IOT Developmental Thread

[JohannaK]

*raises hand*

 

[christos200]

-A. A game EXACTLY like MP1. All the broken mechanics included. Be peaceful, be mean, show restraint or zerg across Asia like Genghis Khan Christos Xinjiang. Destroy opponents with a few carefully-executed espionage missions. Major NPCs go to lunch on anyone who’s small around them, or even human players.

Fixed.

 

[Sonereal]

By this do you also mean a set number of attacks per turn? One of the biggest problems I've found in TanIOT wars is that you can't realistically manage multiple fronts, since the emphasis on wave tactics dictates that you either throw everything you've got at the front or risk the "defenders" grabbing your land if you lose.

You don't have to limit it to a set number of attacks, per say.

Using RIOT as an example, to attack, defend, launch a blockade, whatever, you have to invest LPs into the action. The more LPs you invest, the more successful the action is, the more powerful your forces, and the less casualties you sustain.

Everybody started off with 10 LP, meaning they could attack 10 on 10 different fronts with only 1 LP each, or they could do five with 2, three with three, one with four and defend with six, and so on.

After all, managing somebody attacking nine different individual provinces at the same time is difficult, hence why I like to compress things down to fronts. In one war in RIOT, there's a war that's been a one-front war for the last...eight years? Eight years, and that's barely gone anywhere. In another war, there were usually three or four different "fronts" each turn because there were so many axis of advance. If I could post an example map, I would, but the system works.

The player dynamic. I loved the history that built up, probably more so than any other TanIOT save possibly MTC. And that's something you're not gonna replicate with stats no matter how hard you try. What pissed me off about MP was that the broken ruleset wrecked immersion by facilitating nuclear powergaming and stupid wars &c. With the exception of one, maybe two people, I don't think anyone loved MP for its ruleset, and know quite a few that detested how the game was managed.

Which is why I was mystified by the number of people who actually want to replay MP1 as is. A bit of rose-tinted goggles we're all wearing because I distinctly remembered how much fun half of you weren't having at several points because you were on the receiving end on gamey tactics that didn't even exist before MP1.

 

[Arrow Gamer]

MPV and MPI both seem terrible. Just make a better version of MPIV.

You need war at lest as an option, albeit an expensive one. Just outlawing it outright seems terrible. Where are the stakes?

 

[Mosher]

And for my efforts, later games were deemed to not be as fun.

I found MP3 lots of fun.

 

[christos200]

MPIII was the best. Why not have both war and complex economics?

 

[Tyo]

MP3 and MP4 were the most fun I've had with the series, personally.

 

[Double A]

the games where I won were the best

 

[NinjaCow64]

Putting my hand up for the MP III/IV crowd. I had the most fun with MP IV, but I liked III better mechanically. I would dance the dance of joy if there was a rehash of III. Or even IV.

 

[Mosher]

I've been thinking of a somewhat war-focused game that featured a small number of total units, each customized with modules – there would be a set list to pick from, but you could also submit your own for approval – and create your own, customized and unique personal military. Here's an example of combat between two units, enhanced with modules, with my combat system. (There will be more unit types, but I only devised stats for two since they would be the only ones I'm using.)

Each individual module would, naturally, cost EP, dragging up the cost of your unit the more powerful you make it.

Unit Types:

Infantry
Shock Damage: 10
Damage: 10
Defense: 5
Speed: 1
Recon: 1
Discipline: 20%
Morale: 15/15
Health: 20/20

Armor
Shock Damage: 20
Damage: 15
Defense: 10
Speed: 2
Recon: 1
Discipline: 10%
Morale: 5/5
Health: 15/15



Combat

Combat is fairly simple. There are a few stats at play: Shock, Damage, Defense, Speed, Morale, Recon, and Health. Lets make a couple example units (an infantry and an armor) and have them fight, the armor attacking the infantry.

Note - +-all stats does not include speed, recon, or discipline.

Unit Name: Vanguard
Unit Type: Infantry
Modules: Well Disciplined (+10 Morale, +5 Shock, +20% discipline)
Sturdy Equipment (+5 all stats, +1 to speed, +1 to recon)
Medic Corps (+10 Health, +5 Defense)

Shock Damage: 20
Damage: 15
Defense: 15
Speed: 2
Recon: 2
Discipline: 30%
Morale: 30/30
Health: 35/35

vs.

Unit Name: Light Scout
Unit Type: Armor
Modules: Light Armor (+2 to speed, +4 to recon, -10 all other stats, -5% discipline)
Sturdy Equipment (+5 all stats, +1 to speed, +1 to recon)
Experienced (+5 all stats except Health, +1 to speed, +1 to recon)
Shock Damage: 20
Damage: 25
Defense: 10
Speed: 6
Recon: 7
Discipline: 5%
Morale: 5/5
Health: 10/10

Now is the opening phase of the fight. To determine who fires first, we compare speed stats: 6 v. 2. It's obvious that the Light Scout is faster than the infantry, and thus gets the first strike. Before we do that, though, we compare Recon scores: 7 v. 2. Recon gives a bonus equal to the range of the two scores to the one with the greatest recon (so, in this case, the Light Armor gets a +50% bonus to its Shock, Damage, and Defense, making them all 30, 37.5, and 15 respectively). Here is where terrain would factor into the battle, but to simplify things, we're not going to include it.

Here is the Shock phase. Shock damage damages morale, which will force a unit to flee the battle (losing 25% of its remaining health in the process of retreat) when it reaches 0 or below. Shock damage is mitigated by the discipline stat – 10% discipline means a 10% reduction in shock damage to the unit. In the case of our Vanguard here, they have 30% discipline – meaning that the 30 Shock damage is reduced to just 21 shock damage, keeping them in the fight – barely.

Next is the actual damage portion of the fight. The Light Armor gets an enormous damage stat of 25, which slams against the Vanguard's 15 defense stat. Defense subtracts itself from the damage stat to get a final damage stat of 10, which hits the vanguard and leaves it with 25/35 health.

It's the vanguard's time to return fire.

20 shock damage v. the light armor's pitiful 5% discipline leaves a total of 19 shock damage, leaving the Light Armor with -14/5 morale, forcing it to abandon the field – it loses 25% of its current health in the retreat, or 2.5 Health, and the Vanguard claims victory.

 

[Double A]

Espionage is really damn inflexible now. How bout a replenishing espionage capability/health bar that players fund? If they have 3000 in it, then they can use 1500 to screw with someone, 500 to screw with someone else, and 1000 to protect themselves. Counter espionage has a point multiplier of x2.

 

[Tani Coyote]

A return to the MP3 style is not doable; the system became too micromanagey and steadily drove me insane. I'm hoping the economic system devised for MPV and ATEN is sufficient to model supply/demand without making me want to strangle myself.

Having determined MPV doesn't appeal to 3/4 of the player base I decided to can it in favor of ATEN. A blend of RP and IOT just isn't desired, and that's basically what MPV wished to be.

After ATEN I'll likely retire from GMing. I've run out of ideas that appeal to the IOT base.

 

[NinjaCow64]

A return to the MP3 style is not doable; the system became too micromanagey and steadily drove me insane. I'm hoping the economic system devised for MPV and ATEN is sufficient to model supply/demand without making me want to strangle myself.

Having determined MPV doesn't appeal to 3/4 of the player base I decided to can it in favor of ATEN. A blend of RP and IOT just isn't desired, and that's basically what MPV wished to be.

After ATEN I'll likely retire from GMing. I've run out of ideas that appeal to the IOT base.

I am going to be sad about that definitely. IMO, you should just host MP V anyway, people will probably still play it. And if they don't, then at leas the ones that do will enjoy it.

 

[Terran Empress]

A return to the MP3 style is not doable; the system became too micromanagey and steadily drove me insane. I'm hoping the economic system devised for MPV and ATEN is sufficient to model supply/demand without making me want to strangle myself.

Having determined MPV doesn't appeal to 3/4 of the player base I decided to can it in favor of ATEN. A blend of RP and IOT just isn't desired, and that's basically what MPV wished to be.

After ATEN I'll likely retire from GMing. I've run out of ideas that appeal to the IOT base.

Link to video.

 

[Sonereal]

-Purged-

 

[WhiteRobber]

===Knights of IOT===​

Map, courtesy of Nedim and me, cropped by HJ :

Spoiler :

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/t/w6kmw.jpg

Existing (unplayable) nations: The Papal States (white), Byzantium (purple) , the Ottoman Empire (green), the Mongol Horde (brown).


Europe. Year: between 500 and 1200.

Everyone starts by claiming four provinces and naming his Kingdom appropriately, then naming three Commanders (military rank and name are player's choice).
Religion will be chosen from the location of the nation, and will influence the stats.

Religion effects:
-Catholic (Northern Spain, France, Italy, Germany, England, Ireland, Denmark, Austria, Hungary, Jerusalem, Albania, Croatia): Infantry has +20% strength , Unique Unit: Crusader (strong cavalry with +25% strength vs Muslims).
-Orthodox (Serbia, Bulgaria, Romania, Ukraine, Russia, Armenia, Georgia) : +25% farming efficiency at all tech levels (more income from provinces) . Unique Unit: Militia (cheap, weak infantry)
-Pagan (Scandinavia, Caucasus, Eastern Russia, Poland) : -10% troop strength, +25% more money from province taxes, no need for conversion upon conquering land from enemies of other religion. Unique unit: Berserker ( infantry; Scandinavia), Horse Archer (cavalry; other regions)
-Muslim (Southern Spain, Turkey, North Africa) : +10% artillery strength, +5% Cavalry strength, has a 5% chance to make up to 5 enemy regiments disband, has a 5% chance to gain 1 extra Infantry, 1 extra Cavalry and 1 extra Artillery at the beginning of each battle. Unique Unit: Saracen (cannot be trained, 5 regiments of them defend each Muslim province, player-owned or unclaimed. Counts as infantry. +25% strength vs Catholics)

MENTION: due to Nedim being a whiner, whoever joins in Bosnia gets to pick his religion.

Religious conversions

A conquered enemy province of another religion will NOT pay taxes to your kingdom, thus it must be converted. You can either get lucky with your religious commander and convert it on the spot, or pay 10 EP for a conversion attempt (50% chance to convert, each failure decreases chance of failure).


==============================
====================

Armies cost:
1 Infantry - 2 EP - 1 Strength (power)
1 Cavalry - 4 EP - 1.5 STR
1 Artillery - 6 EP - 2 STR ( 1 when Defending)


Uniques:
1 Crusader (cav) - 5 EP
1 Militia (inf) - 1 EP
1 Berserker (inf) - 2 EP
1 Horse Archer (cav) - 2 EP
Saracens cannot be trained.

Infantry has a power of 1, Cavalry has a power of 1.5 and Artillery has a power of 2. The combined power of your armies is both the “health” and the “damage” of your armies in battle. Having more inf/cav/art than the enemy gives a 10% bonus to the total power given by that category.
NOTE: Artillery works at full strength only when it is the attacker. When defending, artillery has a power of 1, just like infantry. Also, Artillery automatically disbands once all Infantry regiments are destroyed.

The army with the most power ( or strength) wins the battle.
Each category of armies gains individual bonuses.
===========================================

Commanders rule armies; every won battle gives them 1 Attribute Point. Attribute Points are used to gain bonuses in and out of battle and advance in rank, from Rank I (starting) to Rank V (dangerous).

Rank cost:
Rank I - everyone starts with it.; no bonuses. only 5% bonus when defending.
Rank II - Commander gains 5 income for every military victory and 1 income every turn. Requires 3 Attributes and 3 spare Attribute Points. 10% Defender bonus
Rank III - Commander now gains 10 income per victory and 2 income every turn. Requires 10 Attributes and 5 spare Attribute Points. 20% Defender bonus
Rank IV - Chance of death in battle (usually 10% for victory and 20% for defeat) is halved, All units under the lead of this Commander gain +5% strength. Requires 15 Attributes and 10 spare Attribute Points. 25% Defender bonus
Rank V - Commander inspires his people, raising +25% more infantry and 10% more Cavalry units before each battle; the extra units are disbanded after the battle; Commander now gains 20 income per victory and 5 income every turn. Requires 20 Attributes and 10 spare Attribute points. 30% defender bonus.

After reaching Rank V, any Attribute Points the Commander has are added to the strength of the entire army as a small percent.




Ranks require having Attributes. Attributes are gained by spending Attribute Points. Each Commander has his own Attribute points, which are not shared with others.
Attributes are as follows, and are ranked too; higher Attribute rank means you need to get those of lower rank first:

-Infantry Tactics I - all Infantry under this Commander gain 5% strength when attacking.
-Infantry Tactics II - all Infantry under this Commander gain another 5% strength when attacking.

-Heavy Guards I - All Infantry under this Commander gain 5% strength when outnumbered and defending.
-Heavy Guards II - All Cavalry under this Commander gain 5% strength when outnumbered and defending.

-Horseback Training I - All Cavalry under this Commander gain 5% strength.
-Horseback Training II - All Cavalry under this Commander gain 5% strength

-Horse Transport - 25% of Infantry under this Commander can turn into Cavalry if the Commander so desires, at the beginning of the battle; the transformation is permanent.

-Siegecraft I - All Artillery under this Commander gain 5% strength when Attacking.
-Siegecraft II - All Artillery under this Commander gain 5% more strength when Attacking.

-Intensive Training - All Unique Units under this Commander gain 10% strength
-Elite Training (requires Intensive Training) - All Unique Units under this Commander gain another 10% strength when outnumbered.

-Religious Fanaticism I(Unavailable to Pagans) - All units under this Commander gain 3% strength against enemies of different religion.
-Religious Fanaticism II - All Units under this Commander gain 6% strength against enemies of different religion.
-Religious Fanaticism III- All Units under this Commander gain 9% strength against enemies of different religion.
-Religious Fanaticism IV - All Units under this Commander gain 12% strength against enemies of different religion.
-Religious Fanaticism V - All Units under this Commander gain 15% strength against enemies of different religion.

-Monk Commander - no effect yet.
-Cleric Commander - 20% chance to instantly convert enemy provinces of other religions upon conquering them.
-Priest Commander - 40% chance to convert provinces.
-Bishop Commander - 60% chance
-Holy Commander - 80% chance. Unavailable to Pagans.

-Tactical Commander I - no effect yet
-Tactical Commander II -Artillery strength loss when Defending is halved.
-Tactical Commander III - Artillery strength loss when Defending is no more.

-Prestigious Commander - chance to gain 1 extra Attribute Point when Ranking up.

-Healer I - 10% of loses are recovered after each battle.
-Healer II - 20% of loses are recovered after each battle.
-Healer III - 30% of loses are recovered after each battle.



=================
Expansion and Farming

To claim a province, one must send a Commander with his army to that province and pay 10 EP to build fortifications.

To gain a new Commander, one must build an Academy in a province ( 20 EP each, the more, the better, max 1 academy per province.); Academies give a 25% chance for a new Officer to appear. Promoting an Officer to Commander costs 5 EP and he must be given an army. Officers are stored for later promotions.

Each Province owned pays 12 EP to the player who owns it. If an enemy conquers a province you own, It will gain “Plundered” status and it will give him only half the taxes, for 3 turns; if it is of a different religion, it will not pay taxes at all; thus conversion is necessary to gain taxes.

Paying 10 EP for province repairs removes Plundered status.
Conversion implies repairs.




Farming is another important factor. There are 3 farming tech levels. Upgrading to the next tech level costs 30 EP+ (desired tech level x5). Upgrading to the next tech level upgrades all provinces. Every province starts at Level 1 Farming and gives normal income, Level 2 gives +50% more income and Level 3 gives double than the original income.
Plundering a province decreases it’s Farming level by 1. Minimum is 1. Repairing a province restores it's Farming level. A province that was Plundered will be marked on the map with a little fire icon.


Armies can only exist under their Commanders; if the commander dies, all his armies are disbanded.
Armies can only move to 1 adjacent province per turn.

====================================
Nation Size:
Nation size counts a lot!

Sheikdom / County - small size (no bonuses) - starting size ( 4-8 provinces)
Emirate / Duchy - medium size ( adds 15 EP) - ( 8-13 provs)
Sultanate / Kingdom - big size ( adds another 15 EP) - (13-16 provs)
Caliphate / Empire - HUGE ( adds another 20 EP) - (16+ provs)


=================================
Revolts and Rebels.

Each nation has a “Stability” stat. If it goes under 60% you’re in trouble. If you anger the population somehow, then you get a revolt, usually having only Infantry. Defeating the revolters is of utmost importance for the integrity of your nation. If not dealt with, they multiply and take over.

If Stability gets under 70%, you’ll start getting hints on what angers your population and what can you do about it.



==================

Everyone starts with 10 Infantry and 2 Cavalry.
Everyone starts with 1 Academy .

 

[NedimNapoleon]

I protest this game. The Balkans weren't orthodox. Croatia was Catholic, Bosnia was Bogomil/Catholic, Albania was Catholic and so on.

EDIT: Church split hadn't happened, so its meaningless. 1054, you have to start later than that year.

 

[Arakhor]

Well, there's that and the fact that Osman I wasn't even born until 1258.

 

[hoplitejoe]

I am going ahead and saying this isn't going to be an IOT which focuses on historical accuracy.

 

[WhiteRobber]

Map is better now and religions have changed according to Nedim's comment.

Also, it's historically inaccurate, it's an IOT. Things will get creepy anyway, so why start realistically? If this starts, I'll see muslims in Germany and Pagans in France before Turn 10. Maybe Byzantium will survive and the Pope will be murdered by Muslims, who knows?

Of course I know it's historically inaccurate! Western Roman Empire fell before year 500, the Mongol Hordes attacked around 1200, so i'm mixing stats up for awesomeness. Goddangit, one of the unique units is a VIKING BERSERKER. Another one is a CRUSADER. Another one is a MONGOL HORSE ARCHER