India

[FishFishFish]

Ahmednagar is the best option of Decan Plateau. The other options are Barar, Bidar, Bijapur and Golkonda but they don't have an amazing leader as Malik Ambar.

The Pallavas, Satavahana, Vakataka, Chalukya, Rashtrakuta, Vijayanagara and Maratha empires all originated from Deccan and would be much better choices.

 

[Henri Christophe]

That's the Deccan Plateau, specifically, in the 15th Century. Not that representative, all-in-all. And I was never a fan of the inclusion of Bolivar and Gran Colombia. I always felt the Muisca would have been much more intriguing for the slot. And how, exactly, is Malik Ambar so, "amazing?" In a way that would captivate more than just you, basically?

I know you don't like Simon Bolivar, that is the why I give him as an example. Because just if you don't like a civ it don't means other players don't will like him.
I should be cool with Muiscas too, but speaking of achivements, Simon Bolivar is more amazing than the Muiscas. I would like to see a leader of Muiscas full of gold, because the legend of El Dorado. But I know Fireaxis like to be historical acurated and will design a Muisca leader with just a few gold
adornment.

I already shared some videos about how amazing Malik Ambar was, please check it out.

And until now just you (Patine) and Fishfishfish don't like the idea of Malik Ambar, let's wait other users cast their opnion too

 

[Patine]

And until now just you (Patine) and Fishfishfish don't like the idea of Malik Ambar, let's wait other users cast their opnion too

You are, once again, implying that no comment is, by default, a, "positive response." Like you tantamount to did with Tupac Yanaqui. This Malik Ambar got one vote in the poll, and I'd be willing to wager heavily it was YOU...

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

About Mughal/India issue. I hope one replaces the another because of the name of cities problem. They share the same range of cities. If I would choice one of they, I would choice the Mughal (because I believe India should be replaced by others states and Gandhi should never more appear in this game).
Mughal, Ahmednagar and Chola empire can fullfill very well all India sub-continent. And I think 3 Civs in Vanila edition should be great, the others Indians civilizations can appear after the DLCs.

Not necessarily true. Agra during the Mughal Empire was called Akbarabad, which could be the name used for the Mughal civ. Honestly if you decide to split India up into about 3 or 4 civs you are going to run into the same problem, but much worse than what I suggested.

India have too many religions and to please all players is needed more than just 3 civs. Maybe the buddhist kingdom should be Bactria (the Greeks of India). So in the end it is
Maurya empire lead by Chandra Gupta - Jain
Bactria lead by Demetrius I - Buddhist
Ahmednagar lead by Malik Ambar - Muslim
Chola lead by Vijayalaya - Hindu

I don't understand why you complain about too many Hellenistic Greek civilizations but then decide to add in Bactria?

And until now just you (Patine) and Fishfishfish don't like the idea of Malik Ambar, let's wait other users cast their opnion too

I don't either, so please add me to that list.

 

[Henri Christophe]

Maurya empire lead by Chandra Gupta - Jain
Bactria lead by Demetrius I - Buddhist
Ahmednagar lead by Malik Ambar - Muslim
Chola lead by Vijayalaya - Hindu

I have one question to you (Patine), in my list I put also Bactria which is a small state lead also by a forigner (the greeks) and you was just mad with Ahmednagar, why this selective behaviour?

I don't understand why you complain about to many Hellenistic Greek civilizations but then decide to add in Bactria?

I was just writing about this issue just now. I don't have problems with the Greeks, I just don't like how they was overrepresented in Civ 6. 5 leaders is too much, But if Greeks just have the Alexander the Great and Cleoptra of Egypt, they can have more states as Bactria.

I don't either, so please add me to that list.

Okay so, it is now 3x1. I hope more users cast their opnion about that.

 

[Yudhisthira]

Nationalistic tendencies aside, I consider the Mughal legacy to also be linked to nations such as Pakistan, and even more importantly Afghanistan, which is why I think they could possibly exist outside of the sphere of even the abstraction of India.

That's actually very nationalistic & erroneous take.

 

[Henri Christophe]

That's actually very nationalistic & erroneous take.

Cool, an Indian here.
Let me ask to you, what is your opnion about Malik Ambar leads the Ahmednagar Sultanate in Civ7?

 

[BuchiTaton]

- MAURYA: Classical, northeast and buddhism focus.
- CHOLA: Medieval, south and hindu focus.
- GURKANI: Modern, northwest and islam focus.

That's actually very nationalistic & erroneous take.

Is a practical take, Gurkani have well know leaders that were born (some also buried) and had imperial capitals outside of contemporary India, if their civ on game is named either Gurkani or Mughals NOT Pakistan/Afghanistan there would be nothing nationalist related on it.
This is the easiest civ to split off from India since their early core is now outside India. Again the civ would not be named Pakistan so no complaints because neither Pakistan or India should claim to be the only Gurkani/Mughals.

 

[Patine]

I have one question to you (Patine), in my list I put also Bactria which is a small state lead also by a forigner (the greeks) and you was just mad with Ahmednagar, why this selective behaviour?

Once again, you're conflating lack of comment with a default, "positive response," and this time using it to disingenuously allege me of a double standard and, "selective behaviour." I have not spoken on Bactria, and, like Ahmednagar, I believe they are a minor bit player worthy of city-state status, at best. Please, do not put words in my mouth of support I have not given to make false accusations of my intentions.

 

[Yudhisthira]

Cool, an Indian here.
Let me ask to you, what is your opnion about Malik Ambar leads the Ahmednagar Sultanate in Civ7?

You actually have asked this question to me before & my reply remains the same. Malik Ambar, no doubt, is very interesting personality but I don't see Ahmednagar Sultanate as civ material.

 

[Yudhisthira]

Is a practical take, Gurkani have well know leaders that were born (some also buried) and had imperial capitals outside of contemporary India, if their civ on game is named either Gurkani or Mughals NOT Pakistan/Afghanistan there would be nothing nationalist related on it.
This is the easiest civ to split off from India since their early core is now outside India. Again the civ would not be named Pakistan so no complaints because neither Pakistan or India should claim to be the only Gurkani/Mughals.

Again we have gone through much debate regarding this. As I have said before, I certainly see Mughal or other Indo-Islamic empires as civ material in game framework but the arguments which are made to exclusively connect them with Pakistan/Afghanistan/Bangadesh are wrong on many level.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Again we have gone through much debate regarding this. As I have said before, I certainly see Mughal or other Indo-Islamic empires as civ material in game framework but the arguments which are made to exclusively connect them with Pakistan/Afghanistan/Bangadesh are wrong on many level.

Sorry if I offended you. @BuchiTaton explained it better than I did.
Yes I did mean that a Mughal civ city list could also spread into as far north of Afghanistan, considering Kabul was a major in the empire.

 

[Henri Christophe]

You actually have asked this question to me before & my reply remains the same. Malik Ambar, no doubt, is very interesting personality but I don't see Ahmednagar Sultanate as civ material.
View attachment 622696

Ohh sorry to question it again, I didn't remember to quest it in the another thread.
But for me Ahmednagar is in my top list of Sultanates of India. I made this thread most to speak about they, but unfortunelly the community don't like my ideas.

But I still seeing civ material to Ahmednagar, they have an amazing leader, a list of cities and can have war elephants as Unique Unit. They have more material than others requested civs as the Olmecs.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Ohh sorry to question it again, I didn't remember to quest it in the another thread.
But for me Ahmednagar is in my top list of Sultanates of India. I made this thread most to speak about they, but unfortunelly the community don't like my ideas.

But I still seeing civ material to Ahmednagar, they have an amazing leader, a list of cities and can have war elephants as Unique Unit. They have more material than others requested civs as the Olmecs.

Considering the Mughals and the Delhi Sultanate have also never been in civ, and were definitely bigger and more influential on the Indian Subcontinent, that's why it's' an unpopular opinion. And yes I'd personally rather see these two along with the Maurya, or Chola, before the Ahmednagar at least.

Speaking about unpopular opinions, it seems I have one myself though.
Which is the only one that I actually voted for is the Mughals. As I've said before they are one of the only ones that i can see that could easily separate themselves, and even coexist, alongside an Indian civ.

That being said my top leader that I would want is Ashoka. I honestly wouldn't care if they also continued to call the civ called India though, but at the same time they could easily just call it the Mauryan Empire as well. Either way I'd still also want a separate Mughal civ too alongside India, or Maurya.

 

[Henri Christophe]

Considering the Mughals and the Delhi Sultanate have also never been in civ, and were definitely bigger and more influential on the Indian Subcontinent, that's why it's' an unpopular opinion. And yes I'd personally rather see these two along with the Maurya, or Chola, before the Ahmednagar at least.

I agree the Mughals and Delhi Sultanate are more important then Ahmednagar. But despite this I believe Ahmednagar can appear at least in one DLC. After of Mughals, Maurya and Chola (That I agree are more important). But a slave who become sultan is something very unique and deserve his space in this game.
Other small civ that I want to see is Bactria, is very amazing a Greek-Indo-Buddhist empire. Maybe both (Bactria and Ahmednagar) can appear together in a late DLC.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I agree the Mughals and Delhi Sultanate are more important then Ahmednagar. But despite this I believe Ahmednagar can appear at least in one DLC. After of Mughals, Maurya and Chola (That I agree are more important). But a slave who become sultan is something very unique and deserve his space in this game.
Other small civ that I want to see is Bactria, is very amazing a Greek-Indo-Buddhist empire. Maybe both (Bactria and Ahmednagar) can appear together in a late DLC.

Honestly, I think expecting 3 or more civs from the Indian subcontinent is expecting too much, considering we've yet to see India split up yet. I think most people can agree on a split of at least two, from Firaxis for Civ 7, would be a win.

 

[dagriggstar]

My choices would be based more around what the other civ-choices are.
For instance, if we have seafaring Indonesia (Sri Vijaya), then I prefer the Vijayanagara, but if there is no seafaring Indonesia then I prefer the Chola. There's just a lot you can do with India.
I think one Northern and one Southern Indian empire would be a good split geographically. Then also have the two be from differing time periods as well.

 

[BuchiTaton]

My choices would be based more around what the other civ-choices are.
For instance, if we have seafaring Indonesia (Sri Vijaya), then I prefer the Vijayanagara, but if there is no seafaring Indonesia then I prefer the Chola. There's just a lot you can do with India.
I think one Northern and one Southern Indian empire would be a good split geographically. Then also have the two be from differing time periods as well.

Indonesian empires were about direct conquest and incorporation while oversea Chola was more about client states, so Indonesia could be more militar focused and Chola diplomacy and culture related.

 

[Henri Christophe]

Indonesian empires were about direct conquest and incorporation while oversea Chola was more about client states, so Indonesia could be more militar focused and Chola diplomacy and culture related.

But still, both (Indonesia and Chola) should have some Naval Unit as Unique Unit.

 

[FishFishFish]

My choices would be based more around what the other civ-choices are.
For instance, if we have seafaring Indonesia (Sri Vijaya), then I prefer the Vijayanagara, but if there is no seafaring Indonesia then I prefer the Chola. There's just a lot you can do with India.
I think one Northern and one Southern Indian empire would be a good split geographically. Then also have the two be from differing time periods as well.

We could also apply this to religion as well. If we are unable to get a Muslim civ in India, it would be nice to get a Muslim Indonesian leader or Malaysia led by a Malaccan sultan instead.

Hopefully we get a Muslim civ outside of the Middle East and Africa for once.