magnetism to Egypt for ToG.
Buy worker from England for 120g
Persia has a nationalism monopoly. 4 civs have steam power. Just to test the water I see if 279gpt buys us Nationalism. It doesn't. Ah yes our rep is shot. Forgot about that.
Set science to Medicine on single scientist. Better stop the short rushes if we need to buy tech with cash on the barrelhead.
880AD:
Quiet. I have about 25 Cavalry now. Another 10 and I'll risk it for a Swiss Kit.
IBT:
The Japanese destroy the Germans.
890AD:
Persia loses it's 2 luxes from us. Shame.
Probably declare next turn or the one after. Not nearly enough troops, but still.
900AD:
Decided to force the Persian border back a bit with a new city.
I don't think we are ready for war yet. Perhaps another 10 Cavalry and we can try it. We should use cannon for Susa. It's on a hill. We can back out of war of course. It's up to you lot. Maybe another 5 to 10 turns concerted military build up will do it. The elite MW's we have should be upgraded I think. They are too week defensively to be much use except pillaging and capturing workers. From experience they will end up away from the stack and get murdered by immortals. I would feel more comfortable with more cannon too, but beggars can't be choosers.
I apologise for having the save all this time and only playing 5 turns. Easter was difficult and my boss has been with me at work this week, so I have to wine and dine him in the evenings.
This is how far I got.
850AD: Pre-turn.
Well... It looks to me like our only chance of a cultural win is a military victory first. I intend to gear for war with Persia and then Rome. Egypt is more obvious, but the territory is horrible.
Decide to trade iron to Liz for incense and wm. I doubt we'll fight her, but maybe she can help us with Rome.
Since the game will drag on a little I decided to short rush some courts, and switched some towns on expensive culture builds to military. Hope this is OK. My intention is to go for Persia and sign an MA with Egypt.
860AD:
870AD:
Establish Embassy with Egyptians, who have learned ToG this turn.
Buy Magnetism from Japan for WM + 1470g
Trade Spices and Magnetism to Egypt for ToG.
Buy worker from England for 120g
Persia has a nationalism monopoly. 4 civs have steam power. Just to test the water I see if 279gpt buys us Nationalism. It doesn't. Ah yes our rep is shot. Forgot about that.
Set science to Medicine on single scientist. Better stop the short rushes if we need to buy tech with cash on the barrelhead.
880AD:
Quiet. I have about 25 Cavalry now. Another 10 and I'll risk it for a Swiss Kit.
IBT:
The Japanese destroy the Germans.
890AD:
Persia loses it's 2 luxes from us. Shame.
Probably declare next turn or the one after. Not nearly enough troops, but still.
900AD:
Decided to force the Persian border back a bit with a new city.
I don't think we are ready for war yet. Perhaps another 10 Cavalry and we can try it. We should use cannon for Susa. It's on a hill. We can back out of war of course. It's up to you lot. Maybe another 5 to 10 turns concerted military build up will do it. The elite MW's we have should be upgraded I think. They are too week defensively to be much use except pillaging and capturing workers. From experience they will end up away from the stack and get murdered by immortals. I would feel more comfortable with more cannon too, but beggars can't be choosers.
Nice trading! I agree with trying to expand a bit more. 
We do however also need to hurt our culture competitors (=Japan) a some stage.
Am I up now, or is it Kaiser_Berger?
We do however also need to hurt our culture competitors (=Japan) a some stage.Am I up now, or is it Kaiser_Berger?
Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
Actually, checking back through who has last played, I think it falls to Bedhead, then me, then you Space. Although whoever can get to it should feel free to, given the pace this one has moved at.
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If we can take out Persia and Rome then our cultural rate will get high enough. It will be more likely we need to stop a space ship build.
Without more land we cannot hope to get 100K. We have 2 decent enough cores. We just need to play for the long haul and spend some shields on courts and aqueducts whilst steadily increasing our military strength.
We should also build some muskets for the cannon and cavalry to stand on. Better we lose muskets than cannon and Cavalry.
Our military is Average with the Egyptians now, and I am hoping that most of Persias unit support quota is taken up with immortals.
I'm sure we could take out four cities now including Pasargadae which is full of wonders and Persepolis. However I think we would be in trouble after that. With rails down the immortals can get to the cavalry and it would be a mess. We need to be very tidy and sacrifice a little speed in return for surviveability. Once Pasargadae is captured we will have Sun Tzus and conquest should speed up.
I would be against building any more culture for cultures sake for the moment. Lets get some more land first. If we can get to 700cpt I should think it will be sufficient. The internet will speed things up also.
I just worry about a space ship.
Without more land we cannot hope to get 100K. We have 2 decent enough cores. We just need to play for the long haul and spend some shields on courts and aqueducts whilst steadily increasing our military strength.
We should also build some muskets for the cannon and cavalry to stand on. Better we lose muskets than cannon and Cavalry.
Our military is Average with the Egyptians now, and I am hoping that most of Persias unit support quota is taken up with immortals.
I'm sure we could take out four cities now including Pasargadae which is full of wonders and Persepolis. However I think we would be in trouble after that. With rails down the immortals can get to the cavalry and it would be a mess. We need to be very tidy and sacrifice a little speed in return for surviveability. Once Pasargadae is captured we will have Sun Tzus and conquest should speed up.
I would be against building any more culture for cultures sake for the moment. Lets get some more land first. If we can get to 700cpt I should think it will be sufficient. The internet will speed things up also.
I just worry about a space ship.
I know that we don't have to worry about the AI getting to 100k first, BUT I would hate to see us having to play extra turns after we've reached 100k just because we haven't doubled that of the AI. Since Japan is so remote this will not happen 'automatically' through our queste for more land.
Northern Pike
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I'm glad we hit the Magnetism-ToG twofer on our last chance. 
I agree that we shouldn't start the war with Persia until we're satisfied with the state of our military. A late war is only late until it starts, but a lost war is lost forever.
I agree that we shouldn't start the war with Persia until we're satisfied with the state of our military. A late war is only late until it starts, but a lost war is lost forever.
We need some more buildup first anyway, bed_head, so that's OK. I don't think Persia is the one MB worries about when he sees foreign Spaceships, England is the one to fear when it comes to that. I do understand, though, that you'd like to give the Death or Glory game proirity... 
(No offense, Gator )
(No offense, Gator )
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Ten turns of buildup is OK. Short rush Cavalry with Muskets and Muskets with longbows. Another 5 Muskets and 15 cavalry in 10 turns should be OK. If you can get a few more cannon too then so much the better. I ran some numbers through a combat calculator for a city on a hill with 5 vet Rifles. It aint pretty. We will probably lose around 6 Cavalry. Take a few HP off with cannon and its a different story.
...and yes. I assume Persia and Rome will be dead as dirt by the modern age. England and Japan could get to space and they are neighbours so it is difficult to disrupt their trade. Could try an embargo. On the upside, stealing from either would be OK since they are so remote - once we have railed.
...and yes. I assume Persia and Rome will be dead as dirt by the modern age. England and Japan could get to space and they are neighbours so it is difficult to disrupt their trade. Could try an embargo. On the upside, stealing from either would be OK since they are so remote - once we have railed.
I didn't expect 10 cav and some muskets and cannons to take 10 turns. I was seeing myself declare war right about the time when mad-bax would have handed it off had he finished his 10.
And as far being in competition with other games, yesterday I was up in 0 games, today 6, so it isn't just Death or Glory that is requiring my attention. To be honest, it is my own game at Sid that has me most wanting to play, as we have finally gotten to the point in the industrial age where all of the AI don't know all visible techs, something which hasn't been true since late ancient age.
And as far being in competition with other games, yesterday I was up in 0 games, today 6, so it isn't just Death or Glory that is requiring my attention. To be honest, it is my own game at Sid that has me most wanting to play, as we have finally gotten to the point in the industrial age where all of the AI don't know all visible techs, something which hasn't been true since late ancient age.
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