GR23 - AWDG vs 30 Civs

[I. Larkin]

Before Incenses connected optimal size for fast research is 4. Later on 5. Also Units will coast upkeep money soon. Trouble is that there is no road NW yet and to stay "compact" we have to delay with 3d town. Why not to make Archer instead Spear?

 

[Northern Pike]

We're unlikely to cut more than a few turns off the maximum fifty for IW no matter what we do, so optimal size for unit production--meaning a 5 --> 7 cycle at Rome--is what matters, not optimal size for research. In fact, in a solo game I'd probably min-research IW and hope to do something useful with the gold saved later, though that's never been our approach as a team.

We need a spearman so that our strike force can be fairly safe from attack as long as it stays on hills.

 

[Northern Pike]

Let me put my point above more forcefully. I'm not an expert on research rates on a map of this size, but I strongly suspect that we'd be better off min-researching IW and hoarding gold for warrrior --> Legionary upgrades than spending every penny we have to cut a handful of turns off our research time.

 

[Greebley]

Very likely true. The science rate is very slow in this game - slower than huge maps. We almost certainly will take more than 40 turns. It is one thing that makes these games harder - you can't instantly jump to Legions.

 

[vmxa]

Well you cannot make a dent in research till you have 3 towns or more anyway. Research rate is 650, rather than the 400 for a huge map. Our neighbors will be in war endlessly so they will be making units and slow research ever further.

 

[ThERat]

I would finish the spear and then go for a settler. We will need spears regardless anyway as archers are lousy at defense.

Maybe it is right to send out a warrior/archer combo for recon reasons so that we know what we face.

In the meantime, we can expand towards France so that attacks will be easier eventually. I agree on going after France so that they slow down. Taking out settler pairs is ideal as we have a severe lack of workers early on as usual.

Research will go down once we have more than 3 towns settled and grown. Rememeber that we need masonry before heading for literature. We also need to think early about a potential Blib site. Veii looks pretty promising in this respect as it is shielded from the enemy as well.

 

[vmxa]

We will sorely miss the free slaves of the JT. Now if only the Legion could gets slaves, we could forget about worker problem, well I can dream can't I?

We will be short handed for a very long time though, so that is just the way it is in these game. It is feast or famine for workers. Once we start razing lots of cities, we wil have more slaves than anyone wants to manage.

 

[I. Larkin]

0 2150*BC Reduce Sci to 10% hit Enter.
IBT Spear->Archer., McMg 6+6+8.
1 2110*BC Decided that EW + EA +VA have good
chances on hills; leave Spear in Rome. Move Stack North
IBT ZZZ
2 2070*BC Move Stack North
IBT ZZZ
3 2030*BC Move Stack North Send Spear behind.
IBT ZZZ
4 1990*BC
IBT
ZZZ??
5 1950*BC
IBT ZZZ
6 1910*BC
Move Stack North
IBT Frnch S/S pair come from North.
7 1870*BC Move Stack to pair.
IBT French form City.
8 1830*BC Destroy City with E Archer.
Move rest of Stack North. French have IW and agree to give City for peace.
Pull Spear back as we need to cover Settler.
IBT Settler -> Archer. Lower Lux, McMg for 7 spt.
9 1790*BC Heal E Archer, EW looks around carefully. Settler NW
IBT ZZZ
10 1750*BC Move WW North and spot French border.
Settler NW, Spear fortifies on M.
There many options to regroupe troops at "pre-turn, next player decide.

 

[Northern Pike]

French has IW and agree to give City for peace.

In case anyone's wondering, this is just a statement of what the French would give for peace--IL didn't make peace.

I've got it.

 

[vmxa]

To bad they settled, we could use the slaves.

 

[Northern Pike]

View attachment GR23-1500BC.SAV, end of turn

 

[Northern Pike]

1750 (0): Veii spearman --> worker.

The Persians build the Colossus.


1725 (1): Not much.


1700 (2): We found Antium on the river 3 NW of Rome.


1675 (3): Our modest strike force discovers wines eleven tiles NNE of Rome.

Our strike force is lucky, given its lack of a spearman, to repel the attack of a French archer (1-0).

Veii worker --> spearman.


1650 (4): Rome archer --> settler.


1625 (5): Our strike force is next to Lyons, but with the town having just rushed a spearman for a garrison of at least two I'm not going to attack. I'd rather keep our units alive to prey on settlers and other easy targets. For the moment, we pillage a wines tile.


1600 (6): Our strike force picks off a French archer in the open (2-0).


1575 (7): The strike force rebuffs the attack of another archer (3-0).


1550 (8): Rome settler --> spearman.


1525 (9): Veii spearman --> archer.


1500 (10): Three elite victories this round, two of them defensive, didn't produce a Great Leader.

Our settler should found a city at site 1 on the screenshot, after which we can settle site 2 at some point. This won't bring the cow within our borders immediately, but to do that we'd have to accept CxxxC or various other inefficiencies.

There's a French archer on the tile NE-N of our strike force (FA on the screenshot). I didn't want to attack it where we'd be subject to a counterattack by units using roads, but it'll probably move to where we can safely destroy it this IT.

 

[Northern Pike]

No-man's land:

 

[vmxa]

Two lux in sight, not bad, if we can hold them.

 

[Greebley]

I am hoping we can do some kind of attack soon. Of course just threatening cities can cause them to rush units and keep the city from other stuff, but taking out cities is best.

We likely want a Spear or two with the stack as the AI is more likely to ignore it.

I urge this based on the high level deity and demigod games of the past - the AI grows faster than the player so if you wait too long, the AI is established and is sending streams of units that make attacks extremely difficult. Attacks before the streams of units can really mean a lot of help. Letting the home defense deal with units while going after their cities also can work.

Roster:
Greebley
I.Larkin
Northern Pike - just played
M60A3TTS - up
vxma - on deck
ThERat
markh

 

[I. Larkin]

My Diety experience shows, that if stack like ours nearby AI at Despotism rush spears one by one, until City get size 1 and will produce nothing or very little because of opression. I think we may pull one spear back to Stack and just pillage around. That will make at least France weak.

 

[M60A3TTS]

I don't think moving the settler one more NE would do great harm. It would open up more BGs for Rome. Opinions?

 

[ThERat]

As it seems we do have some initial room for expansion, we should make use of that and move location 1 to NE and 2 N to get more space for our core. This would help in the long run for sure.

Once we have our UU, defense will be much easier.

 

[Northern Pike]

I don't think moving the settler one more NE would do great harm. It would open up more BGs for Rome. Opinions?

Sure, if we feel we can compromise on CxxC that's fine.

 

[I. Larkin]

I don't think moving the settler one more NE would do great harm. It would open up more BGs for Rome. Opinions?

Yes, also it may work on fish before culture expansion.