erez87
Lord of Random
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It's not third year, but third turn
KhaNESII: S.P.Q.R
- Thread starter Grandkhan
- Start date
germanicus12
First Citizen of Rome
Dispatches from Marcus Titus Scipio:
As any commander knows, losing a commander during a battle or war is a heart shattering morale hit for troops in the field, but if the Senate deems it necessary to prove my loyalty by forcing me to return to Rome without bringing back the 1st Legio then I shall do so.
As for the deserters, they are no longer soldiers of Rome, and therefore are not obligated to follow the orders of the Senate anymore. Since they are now in my care and under my employ as a bodyguard unit I must ask that the Senate respect that these ex soldiers are now citizens of the Empire and as such no longer eligible for retired soldier benefits which they forfeited by deserting. Also, I believe these tortured souls have been punished enough, they brought shame to their Legion and themselves, they have a black stain upon their honor and their brothers in the 1st Legio are currently in Gaul trying to redeem their honor and pride as the Elite of the Empire. So I ask the Senate to leave these poor citizens alone and allow them to live out their lives in peace.
The messenger also searched for and found Cassiodor and handed him a wrapped bundle of papers and informed him, "The Legate thanks you for your support and he hopes the answer you seek lies within these papers." With that the Messenger turns and leaves the chambers, riding back to the north.
As any commander knows, losing a commander during a battle or war is a heart shattering morale hit for troops in the field, but if the Senate deems it necessary to prove my loyalty by forcing me to return to Rome without bringing back the 1st Legio then I shall do so.
As for the deserters, they are no longer soldiers of Rome, and therefore are not obligated to follow the orders of the Senate anymore. Since they are now in my care and under my employ as a bodyguard unit I must ask that the Senate respect that these ex soldiers are now citizens of the Empire and as such no longer eligible for retired soldier benefits which they forfeited by deserting. Also, I believe these tortured souls have been punished enough, they brought shame to their Legion and themselves, they have a black stain upon their honor and their brothers in the 1st Legio are currently in Gaul trying to redeem their honor and pride as the Elite of the Empire. So I ask the Senate to leave these poor citizens alone and allow them to live out their lives in peace.
The messenger also searched for and found Cassiodor and handed him a wrapped bundle of papers and informed him, "The Legate thanks you for your support and he hopes the answer you seek lies within these papers." With that the Messenger turns and leaves the chambers, riding back to the north.
talonschild
Drive-By NESer
The lights at the Aurelian Palace were on far later than was normal. Strewn across all flat surfaces of Cassiodor's study were papers of every description. The cloth that once contained the papers lay forgotten in a corner.
"Eureka!" shrieked Cassiodor all of a sudden. His slave Florentius poked his head in the door. "Sir?"
"Oh, don't you know any Greek? Eureka - never mind. Go and check I didn't disturb anyone else."
Florentius padded off. Cassiodor reexamined the paper that had caused so much excitement. "Interesting..." He picked up his quill and began writing. Perhaps there was still time to find that messenger of Scipio's.
"Eureka!" shrieked Cassiodor all of a sudden. His slave Florentius poked his head in the door. "Sir?"
"Oh, don't you know any Greek? Eureka - never mind. Go and check I didn't disturb anyone else."
Florentius padded off. Cassiodor reexamined the paper that had caused so much excitement. "Interesting..." He picked up his quill and began writing. Perhaps there was still time to find that messenger of Scipio's.
Seon
Not An Evil Liar
I personally support this bill for the creation of the new office.
Aye.
Aye. If they are honorable man, the court will have leniency.
[/QUOTE]
Grandkhan
Telvanni Master Wizard
Senators have 28 hours to propose laws before Legislative Proposals are closed.
If I am correct no one has yet to address the Gauls allied with us that seek to settle within our borders and wishing to prevent another incident like the Triumphs last session I propose:
1.3.13
The Allied Gaul seeking settlement within Roman territory will be allowed to settle as well as receive a fund, size determined by the Consuls, to aid in said settlement.
1.3.13
The Allied Gaul seeking settlement within Roman territory will be allowed to settle as well as receive a fund, size determined by the Consuls, to aid in said settlement.
Immaculate
unerring
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1.3.14.
is mutually exclusive to 1.3.13 and dependent upon the passage of 1.3.5.
New Roman military presence in Transalpine Gaul would be charged with protecting our allies in the region and protecting their homes within that province.
is mutually exclusive to 1.3.13 and dependent upon the passage of 1.3.5.
New Roman military presence in Transalpine Gaul would be charged with protecting our allies in the region and protecting their homes within that province.
talonschild
Drive-By NESer
Could you clarify
please?
Immaculate
unerring
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OOC:
fixed. sorry- exclusive to 1.3.13.
In one case you want to move the families to our lands. in the other you are going to protect them as part of a show of force in the region.
IC:
I strongly advocate peace through force in Transalpine Gaul. I condemn calls for 'peace at any costs'. I advocate protection, not relocation, of our allies. I believe Rome is strong and can protect itself and its borders. its important that potential enemies also believe this. Fleeing or abandoning a war (regardless of how it was begun) will invite foreign adventure and opportunism. We cannot allow this.
(OOC: to be clear i am talking about caesar's war- i guess that wasn't clear)
fixed. sorry- exclusive to 1.3.13.
In one case you want to move the families to our lands. in the other you are going to protect them as part of a show of force in the region.
IC:
I strongly advocate peace through force in Transalpine Gaul. I condemn calls for 'peace at any costs'. I advocate protection, not relocation, of our allies. I believe Rome is strong and can protect itself and its borders. its important that potential enemies also believe this. Fleeing or abandoning a war (regardless of how it was begun) will invite foreign adventure and opportunism. We cannot allow this.
(OOC: to be clear i am talking about caesar's war- i guess that wasn't clear)
Ekolite
Deity
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If you are referring to the so-called ''Republic of Gaul'' when you speak of allied parties, then as far as I am concerned they are no friend of Rome. Julius Caesar is responsible for the creation of this state, and when negotiating with them he did not have any authority to speak for the Senate and People of Rome. Thus any agreements made are between the Republic of Gaul and Julius Caesar, not the Republic of Gaul and Rome. Considering Caesar's rebellion, that leaves the Republic of Gaul at best as a neutral and insignificant party that is best treated with indifference, or at worst yet another Gallic foe.
In regards to the allied tribes which have helped us in the Lucian War, I would suggest they be granted the freedom to settle within Transalpine Gaul. However, I think it is a matter best left for the new Governor of the province to decide. Considering the need for new recruits for our legions, and the legal obligation which requires us to pay Generals' salaries this season, the government does not have the funds to support such minor projects. Instead I suggest any settlement is funded by the Governor of Transalpine Gaul, possibly with the contributions of any willing senators.
In regards to the allied tribes which have helped us in the Lucian War, I would suggest they be granted the freedom to settle within Transalpine Gaul. However, I think it is a matter best left for the new Governor of the province to decide. Considering the need for new recruits for our legions, and the legal obligation which requires us to pay Generals' salaries this season, the government does not have the funds to support such minor projects. Instead I suggest any settlement is funded by the Governor of Transalpine Gaul, possibly with the contributions of any willing senators.
I am fine with the duties being left to the governor, I merely did not want another important problem to slip through the cracks yet again. Rome must do what it can to protect her allies so that more may join here greatness.
Immaculate
unerring
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I believe that the 'Republic of Gaul' was created by men who believed in the power and glory of Rome, though, when they heard Caesar's whispers, their greed seduced them. That doesn't change that they believe in Rome and are the closest thing we have to friends in an area that is too full of enemies (albeit enemies we incurred by Caesar's madness). The "Republic of Gaul" must be a central piece in our efforts to pacify the region and retain our dominance at our borders. They cannot be a "neutral and insignificant party that is best treated with indifference, or at worst yet another Gallic foe". We can be seen to neither 1) be unable to protect our allies (either real or perceived) nor 2) make more enemies in a region already hostile to us.
In principle i agree. I await to see your proposal.
talonschild
Drive-By NESer
I agree with Albinus on the Republic of Gaul - like it or not, a Roman made the deal and we must honour it. In fact, I believe we are committed to any agreement that any of us make with another power, for the simple reason that the differences between us are far more obvious to a Roman than to, say, a German. Thus we are bound in the eyes of the world by the deals of a rebel. (OOC: Unless Grandkhan has allotted the NPCs a more sophisticated understanding of Roman politics?)
It is extremely important we find some way of cracking down on renegade negotiators.
Given the choice, I'd simply annex the Republic of Gaul. Simpler, and we can earn more money from it.
It is extremely important we find some way of cracking down on renegade negotiators.
Given the choice, I'd simply annex the Republic of Gaul. Simpler, and we can earn more money from it.
Immaculate
unerring
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OOC: good idea talonschild.
Terrance888
Discord Reigns
Vibius Plotius Agatopus Proposes Laws
This law to meant to preserve the intent behind the salaries- to reward good Generals and Envoys who, unlike Governors, do not receive direct funds from their labors for the republic. This will mean that even during Crisis situations, they will be paid at least once a year. I am assuming that a Dictator would be chosen only during a time of extremely grave crisis; therefore all funds should be freed and available for the empowered man to save the Republic.
This law to meant to preserve the intent behind the salaries- to reward good Generals and Envoys who, unlike Governors, do not receive direct funds from their labors for the republic. This will mean that even during Crisis situations, they will be paid at least once a year. I am assuming that a Dictator would be chosen only during a time of extremely grave crisis; therefore all funds should be freed and available for the empowered man to save the Republic.
The Helvetii currently dwell between Pannonia and New Transalpine Gaul. Although separated by high mountains, assuredly they use the few passes they had to trade with the tribes which are now under Roman rule. I believe it is in our best interest to establish an official relationship with these tribes living in such a strategic region, at at a minimum ensure the current peace along their borders and hopefully establishing their friendship as an Ally of Rome.
Ekolite
Deity
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A proposal from Consul Bruscius:
1.3.17: This law brings into existence the office of Overseer of Gaul. This would act as a superior agent to the Governor of Transalpine Gaul, and any other Senators and Generals in the area of Transalrpine Gaul (excluding Consuls), which is to be defined as both Roman and Barbarian lands north of the Pyrenees and beyond the Alpes. This office is to be appointed by the Consuls, and will receive strategic directions in the Bill each season. Its primary purpose is to co-ordinate all operations within this chaotic province and find bring the Gallic Wars to an end in a way that is favourable to Rome and does not compromise the integrity of the Republic. Further aims and objectives will be set by the Consuls, in consultation with the Senate, however precisely how these aims are best accomplished will be primarily up to the Overseer to decide. The Overseer will not be provided with a fixed budget due to the need for flexibility, but may request the Consuls for further resources of any kind should they be necessary. The office shall remain until deemed no longer neccessary by the Senate.
My reasoning for putting forward this Bill is that there is a clear need for central management of the Gallic situation in order to ensure an organised and united response to the challenges we face there. Thus far I have largely filled the role of co-ordinator myself however due to being presently located in Pannonia this has lead to some inevitable complications. I feel that Transalpine Gaul may benefit from co-ordination by a Senator more close to the action itself. My prefered candidate for such an office would likely be (Immaculate) however I would of course need to discuss the appointment with my fellow Consul before making a firm decision.
1.3.17: This law brings into existence the office of Overseer of Gaul. This would act as a superior agent to the Governor of Transalpine Gaul, and any other Senators and Generals in the area of Transalrpine Gaul (excluding Consuls), which is to be defined as both Roman and Barbarian lands north of the Pyrenees and beyond the Alpes. This office is to be appointed by the Consuls, and will receive strategic directions in the Bill each season. Its primary purpose is to co-ordinate all operations within this chaotic province and find bring the Gallic Wars to an end in a way that is favourable to Rome and does not compromise the integrity of the Republic. Further aims and objectives will be set by the Consuls, in consultation with the Senate, however precisely how these aims are best accomplished will be primarily up to the Overseer to decide. The Overseer will not be provided with a fixed budget due to the need for flexibility, but may request the Consuls for further resources of any kind should they be necessary. The office shall remain until deemed no longer neccessary by the Senate.
My reasoning for putting forward this Bill is that there is a clear need for central management of the Gallic situation in order to ensure an organised and united response to the challenges we face there. Thus far I have largely filled the role of co-ordinator myself however due to being presently located in Pannonia this has lead to some inevitable complications. I feel that Transalpine Gaul may benefit from co-ordination by a Senator more close to the action itself. My prefered candidate for such an office would likely be (Immaculate) however I would of course need to discuss the appointment with my fellow Consul before making a firm decision.
Seon
Not An Evil Liar
Consul Bruscius, I must protest your decision to throw the Republic of Gaul to the proverbial wolves. As a senator of Rome and a Legatus of a province, he was, like it or not, a representative of the Roman government to the rest of the world. If we are to make any kind of diplomatic progress with the rest of the world, we must prove now that we are capable of making and honoring agreements made with other nations of the world.
I urge you to reconsider your decision regarding the Republic of Gaul. I trust that you, as consul, will be able to portray our nation well in the eyes of the world.
I urge you to reconsider your decision regarding the Republic of Gaul. I trust that you, as consul, will be able to portray our nation well in the eyes of the world.
Ekolite
Deity
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Also GK I would recommend that as well as there being more yes votes then no votes, a minimum number of yes votes is also required for a law to pass into effect. Otherwise it will become very easy to pass laws with little support in the senate essentially due to them becoming lost in the thread and not attracting much attention or debate. A minimum requirement for passing would create more of a need for debate between players as proponents of laws would need to gain the support of a greater number of players, and it would also encourage more players to vote then are currently doing so (as their allies will have a much stronger incentive to persuade them). A minimum requirement would also help whittle down the number of laws which pass into effect, if this turn is anything to go by without such a requirement so many laws will be passed that it will soon become very confusing, and difficult to take them all into account.
Terrance888
Discord Reigns
Vibius Plotius Agatopus Comments on Proposed Law 1.3.17
I suggest that the Rhine and the Northern Seas shall be added to the bounds of the Overseer of Gaul. If necessary this can be extended later.
I also suggest giving the Overseer more specific advisory or commanding power over the Governors, Generals and/or Envoys who may be acting in the region. Whether it shall be in public- such as an informal, region specific bill- or private in such a way that disobeying his orders (without a good cause) can amount to treason -such as sending a copy of directives to the Consuls. Such a position needs strength behind it to ensure that it's intended role is followed.
OOC: @ Ekolite, I'm pretty sure he gathers together the final versions of the laws together in one post when the Voting phase begins.
I suggest that the Rhine and the Northern Seas shall be added to the bounds of the Overseer of Gaul. If necessary this can be extended later.
I also suggest giving the Overseer more specific advisory or commanding power over the Governors, Generals and/or Envoys who may be acting in the region. Whether it shall be in public- such as an informal, region specific bill- or private in such a way that disobeying his orders (without a good cause) can amount to treason -such as sending a copy of directives to the Consuls. Such a position needs strength behind it to ensure that it's intended role is followed.
OOC: @ Ekolite, I'm pretty sure he gathers together the final versions of the laws together in one post when the Voting phase begins.
