Has Microsoft stumbled?

[Mr.WorldWide]

MS continues in their shameless act of copying other successful companies such as Apple and Valve both in their UI and services.

As Steve Jobs once said: "Bill (Gates) is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology. He just shamelessly ripped off other people's ideas."

 

[civ_king]

MS continues in their shameless act of copying other successful companies such as Apple and Valve both in their UI and services.

As Steve Jobs once said: "Bill (Gates) is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology. He just shamelessly ripped off other people's ideas."

Indeed, Apple is the bestest company everer because it invented the GUI, amirite?

 

[Zelig]

MS continues in their shameless act of copying other successful companies such as Apple and Valve both in their UI and services.

As Steve Jobs once said: "Bill (Gates) is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology. He just shamelessly ripped off other people's ideas."

That certainly does not seem to be the case with iOS 7.

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

Indeed, Apple is the bestest company everer because it invented the GUI, amirite?

GUIs existed long before Apple did, actually. Xerox Alto, for instance. Imlac PDS-1.

 

[civ_king]

GUIs existed long before Apple did, actually. Xerox Alto, for instance. Imlac PDS-1.

Notice the words "bestest", "everer" and "amirite"

 

[Commodore]

Details are just that, details.
If it's not handled like a true purchase (i.e. I'm free to gift, sell, loan etc the thing as I please) I'm not willing to pay a fair purchasing price.

Worse, we're getting used to asinine limitations with godawful technical implications... a lot of hassle in modern tech stems from enforcing these restrictions (overcomplicated wrappers for the media, dodgy drivers trying to make sure you can't intercept data going to output devices to do with as you please...).

as for "robbing game developers"... by that reasoning, everytime you fix or sell something instead of throwing it away, you're robbing manufacturers. Every time you have sex without paying for it, you're robbing some poor little pimp and their associates. Every time you're helping someone for free, you're being an antisocial twit.

Except that software is not like any other purchase and never has been. Software has always had End User License Agreements attached to them. If you actually take the time to read the EULA, you would see that you do not "own" the software. All you do when you purchase software is buy the right to use that software according to the EULA.

In the past, the terms of the EULA were almost completely unenforcable. Now with the advances in technology, companies are now able to enforce the terms of the EULAs that have always existed. So really, you don't have the right to trade or resell the software you purchase. People just got away with it in the past because it could not be enforced.

I also don't see how it is considered greedy or unfair for game developers to ask for a percentage of used game revenue. I mean, are people trying to say that once a product has been sold once then the creator of that product all of a sudden loses their right to make money off that product? That once something becomes "used" the company that produced it is no longer entitled to any revenue generated from that product?

 

[Zelig]

I already posted by thoughts about used games in the OT thread.

In short, selling used digital goods is a derpy idea in the first place. I've got some lightly-used mp3s I haven't listened to in a while, who wants them?

 

[Iranon]

If what actually occurs is too far removed from a sale, the distribution and payment model should reflect that.
"Pay a purchasing price, get personal use of it for as long as the vendor consents" is unhealthy.

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

So really, you don't have the right to trade or resell the software you purchase. People just got away with it in the past because it could not be enforced.

Actually, I've seen EULAs that provide for reselling software. I think it's usually along the lines of you can sell it as long as you completely remove it from your computer, don't keep backups, etc.

 

[Commodore]

Actually, I've seen EULAs that provide for reselling software. I think it's usually along the lines of you can sell it as long as you completely remove it from your computer, don't keep backups, etc.

True. But whenever I discuss this topic with people (whether in real life or on the internet) I try to get them to realize that they do not own the software they purchase. Most people always say something along the lines of "well I bought it, it's mine so I can do what I want with it". While this is true with most products, it has never been true with software. As I stated before, we are just now entering a time when companies can actually enforce the EULAs, and I don't really see a problem with that. The terms of most EULAs are not that bad and actually allow the user a lot of freedom to use the product, but because it doesn't allow total freedom, people get all up-in-arms about it and scream about their rights as a consumer being violated.

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

Whats really fishy is that a lot of them say 'if you don't agree, return to the retailer for a full refund' and most retailers won't refund opened software so you're screwed out of the cost.

 

[Mr.WorldWide]

So I could resell an album I bought on vinyl but if I bought that exact same album via digital distribution I could never resell it. It's something of a paradox considering both formats contain the same content.

 

[Commodore]

Whats really fishy is that a lot of them say 'if you don't agree, return to the retailer for a full refund' and most retailers won't refund opened software so you're screwed out of the cost.

That is a problem with the retailers though, not a problem with the software developers. This is one of the many reasons I don't have a problem with Microsoft taking steps to cut the retailer out of the process completely.

 

[Zelig]

Man are they ever stumbling:

 

[Tommy Vercetti]

The start button is coming back but it is a short cut to the start screen. This is a step in the right direction but still not quite there yet. Also confirmed is an included option to boot to desktop. Now just bring back the start menu and they will have fixed the problems

 

[Zelig]

They haven't really changed anything, functionality is exactly the same.

1. With or without the start button, you click in the corner to bring up the start screen.
2. Booting to desktop saves you about 1 second per month.

Start menu is never coming back, I've already explained that.

 

[Tommy Vercetti]

They haven't really changed anything, functionality is exactly the same.

1. With or without the start button, you click in the corner to bring up the start screen.
2. Booting to desktop saves you about 1 second per month.

Start menu is never coming back, I've already explained that.

Poor sales could easily force Microsoft to bring it back.

 

[Zelig]

Poor sales could easily force Microsoft to bring it back.

Hypothetical poor sales could force any publicly traded company to do anything.

That's not particularly relevant to the discussion though. You obviously don't follow Microsoft very closely, but you can trust me when I tell you there's no chance of the start menu ever coming back.

 

[Tommy Vercetti]

Hypothetical poor sales could force any publicly traded company to do anything.

That's not particularly relevant to the discussion though. You obviously don't follow Microsoft very closely, but you can trust me when I tell you there's no chance of the start menu ever coming back.

A lot of people said that about the start button and it came back. If I recall correctly you said that a few times.

 

[Zelig]

A lot of people said that about the start button and it came back.

A lot of people? Link to one.

If I recall correctly you said that a few times.

You don't recall correctly, feel free to reread the thread.