Just another SG

[RRRaskolnikov]

Hum I played 3 turns and we need to discuss already...

A turn into the set, Monty dogpiled on Sury. A turn after, Charly switched into WHEOOHRN mode. turn 3, Joao joins Charly into war mode... expect hell!

There is a slim chance we aren't the target but I wouldn't take the risk. We have no army (4 warriors). Do I start whipping/chopping axes/spears? (Joao will have chariots and catapults with LBs, prolly HAs soon)

Also note the calendar trade available...

Spoiler pics of thos turns :

 

[shyuhe]

So is Willem the only AI who is neither plotting a war nor in a war?

I think we have to start building axes/spears in the east. Or do you guys think that Joao is planning to dogpile on Monty/Izzy?

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

So is Willem the only AI who is neither plotting a war nor in a war?

Yes

edit: also note that we got the water of Sparta spyed down (well u get me)... maybe a preemptive strike from the AI?

 

[Thrar]

Would Charlie attack us on his own even though he doesn't share borders with us? If he's preparing for the dogpile on Sury, at least that would mean Joao can't bribe him to attack us for now.

I agree with building up some defense against Joao. Can we get CoL quickly and then switch over to Construction? We should try to pillage his phants if he does go to war with us.
Would the AI attack with longbows if they're their strongest unit? If so, some swords would be good as they're the only unit we have that's on par with them strength-wise. Since we're Greek we won't need spears until Joao gets to HBR, better get more swords/phalanxes instead.

 

[kossin]

Based on probability, I'd say Charlie is going for Sury but Joao is going for us.
The Cata next to Coimbra is already promoted with CR (a post by bestsss where he said the AI promotes its troops down the CR line while forming the SoD) seems to be moving towards us rather than east.

Sparta is likely his target, bummer it's on flat land. Just get 300 men and you'll be fine though
Get a unit to scout his cities and the closest Charlie ones just for good measure.

Re: Longbows
I've seen a few AI stacks with longbows in them so yes he might tag them along and use them if they get the best odds.

 

[shyuhe]

If it's a dagger, I'm going to laugh. Then cry.

 

[Dhoomstriker]

I have seen AIs execute amphibious assaults using Longbowmen attackers on my Warrior-defended Cities before. I figured that I would point out that concept in case you thought that you'd be safe just because a City was "in the back." Muahahahaha!

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

Based on probability, I'd say Charlie is going for Sury but Joao is going for us.

You pretty much sum up my thinking... I am gonna start to whip things and see how it goes. Will finish COL at least. (I feel good as switching into buddhism at the beginning would have been useless, dunno when we get the possibility though)

@Thrar: would be weird, but I couldn't blame Charly as our 4 warrior guard isn't scary right now will pillage the ivory if I get the chance. (though I fear the few troops we have will be up to hold Sparta

@Dhoom: I've seen barb amphibitious assault (SGOTM9?)! I like that kind of feeling when you see the AI (that you were underestimating just 2 sec before) lands a stack behind your lines! Makes good entertainement (and a good reminder)!

 

[mystyfly]

I agree as well, joao is probably going for us. I don't see a huge problem however, whip a few units for safety but I'm not sure how soon he'll attack. What is for sure is that this war (-preparations) slow down his teching making him an easier target later (provided we survive of course). Charly likely won't DOW us.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

I played three more turns to complete COL. We have now 2 phalanxes and 2 spears, with several more phalanxes incoming in the next turns. I can go on till litterature (unless we want construction but not sure it will make a difference), it is 4 more turns.

Here are screenies of the situation (scouting, techs, resources, diplo stands still as a mess):

Spoiler :

I think we should backfill calendar, monarchy, and mono with COL/currency.
I did not settle the last city as we are short of workers and it would only add maint for now. Once I can start chopping, it can at least contribute production.

 

[Thrar]

Agreed on backfilling. We could trade our pigs or sheep with Sury for his 5gpt, but he's a lot of people's WE. We could trade the other with Monty for corn for diplo bonus and from granary. Oddly, Monty is nobody's WE.

Unfortunately, it looks like Joao got iron via trade since it shows up as "won't trade" for him.

So far it looks like most of Joao's power is in chariots and archers, so we should be fine without construction, but maybe not for long. What exactly do we want Lit for at this point? Can we afford to neglect military techs until Music?
I don't think building NE while at war is a good idea, better invest in more units and - if we go for Construction - hopefully capture something.

 

[shyuhe]

I'd prefer to go construction so that we can try capturing some cities.

 

[mystyfly]

Can't check the save right now but as I remember the state of our empire, we're in no position to capture any cities. We must finally get our infra in place. What does construction offer that we really need? Nutin'. What we need is NE and thus lit. I'm fine with you playing on, ras btw. Our GP-city doesn't contribute to our army until we start drafting.

Only thing I'd do is put a few swords next to a city reachable in 1-2t that is underdefended. And, if we want to play safe, demand 10g from joao if we're at pleased (can't tell as ras appears to play without BUG... ).

 

[shyuhe]

We can try to grab Joao's northern city. We may be able to gift it away as part of a peace deal if necessary. It shouldn't take more than 2-3 swords to conquer if he doesn't get LBs there.

 

[mystyfly]

That is absolutely fine by me. I'm just remided of some catrushplans after my set - which is nonsense. Getting a few swords is fine, researching an useledss tech and building 10-20 more units is not imo.

 

[babybluepants]

I don't see the point of teching Construction. It'll cost us 7t and all our current cash + some. We'd barely have the production for those units, and he'll have LBs in 1t. We can research Lit and give him that for peace later? How many units do we expect him to attack with? 10-15?

I'd make the backfill trades.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

OK Seems we have a consensus on what to do, will get some swords to try and grab that northern city if it goes well. I played 7 turns iirc so I am gonna play till litterature

@Thar: the idea is to try to get a quick peace, going total war now isn't possible as our happyness, production, and population can't handle deity production. Litterature will bring the NE (and maybe we can unlock a 10 xp unit soon), and early music is always a boomer for trading, and potential GA.

@mysty: yeah I should get BUG Checking war status every turn (going to see each AI) is painfull to say the least I usually play with BUFFY but it appears not to be compatible...

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

Here is the new save:

Joao declared two turns later (ie dagger in our face), turn t89... We have 6 phalanxes, 2 spears, and 3 swords, but no promotions. We can whip a wall or a sword in Sparta as he will attack either in this IBT or in the next. Proceeded with the tech trades, and grabbed some gold from Monty as Thar suggested.

Literrature is in. None has it but Willhem.

I am kinda worryed but this war honnestly (and that northern city will have three LBs in a couple of turns... grabbing any city might be a dream ) The settler is still there (maybe we can use it to peace).

A screenshot of the incoming battle:

Note the galley circling the peninsula. Joao must be willing to do us a Dhoomstriker's

Joao built the GLH, Willhem the Parthenon and someone else the hanging gardens... reporting it even if we have other things to worry about!
GOod luck to the next player, he will need it

 

[mystyfly]

That doesnt look too bad. I'd whip another unit to ensure the defense hold and for counterattacks. I think he'll bombar another ibt..

@Ras: BUG can be installed in CA, BUFFY not afaik. The game is generated without a mod loaded so you could not use BUFFY.

 

[lymond]

Isn't a wall kind of useless once they've already started bombarding. It will help buy time to prior to bombardment but not much after. I think units are the only thing that will save Sparta.