iPhone X

[Kozmos]

Because people don't realize how poorly sd cards perform and how negatively it would affect performance on an iPhone, particularly when they just go to Best Buy and get the cheapest one. Adding sd card support would require compromises for the users and workflows Apple cares about, so it's never going to happen.

No, they really aren't: https://www.androidcentral.com/kitkat-sdcard-changes

I agree it's never going to happen, but because of profit reasons not because of virtually imperceptible performance losses for the majority of casual users.

I barely even remember that, that's how few people I've encountered that had trouble with that specific incident. SD card capability is still the question I always hear when people who don't want to splurge a small fortune on a phone want to buy one.

 

[Zelig]

No, the performance losses with low-quality sd cards are drastic - you're looking at an order of magnitude lower storage performance. Not to mention you're compromising the phone for everyone who doesn't need or want to use an sd card.

You don't understand Apple's motivations if you think it's because of profits.

 

[luiz]

No, the performance losses with low-quality sd cards are drastic - you're looking at an order of magnitude lower storage performance. Not to mention you're compromising the phone for everyone who doesn't need or want to use an sd card.

You don't understand Apple's motivations if you think it's because of profits.

Ultimately everything Apple does is about long term profits. They're not a religious organization, their concern is shareholder return, no matter how much they cloak it in nerdy or do-gooder rhetoric.

 

[Kozmos]

You say storage performance to a casual customer and they'll just look at you blankly. I repaired OOW electronics for a while, people who don't buy Iphones simply don't care or even care to understand.

They have shareholders whose motivations are pretty much the same as in every company of the world. People don't buy shares because they have a turn-on for rounded edges, they buy them because they expect profits, everything else is marketing noises.

 

[Zelig]

Ultimately everything Apple does is about long term profits. They're not a religious organization, their concern is shareholder return, no matter how much they cloak it in nerdy or do-gooder rhetoric.

You can justify most nerdy and do-gooder actions in the pursuit of long-term profit if you correctly frame the problem.

You say storage performance to a casual customer and they'll just look at you blankly. I repaired OOW electronics for a while, people who don't buy Iphones simply don't care or even care to understand.

Not particularly relevant. Casual customers won't know the technical details of anything, but they still benefit from companies that enforce quality technical standards.

They have shareholders whose motivations are pretty much the same as in every company of the world. People don't buy shares because they have a turn-on for rounded edges, they buy them because they expect profits, everything else is marketing noises.

Yes, and Apple's approach of building the products based on Jony Ive's personal vision and lack-of-cares-given about shareholders have yielded fantastic shareholder profit.

 

[Narz]

That does not factor in to Apple's decision. They legitimately think the user experience is better without an sd card slot.

And you can hardly call people gullible if they agree with Apple on that front.

How do you know what they think?

That's preposterous, sd card management on mobile is far more confusing than not having an sd card.

Installing and using an SD card on a Samsung Galaxy is very simple, much easier than managing music and other files on my iPod ever was.

 

[Kozmos]

No, but they know how much it costs to have X amount of stuff. And when they're getting bilked on accessories and other walled garden wonders.

Everything they do has been approved by them. Time will tell if settling on the high end of 15% share of the market is the right move.

 

[Zelig]

How do you know what they think?

I've got friends/colleagues at Apple.

And even otherwise, Apple's actions as a whole are most plausible if you assume their goal is to provide the best products and services they can, and then work out pricing afterwards.

Installing and using an SD card on a Samsung Galaxy is very simple, much easier than managing music and other files on my iPod ever was.

Apple Music and iTunes are pretty simple and easy. As I mentioned before, Apple only particularly cares about what they think is the best way to do things (iTunes) - they don't care to support sub-par use cases. (manually copying files around)

 

[Kozmos]

I don't remember a magical copier from back when I used iTunes. And when it obliterated 8 gigs of music on my gifted iPod under the guise of 'fixing a problem' a convenient slang apparently for formatting a device I never looked back.

 

[Zelig]

One of my favorite sites on tech industry strategy: The Lessons and Questions of the iPhone X and the iPhone 8

 

[Narz]

No, the performance losses with low-quality sd cards are drastic - you're looking at an order of magnitude lower storage performance.

Also, what is "storage performance". My videos, pics & music have never "performed" improperly. What do you suspect most people are storaging on SD cards?

As I mentioned before, Apple only particularly cares about what they think is the best way to do things (iTunes) - they don't care to support sub-par use cases. (manually copying files around)

That's their problem, they think they know best, trying to force users to do things their way. I want to be able to move around my music files at will & play them on whatever app I like. I guess for the layperson who doesn't want to have to think & to whom money is no object Apple makes sense.

 

[Zelig]

Also, what is "storage performance". My videos, pics & music have never "performed" improperly. What do you suspect most people are storaging on SD cards?

Off the top of my head, some things that will be faster with faster storage: Taking camera pictures, ability to do slower-mo video (well, it won't be faster, but it will be possible - you can't do 4K60 or 1080p@240fps with slow storage), browsing through photo library (i.e. loading many thumbnails quickly), processing media, copying media to/from a PC, installing apps, launching apps, saving/loading things in apps.

Really anything where storage speed is the bottleneck - which will happen more easily on iPhone because of how fast the CPU/GPU is.

I mean, it's not particularly secret what things work better with faster storage, basically the same list of things as on a PC.

I want to be able to move around my music files at will & play them on whatever app I like.

*shrug* That's never been the model for iOS workflows.

I guess for the layperson who doesn't want to have to think & to whom money is no object Apple makes sense.

Or for people who want the best CPU performance.
Or for people who prioritize security.
Or for people to whom the network effect of iMessage is important.
Or for people who want one of the best phone cameras.
Or for people who want a smartwatch from the world's #1 watch company.
Or for people who don't trust Google on the privacy front.
Or for people who value the integration between iPhone and Macs. (You can seamlessly move between them for calls and texts.)
Or for people who live within a reasonable distance of an Apple store and value the best-in-class support and repair service available there.
Or for people who want a phone with the largest selection of frequency bands for international travel.
Or for people who want or need to make use of accessories or hardware that are only functional with iOS devices.
Or for people who want their phone to be supported for a longer period of time. (Apple is going to be ending iPhone 5 support from 5 years ago with the iOS 11 release in a couple weeks - no Android manufacturer comes close to comparable long-term support.)
Or for people who want functionality or simply support from Apple Pay that Android Pay doesn't provide.
Or for people who want the best wireless headphone connectivity options. (Seriously, the W1 chip blows away standard Bluetooth.)
Or for people who don't want carrier/manufacturer bloat.
Or for people who want a high-end phone with a small screen.
Or for people who want more than one of the above, and can't find any Android devices that check off all of the specific things they're looking for.

Look, I don't have an iPhone, (and don't have any plans to get one in the foreseeable future) but it's disingenuous to pretend that there aren't a multitude of legitimate reasons to choose it over nearly any available Android option.

 

[Broken_Erika]

The only phone i ever owned was a Nokia Communicator 9000. No idea what happened to it...

 

[caketastydelish]

This is a phone that either came out in the 1960's or far into the future, I'm not sure. Not sure what happened to it, either.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Also IOS apps are better vetted before being made available to the public.

 

[Zelig]

Also, to further underline the confluence of performance and longevity - you think your midrange Android device feels fast enough now? How about in five years? Because not only is Apple years ahead in performance, they're continuing to extend their lead. So if you buy a flagship iPhone today, in five years it's still going to be on par with new Android devices.

Also IOS apps are better vetted before being made available to the public.

I don't think they really are - most of the difference in malicious apps sneaking onto the App Store vs. Play Store mostly comes down to a) how many more Android users there are to target, b) Android being less secure as a platform with most users running out-of-date software and c) Android having more permissive APIs, so you can more easily act maliciously as an app.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

you guys seem to be really knowledgeable about phones, so I want to ask you this:

I recently bought a phone from China, and for me it's the best phone purchase of my life

it's a xiaomi redmi note 4 global (yes, I learned how to pronounce it correctly, sounds super cute.)

It cost me a measly 140€, like 5€ for transportation, which comes to a total of 173USD.

I really don't know anything about what stats are considered "baseline" for phones that came out this year (or the last few years either)

Is this competitive with the "big smartphone" companies? not necessarily with their flagships of course, more in general

stats

Spoiler :

Description:

Basic Information
Model Xiaomi Redmi Note 4 (3GB+32GB) Global Edition
Style Bar
Color Black, Gold, Gray
Network Band 2G: GSM 850/900/1800/1900MHz
3G: WCDMA 850/900/1900/2100MHz
4G: FDD-LTE B1/B3/B4/B5/B7/B8/B20
[===Not Sure Your Network ?===] / [==Will My Phone Work ?==]
Sim Card Dual SIM Card Dual Standby
Card Slot 1 supports Micro-SIM Card
Card Slot 2 Supports Nano-SIM Card/ Micro SD Card
Shell Material Metal

System
OS MIUI V8
CPU MSM8953, Snapdragon 625, 4x2.0Ghz A53 + 4x2.0Ghz A53, 64-bit
GPU Adreno 506
ROM 32GB
RAM 3GB
Card Extend Supports an external Micro SD card up to 128GB (VFAT)

Screen
Display Size 5.5 Inch
Type FHD Capacitive Touch Screen, 72% NTSC color gamut, support Sunlight Display, Night Display
Brightness 450nit
Resolution 1080*1920 pixels
PPI 403
Multitouch Yes

Support Format
Ringtones Type Polyphonic / MP3
Audio format ACC, MP3, AMR, FLAC, APE, WAV
Video File Format MP4, M4V, MKV, XVID
Graphical Format JPEG/PNG/GIF/BMP
Earphone Port 3.5mm

Data Transfer & Connectivity
Data transfer USB/Bluetooth
Mobile internet WAP/WiFi

General
Camera/Picture
Resolution Dual Cameras:
Front camera 5.0MP
ƒ/2.0 aperture
Beautify with 36 smart beauty profiles
Back camera 13.0MP
Two-tone flash
Support PDAF
5-element lens
ƒ/2.0 aperture
78° wide-angle
Panorama, Straighten, Manual mode, Scene mode, Timer, HDR
Language This phone supports multi-language.
(More details please refer to the screenshots)
Message SMS/MMS
Keyboard QWERTY Virtual
Input Handwrite/Keypad
GPS GPS+AGPS+GLONASS+BeiDou
WIFI 802.11 a/b/g/n, WIFI Display, WiFi Direct
Bluetooth BT4.1, HID

Sensor
Ambient Light Sensor Support
Gyroscope Support
E-compass Support
Proximity sensor Support
Accelerometer Support
IR remote Support
Hall Sensor Support
Fingerprint(Back) Support

Other Feature WIFI, GPS, 4G, 3G, Bluetooth, Games, calendar, calculator, clock, camera, etc
Battery(Built-in) 4100mAh(typ) / 4000mAh(min)
USB connector Micro USB
Dimensions 151*76*8.45mm
Weight 165g

anyone else buying tech stuff from china recently? I'm always amazed at the prices, but my pockets not thick enough to buy me a new laptop

 

[Zelig]

Xiaomi/Oppo/Vivo/Huawei/ZTE are "big" smartphone companies, the first three just don't have any real presence in North America, speculation is that in large part they'd be subject to IP complaints, which they can mostly just disregard for China.

Typical downside of Chinese phones is that they're missing the appropriate frequency bands for North America, other than the very limited selection of "global" models they offer.

The Redmi Note 4 is fine - cheaper than almost any other phones with comparable hardware specs. Downside is really miui - it doesn't perform as well as stock Android, is more poorly designed (in order to ape iOS in ways that are contrary to how Android is designed to function), is unified across Android versions so sticks you with the lowest common denominator of supported features, and costs you significant delay of updates.

I avoid Chinese hardware because I don't trust them to do software. Even Lenovo is off the list after all the crap they've been caught installing on Windows laptops over the past few years.

 

[civvver]

Also, to further underline the confluence of performance and longevity - you think your midrange Android device feels fast enough now? How about in five years? Because not only is Apple years ahead in performance, they're continuing to extend their lead. So if you buy a flagship iPhone today, in five years it's still going to be on par with new Android devices.



I don't think they really are - most of the difference in malicious apps sneaking onto the App Store vs. Play Store mostly comes down to a) how many more Android users there are to target, b) Android being less secure as a platform with most users running out-of-date software and c) Android having more permissive APIs, so you can more easily act maliciously as an app.

I agree, the iphone 5s is still a good phone.

I also think andriod gets more targets cus you can develop for it with a very cheap pc and free tools. iOs you need to setup an apple account to get to the app store, you need a mac with macos to do the final compile/deploy, I don't know if free ides to develop are as abundant. It may seem like a trivial expense to a pro developer but to like a hacker in a 3rd world country it could be a lot of money.

I avoid Chinese hardware because I don't trust them to do software. Even Lenovo is off the list after all the crap they've been caught installing on Windows laptops over the past few years.

It's sad cus ibm laptops used to be excellent and the lenovo brand was ok for a while.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

you guys seem to be really knowledgeable about phones, so I want to ask you this:

I recently bought a phone from China, and for me it's the best phone purchase of my life

it's a xiaomi redmi note 4 global (yes, I learned how to pronounce it correctly, sounds super cute.)

It cost me a measly 140€, like 5€ for transportation, which comes to a total of 173USD.

I really don't know anything about what stats are considered "baseline" for phones that came out this year (or the last few years either)

Is this competitive with the "big smartphone" companies? not necessarily with their flagships of course, more in general

stats

Spoiler :

Description:

Basic Information
Model Xiaomi Redmi Note 4 (3GB+32GB) Global Edition
Style Bar
Color Black, Gold, Gray
Network Band 2G: GSM 850/900/1800/1900MHz
3G: WCDMA 850/900/1900/2100MHz
4G: FDD-LTE B1/B3/B4/B5/B7/B8/B20
[===Not Sure Your Network ?===] / [==Will My Phone Work ?==]
Sim Card Dual SIM Card Dual Standby
Card Slot 1 supports Micro-SIM Card
Card Slot 2 Supports Nano-SIM Card/ Micro SD Card
Shell Material Metal

System
OS MIUI V8
CPU MSM8953, Snapdragon 625, 4x2.0Ghz A53 + 4x2.0Ghz A53, 64-bit
GPU Adreno 506
ROM 32GB
RAM 3GB
Card Extend Supports an external Micro SD card up to 128GB (VFAT)

Screen
Display Size 5.5 Inch
Type FHD Capacitive Touch Screen, 72% NTSC color gamut, support Sunlight Display, Night Display
Brightness 450nit
Resolution 1080*1920 pixels
PPI 403
Multitouch Yes

Support Format
Ringtones Type Polyphonic / MP3
Audio format ACC, MP3, AMR, FLAC, APE, WAV
Video File Format MP4, M4V, MKV, XVID
Graphical Format JPEG/PNG/GIF/BMP
Earphone Port 3.5mm

Data Transfer & Connectivity
Data transfer USB/Bluetooth
Mobile internet WAP/WiFi

General
Camera/Picture
Resolution Dual Cameras:
Front camera 5.0MP
ƒ/2.0 aperture
Beautify with 36 smart beauty profiles
Back camera 13.0MP
Two-tone flash
Support PDAF
5-element lens
ƒ/2.0 aperture
78° wide-angle
Panorama, Straighten, Manual mode, Scene mode, Timer, HDR
Language This phone supports multi-language.
(More details please refer to the screenshots)
Message SMS/MMS
Keyboard QWERTY Virtual
Input Handwrite/Keypad
GPS GPS+AGPS+GLONASS+BeiDou
WIFI 802.11 a/b/g/n, WIFI Display, WiFi Direct
Bluetooth BT4.1, HID

Sensor
Ambient Light Sensor Support
Gyroscope Support
E-compass Support
Proximity sensor Support
Accelerometer Support
IR remote Support
Hall Sensor Support
Fingerprint(Back) Support

Other Feature WIFI, GPS, 4G, 3G, Bluetooth, Games, calendar, calculator, clock, camera, etc
Battery(Built-in) 4100mAh(typ) / 4000mAh(min)
USB connector Micro USB
Dimensions 151*76*8.45mm
Weight 165g

anyone else buying tech stuff from china recently? I'm always amazed at the prices, but my pockets not thick enough to buy me a new laptop

Buy it. Xiaomi Mimax here, coming from a Moto E. It is so much better...