• Civilization 7 has been announced. For more info please check the forum here .

Italian judge orders arrest of 13 CIA agents for kidnapping terrorist suspect

Uiler

Emperor
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Messages
1,849
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050624/ap_on_re_eu/italy_cia

As I noted in an earlier thread, US allies are becoming more and more recaltrant about handing over terrorist suspects to the US partly because of human rights concern but also in large part due to their feeling that common US tactics which are basically kidnapping/not getting the permission of the government etc. represent a violation of national sovereignity. If more cases like this appear in Europe and Canada it could make things a lot more difficult for the US...

ROME - An Italian judge has ordered the arrest of 13
CIA agents for allegedly helping deport an imam to Egypt as part of U.S. anti-terrorism efforts, an Italian official familiar with the investigation said Friday.

The agents are suspected in the seizure of an Egyptian-born imam identified as Abu Omar on the streets of Milan in February 2003, according to the official, who requested anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information.

The U.S. Embassy in Rome declined to comment.

Prosecutors believe the agents seized Omar as part of the CIA's "extraordinary rendition" program, in which terror suspects are transferred to third countries without court approval, according to reports Friday in newspapers Corriere della Sera and Il Giorno.

Investigators traced the agents through check-in details at Milan hotels and their use of Italian cell phones during the operation, the reports said. All the agents are American and include three women, Il Giorno said.

The reports said another six agents were being investigated for helping prepare the operation.

They said police also received an eyewitness account from an Egyptian woman who heard Omar calling for help and saw him being bundled into a white van as he walked from his house to a mosque.

The report said Omar was taken to Aviano, a joint U.S.-Italian base north of Venice, and was flown from there to another U.S. air base in Ramstein, Germany, before being taken in a second jet to Cairo.

A judge also has issued a separate arrest warrant for Omar, news agencies ANSA and Apcom said. In that warrant, Judge Guido Salvini claimed the seizure of Omar represented a violation of Italian sovereignty, Apcom reported.

Earlier this month, Milan prosecutor Armando Spataro told The Associated Press that the prosecution was treating the disappearance of Omar as an abduction.

Spataro declined to say who was suspected for the alleged abduction, but he said Omar's disappearance damaged an ongoing operation by Italian authorities. He said he visited the air base in February.

Omar was believed to have fought with jihadists in
Afghanistan and Bosnia, and prosecutors were seeking evidence against him before his disappearance, according to a report last year in La Repubblica newspaper, which cited intelligence officials.

Italian papers have reported that Omar, 42, called his wife and friends in Milan after his release last year, recounting he had been seized by Italian and American agents and taken to a secret prison in Egypt, where he was tortured with electric shocks.

Italian officials believe he now is living in Egypt, although Italian newspaper accounts suggested he was returned to custody shortly after his release.
 
Well, I've been reading about the covert ops the CIA have been running to do this for about 3 years.

There is a "commercial" US airplane used by the CIA as a front for transporting these people once abducted, a very good BBC documentary covered the story in the "power of nightmares" documentary series.

If you never saw the "power of nightmares" series here are the links to the BBC (it's a "must see"):

The Power of Nightmares: Baby It's Cold Outside
The Power of Nightmares: The Phantom Victory
The Power of Nightmares: The Shadows In The Cave
 
Well someones goin get fired for this blunder. But those people arent going to get arrested, this will be forgotten and just kept on record so the Italians dont look powerless.
 
The point the Italians are making is that this is just too damned far. The US acts like the middle east is it's playground with it's own "torture states", and the western countries like the UK back it up and defend it.

Good on Italy I say, even if the US will piss on them anyway.
 
So much for the US's call for cooperation and intel sharing.
 
GrandAdmiral said:
So they ordered the arrest of 13 CIA agents. My question is, can they catch them?

That's certainly the question of the day. My money is on these agents getting away and showing up in Norfolk Virginia laughing at the incompetence of the Italian intelligence services. And what are the Italians going to do about it? Declare war? :p
 
:lol: The CIA is a sneaky bunch.
 
Oh no, a faceless immam who probably would like nothing more than detonate in the middle of a school was arrested. Forgive me if my socks aren't knocked off.
 
Romanfe said:
Oh no, a faceless immam who probably would like nothing more than detonate in the middle of a school was arrested. Forgive me if my socks aren't knocked off.

You're getting carried away, pal. If you think to justify the US administration kidnapping people on not only foreign, but allied territory, by some delusion about all imams being terrorists, then you've got a lot of catching up in open mindedness to do. :)
 
Romanfe said:
Oh no, a faceless immam who probably would like nothing more than detonate in the middle of a school was arrested. Forgive me if my socks aren't knocked off.
These sentiments worry me. The CIA arrests someone illegally, and the first thought that enters some people's head is "He was obviously a terrorist who wanted to murder children".
 
ainwood said:
These sentiments worry me. The CIA arrests someone illegally, and the first thought that enters some people's head is "He was obviously a terrorist who wanted to murder children".

Omar was believed to have fought with jihadists in
Afghanistan and Bosnia, and prosecutors were seeking evidence against him before his disappearance, according to a report last year in La Repubblica newspaper, which cited intelligence officials.

Even the Italians thought he was a terrorist. You know what I think? I don't think the Italians are ticked at us for grabbing one of their citizens, they're just mad because we're better at our jobs and got to him first. :p
 
Elrohir said:
Even the Italians thought he was a terrorist. You know what I think? I don't think the Italians are ticked at us for grabbing one of their citizens, they're just mad because we're better at our jobs and got to him first. :p
Have you read the article ?

Your thought is untrue. It has nothing to do with jealousy; it has to do with what is legal and what is not.
 
Rik Meleet said:
Have you read the article ?

Your thought is untrue. It has nothing to do with jealousy; it has to do with what is legal and what is not.

Yeah I read the article. And it sounds to me like they're ticked that we got to him first rather than that we grabbed him. ;)
 
ainwood said:
These sentiments worry me. The CIA arrests someone illegally, and the first thought that enters some people's head is "He was obviously a terrorist who wanted to murder children".
Better to arrest innocents and release them later then let their ilk do wrong without consequence. If you think that sentiment is worrying, I wonder what you think of the imams who call for violence.

Indifference? Cultural Understanding?

THAT, worries me.
 
Romanfe said:
Better to arrest innocents and release them later then let their ilk do wrong without consequence.
So when they come for you, you'll smile and go along because its for the greater good? Will they actually do anything to try and prove this guys guilt, or just throw him in gotmo?

If you think that sentiment is worrying, I wonder what you think of the imams who call for violence.

Indifference? Cultural Understanding?

THAT, worries me.
I do not support violence against civilians; I do not agree with jihadists etc. My concern is the flagrent disregard for human rights and international law.
 
Elrohir said:
Yeah I read the article. And it sounds to me like they're ticked that we got to him first rather than that we grabbed him. ;)
Than you hear incorrect. You surely have a strange way of viewing your allies, if you ask me.

The reason the order for the arrest was given was because the 13 CIA agents kidnapped a person in a country where they had no jurisdiction. If I was Italian I'd be more "ticked" that my country's independence was violated than I was that an ally got a mutual enemy first.
 
Rik Meleet said:
Than you hear incorrect. You surely have a strange way of viewing your allies, if you ask me.

The reason the order for the arrest was given was because the 13 CIA agents kidnapped a person in a country where they had no jurisdiction. If I was Italian I'd be more "ticked" that my country's independence was violated than I was that an ally got a mutual enemy first.

Nah, I'm just strange to begin with. It's just something you'll have to live with. :crazyeye:

Yeah, I'd be ticked too. But I'd be more ticked that my country was so slow in accumulating evidence that a foreign intelligence service had to step in to grab him.
 
called his wife and friends in Milan after his release last year,

I hope he lead the CIA to some bigger fish.
Though given the mixed competence of the CIA ne cant be sure.
 
Top Bottom