How one stop being a flipfloper

[GenMarshall]

Certanly this is an issue that many people have struggled with. What I am wondering is how can a person stop being a flipfloper and stand their ground on certan issues. When ever I hear the world "flipfloper", it conjures up an image of a failed canidate, John Kerry. Certanly there would be a few people who do not want to be associated with the canidate.

I know that I am not alone on this, I do admit that I have a problem with flipfloping on certan stances, but its something that I want to work on and not be a flipfloper. Though the problem that I notice and this would be true with other flipflopers, is that if their issue they believe in is criticized, they would try to change their opinions just to please the other person. For me and perhaps other flipflopers who are tired of being called one and hearing "youre changing canoes midstream again?".

 

[El_Tigre]

Well, if you have a firm believe in an important issue, you should be able to
bear criticism, even if you face hostility. In such a case, it is certainly
admissible to say "We have different opinions, lets just agree to disagree".

If the issue is less important to you, or you haven't made up your mind yet, I
think it's the best to take a step back and wait for the arguments of both
sides. It' not a disgrace to be undecided, but if you jump on the bandwagon
too quickly, you may have to flipflop later.

 

[DaveShack]

Here are some tips:

Have a reason for taking a position on an issue. If you can't come up with a reason, then question the position and see if you can come up with a reason to take the opposite position.

Don't take a position because it is popular, or you think it will make you win. If you have a good reason for your position (see #1) then it is perfectly acceptable to be right and in the minority, or to lose due to your position being unpopular. Sometimes you have to stand up for what you believe in, even though you know you'll get steamrollered.

If you need to change positions, don't make it obvious that you're changing because of others opinions or comments directed towards you. State the facts and analysis which caused you to change your mind. Others should respect that and see that you're not flip-flopping to follow public opinion, but altering your position because your understanding of the issue has changed.

 

[The Condor]

1) Before entering a debate thread make sure you have some articles and stuff supporting your cause before entering (store in a unnamed microsoft works or something). 2) Don't back down. That will only lead to them taking more advantage of you and thus more flipfloping and less of a stance. 3) Don't please other people, make them please you. Basically don't feel like you have to be friends with everyone because you will fail horribly like in civ4. Just find a group of people who share your ideas (and beliefs too maybe) and are trustworthy. 4) Make your comments intelligent and unique. Basically, read the thread from the beginning to the "end" so you don't repeat another persons statement. 5) If you don't feel you can stay on one side get out before you do more damage than good. Like in the movies hit the eject button.

I hope this helps you because it sure helped me.

 

[El_Tigre]

I dunno, Condor, it seems to me that your advice translates into the following:

1.) Drown your "enemy" with facts and trivia.
2.) Be bullheaded. Never give up, never surrender!
3.) Surround yourself with like-minded people to avoid arguments at all.
4.) Dazzle your opponent with witty and funny remarks.
5.) If you loose, run as fast as you can, otherwise you might learn something.

Why, you are the perfect rhetorician! You should definitly go into law!!

 

[A'AbarachAmadan]

It is good to be able to change ones views based upon facts presented. I do not have the same opinion on everything I did 10 years ago, or even 10 days ago. Experience and wisdom have changed my views over time, for better or worse. However, if you are doing a Kerry flip-flop thing then you need to reflect about what you believe and why before arguing for it. My momma always said I have two ears and one mouth so I'm supposed to listen (or read in this case) twice as much as I talk.

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Base your opinions on facts or on logic/ reasoning if there are no facts available. If you do this and you get to know new facts that go against your current opinion you can adjust or change it without being viewed as flip-flopper.

Or: Be really stubborn and convinced about your "gut-feelings", don´t even think of reviewing and reflecting yourself, evidence opposing your views should be viewed as fabricated or simply false, ect. The dangers here are that it is difficult to maintain consistency between yout pov´s and that people who know facts and can reason can make you look stupid (and will).

Whatever path you take, public opinion should never ever be an issue for your opinion.

 

[Rik Meleet]

Changing your opinion is not a bad thing.
However, speaking before you have an opinion is not a smart thing to do.

 

[The Yankee]

Certanly this is an issue that many people have struggled with. What I am wondering is how can a person stop being a flipfloper and stand their ground on certan issues. When ever I hear the world "flipfloper", it conjures up an image of a failed canidate, John Kerry. Certanly there would be a few people who do not want to be associated with the canidate.

I know that I am not alone on this, I do admit that I have a problem with flipfloping on certan stances, but its something that I want to work on and not be a flipfloper. Though the problem that I notice and this would be true with other flipflopers, is that if their issue they believe in is criticized, they would try to change their opinions just to please the other person. For me and perhaps other flipflopers who are tired of being called one and hearing "youre changing canoes midstream again?".

Is being a "flip flopper" such an evil thing anyway? Are we doomed to stick to our guns no matter what and never change our minds? Why do we even bother debating here, then?

You, I, and everyone else here have changed their minds countless times on countless things. We are all flip floppers, like it or not. It's just a catch-phrase from a campaign that seems so distant today.

 

[Kayak]

Changing your opinion is not a bad thing.
However, speaking before you have an opinion is not a smart thing to do.

I think this depends on why you changed your opinion. If it is merely to conform with the group around you that is bad.
If you speak before you have any facts, you should qualify your remarks, or it should be a question

 

[sanabas]

Think for yourself. Simple.

Actually justify the opinion you hold, even if it's only justifying it to yourself. It's much easier to discard an unjustified opinion on something.

Instead of simply basing your opinion on what someone else says, what the church says, or the last vaguely believable thing you heard on the topic, base your opinion on thinking for yourself. No problem using other people's thoughts too, but blind acceptance of them is just as stupid as blind non-acceptance. Think about other people's opinions, decide if they actually make sense, then choose whether to agree or not.

If your opinion is demonstrably wrong, then what's the problem with changing it?

@The Condor: I don't think I've seen you bother with actually debating in any thread, but since you've advanced an opinion on it: What do you see as the purpose of debating something in a thread is? Show other people how smart you are? Change other people's minds on a topic? Learn something on a topic yourself? Something different?

 

[MamboJoel]

Changing your opinion (not to please others) is a mature act. Besides, you'd prefere not having a strict opinion on a complex issue than blindly supporting an option to avoid looking flipfloper.

 

[PrinceOfLeigh]

I agree with everyone who said that changing your mind is no bad thing. Politicians have to be more stubborn with their point of view since you don't want to vote one guy in for a policy which he later decides he no longer likes. Having said that, if a Politician did 'flipflop' but gave thoughtful reasoning why, I'd think better of him.

There is no shame in admitting you were wrong and no pride lost in changing your mind after hearing an elequent alternative argument. Sticking to your guns in the light of all evidence to the contrary makes you an idiot. Or religous.

 

[IglooDame]

I think the root cause of being a flipflopper (as an internet forum poster, not as a politician) is having positions based on emotions, transient circumstances, or anecdotal evidence rather than on logic, core beliefs, or solid statistics. I don't know that there's anyone in OT that isn't in the minority on some position or other at some point. However, the sharks only start circling when their position is readily assailable or self-contradicting.

 

[El_Machinae]

I would recommend looking at the various logical fallacies, and then make sure your opinions aren't spoiled by them.

Having an opinion because of anecdotal evidence is not wrong, but people should be prepared to accept better authorities on a subject. If you have a 'gut feeling' regarding one opinion, it's best if you can vocalize it.

It's good to have solid opinions, but it's better to have well-reasoned opinions.

It also comes with experience. I sometimes engage in debates that I've settled (from myself) 5 or ten years ago, but my opponent has to think like mad to keep up.

 

[The Condor]

I dunno, Condor, it seems to me that your advice translates into the following:

1.) Drown your "enemy" with facts and trivia.
2.) Be bullheaded. Never give up, never surrender!
3.) Surround yourself with like-minded people to avoid arguments at all.
4.) Dazzle your opponent with witty and funny remarks.
5.) If you loose, run as fast as you can, otherwise you might learn something.

Why, you are the perfect rhetorician! You should definitly go into law!!

Well my dad was a lawyer (retired)....

@Sanabas read that "should ai have rights?" one I argued with perf for a while.

 

[Perfection]

It's quite easy. Just agree unquestionably with whatever I say. My views are fairly stable, so if you do that, you won't flip-flop.

 

[SomethingWitty]

You really think of Kerry?

Because every time I hear "flip-flopping" I keep thinking of hypocracy and the Republican party.

 

[nonconformist]

Only believe in something you believe in with all your heart.

If presented with facts proving your assertations wrong, always be sure to re-exmine your position, and if needs be, change it (As AbarachAmadan has done for me)

Only a fool never changes his ideas.

If you find something you don't really believe in, have no opinion about it (I'm a devout left-winger, but I don't really have any idea about free-trade/protectionism, so I jsut don't care)

Have your own ideas, not those that others wish you to have, or those that you need to colour yourself.

 

[Whomp]

Only believe in something you believe in with all your heart.

If presented with facts proving your assertations wrong, always be sure to re-exmine your position, and if needs be, change it (As AbarachAmadan has done for me)

Only a fool never changes his ideas.

If you find something you don't really believe in, have no opinion about it (I'm a devout left-winger, but I don't really have any idea about free-trade/protectionism, so I jsut don't care)

Have your own ideas, not those that others wish you to have, or those that you need to colour yourself.

Noncom.
These are the colors... black, white and gray. Every opinion you have should start out gray until you have your information and belief. Then back it up.