ImmacuNES III: Post-Apocalyptic Fantasy

[hbar]

Hey, welcome Darksaber! Good to have another lurker join the fun.

 

[Seon]

Darksaber, we need to discuss plans. NOW.

Do you have MSN, btw?

 

[Seon]

Darksaber, perhaps a discussion about the undead is necessary?

 

[Immaculate]

So, here comes the nerf bat. It affects everyone starting NEXT turn.

1) trade goods produced from plantations and commercial mines are no longer affected by the fertility or productivity of the tile. If coffee grows on mountains, it shouldn't be affected negatively for not being on lowland. same for diamonds in arctic plains- just look at Canadian diamonds near yellowknife.

2) the fertility/productivity of a tile will produce only X^.75 of the value it once did. This will have the effect of reducing the massive bonus certain players are experiencing from being surrounded by rivers and much better terrain then others. I know some of you will be hit by this harder then others but those are also the players that due to random luck during placement that got really good starting spots. Be happy its not retroactive and enjoy the bonus you got for 6 turns already.

3) the last one was developed by an outsider (who will remain nameless so you don't all hate him)

Markets, ports, caravansari, etc. have a formula that goes up with the square root of the trade stat and linearly in the amount of trade goods. I think that is backwards - it is much easier to get trade goods then to get trade stats. 10h for 3 trade goods (com. mine) versus 25h minimum for trade stat (market). By reversing the formula (market example: gold = tradeStat * sqrt( tradeGoods ) I think you can slow things down without bringing the nerfstick too hard.

so thats what we'll do.

and a bonus:

1) foundries, black-smithies, mills, lighthouses and workshops will get a bonus. i havn't figured out how to code the effect i want though, so the exact mechanics of the bonus are not yet figured out yet.

 

[Ekolite]

Ouch.

Seems to me that good terrain should be much better then bad terrain. That's why it's good terrain.

 

[Immaculate]

it still is MUCH better.... just not grotesquely so.

ekolite, we had a player who figured out how to go from 10g to 100g in 4 turns. something had to be done.

 

[Tyrs]

Hmm. Well, as one of those people who didn't get awesome starting terrain and a horde of trade goods... I can't really complain too much, haha. And no. I'm not clever enough to notice something like that formula do-hicky, so "not it" on the whistler.

 

[Ekolite]

How was that done? Involving high population trade goods resource improvements and markets?

 

[Immaculate]

yup

trade was overpowered. good thing we weren't into it too heavily (yet). the effect will be to still give a good bonus for developing it but also give a bit of diminishing returns compared to what was originaly designed.

 

[Ekolite]

Well why should that affect the hammer and food output of fertility and ore? Seems like the problem us with trade..?

 

[Immaculate]

extrapolate your stats to turn 12. you could buy every unit on the list in one turn (if you had the research done).

i'm not trying to diminish the differences between strong and weak nations. they will both be affected RELATIVELY equally. the difference will be between each successive turns; its meant to slow player progression a bit.

 

[Kyzarc Fotjage]

Ah, I was wondering why I wasn't getting the 50 hammers that applying my orders to last turn's stats predicted. Could you redo the census thingy since all that information just got heavily reduced?

 

[Immaculate]

Ah, I was wondering why I wasn't getting the 50 hammers that applying my orders to last turn's stats predicted. Could you redo the census thingy since all that information just got heavily reduced?

the stats you got do not yet reflect the changes proposed. if you are missing hammers (or anything else), its because i made a mistake. Please point out what you think i forgot and i can try to either explain the difference or fix it. i do make (many) mistakes.

 

[Ekolite]

extrapolate your stats to turn 12. you could buy every unit on the list in one turn (if you had the research done).

i'm not trying to diminish the differences between strong and weak nations. they will both be affected RELATIVELY equally. the difference will be between each successive turns; its meant to slow player progression a bit.

In which case you might want to consider adjusting prices and not resources in the future. That way it really will be fair on all players.

 

[hbar]

In which case you might want to consider adjusting prices and not resources in the future. That way it really will be fair on all players.

I disagree with this. Shifting prices just moves from "The rich can buy everything" to "only the rich can buy anything". The difference between 10g and 100g is not something that can be smoothed over with price adjustment. If a unit of spearmen costs 10g, player A can buy one and player B can buy 10. If a unit of heavy spearmen costs 100g, player A is screwed and player B is not.

 

[Immaculate]

prices do not scale up quickly enough - i agree.... this may be something else to look at. i had considered this. maybe i should look at it again.

the solution considered for the plantations/commercial mines may not work as easily as i had considered. i need to crunch more numbers

 

[hbar]

So, here comes the nerf bat. It affects everyone starting NEXT turn.

1) trade goods produced from plantations and commercial mines are no longer affected by the fertility or productivity of the tile. If coffee grows on mountains, it shouldn't be affected negatively for not being on lowland. same for diamonds in arctic plains- just look at Canadian diamonds near yellowknife.

Can we get a hard number or example of this? I'd like to know how much my industries are worth before I invest in them.

2) the fertility/productivity of a tile will produce only X^.75 of the value it once did. This will have the effect of reducing the massive bonus certain players are experiencing from being surrounded by rivers and much better terrain then others. I know some of you will be hit by this harder then others but those are also the players that due to random luck during placement that got really good starting spots. Be happy its not retroactive and enjoy the bonus you got for 6 turns already.

Is this as simple a change as placing a '^0.75' after wherever fertility and/or ore show up in the yield calculator?

3) the last one was developed by an outsider (who will remain nameless so you don't all hate him)

so thats what we'll do.


and a bonus:

1) foundries, black-smithies, mills, lighthouses and workshops will get a bonus. i havn't figured out how to code the effect i want though, so the exact mechanics of the bonus are not yet figured out yet.

Again, any chance we can get a peek at what you're planning so we can decry the unfairness of it all?

These changes taken together kind of crush my economy - on the other hand, I wouldn't want your job of balancing everything in the first place. So long as it makes the game more fun, I'm all for changes.

 

[Immaculate]

okay, i need to play with numbers a lot more

everything i said is not rule yet.

All i can say for now is that there WILL be changes. i will post a new template for people to play with and hopefully i can send you new stats. Remember, none of these changes come into play this turn anyway.

 

[Darksaber1]

Darksaber, perhaps a discussion about the undead is necessary?

OOC: No, I don't have MSN, but a planning session via PM would be very useful. I can't say more at this time, as I don't have my stats yet.

 

[Immaculate]

you should have your stats now.

EDIT: i sent them to the 'ontera' address.