LK23 - Regent, America

LKendter

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!
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LKendter (just a commentator)
Rain (on deck)
Pagan (skipped)
D9phoenix (currently playing)



Dropped
Plux

4000 BC - We get a bad starting position - Snow is spotted :(
Our scout checks out the nearby hut - empty.
3900 BC - Washington is formed - fresh water, a wheat and fish square after border expansion.
Scout is ordered to maximize the goodie hut search - the best advantage of expansionist.
Change tile being working in Washington the square the worker is improving.
Start research on Alphabet - I always want a jump on the library.

3700 BC - Find a goodie hut - Ceromonial burial.
Scout completed - order a warrior.
New scout opens a goodie hut - Bronze working.

3500 BC - Complete warrior - order another.

3400 BC - Switch Washington warrior to settler - thanks to wheat - city expands in 7 - settler completes in 9.

3200 BC - Goodie hut gives up maps :crazyeye:

3100 BC - Washington start Pyramids - this will be our ONLY good wonder city looking at map.

Summary - This is a isolated start - we are ALONE on this continent - Game plan is forced - alphabet, writing, MapMaking - Build the Lighthouse.
If it takes to long to find other civs...


Our island - and city building plan - the objective - a lot of low corruption cities near the capitial - military building is a lower priority - just fill in the island ASAP - get temples to lock borders.

Our city building plan


Logic behind plan - get maximum coverage of land - cities close to capital for less corrutpion.
1 - Our next best city - plus Ivory is ours.
2 - Includes fish, game - 2 very good squares.
3 - claims all of the penisulla.
4 - Start temple, then claims whale and fish after temple - could turn out to be our iron city.
5 - Low priority - with harbor will bring in revenue.
6 - Needs forest cleared - game square helps a lot - decent city after other forest is cleared.
7 - Another great potential for Iron, claims silks.


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/LK23-3050BC.zip



24 hours to verify you can play your turn, 48 hours to play.
 

Rain

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Feb 28, 2002
Messages
699
I have it :egypt:
 

Rain

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Feb 28, 2002
Messages
699
Ten turns goes really fast :eek:


3050 BC Rain I assumes leadership of the Americans

3000 BC Our settler moves to the planned city location. We scout some peninsulas. A new land mass is spotted not far from site 2.

2950 BC Another land mass is spotted off the coast of site 3.

2900 MW (movement/work)

2850 The city of Rain is founded.

2800 Rain is working on a warrior. Science spending is increased to knock 5 turns of Alphabet.

2750 MW

2710 MW The NE penisula is fully explored without much of note.

2670 MW

2 630 Rain completes a warrior; starts on a settler.

2590 Road to Rain will be complete in one turn. Needs a new mine then. 7 turns to alphabet. May want to revise Science spending at that point.

Rain retires from leadership of the Americans.
 

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Rain

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And here is the save :egypt:
 

LKendter

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!
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Continues to look like I was right -
MapMaking / Great Lighthouse are the key goals.

Not much to say for awhile.
Only imporant thing - we will want to improve Washingon squares are some point.


LKendter
Rain
Plux (currently playing)
Pagan (on deck)
 

Rain

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Feb 28, 2002
Messages
699
I figured that was next on the agenda as soon as Rain was set for settler production i.e 2 squares developed. Washinton shouldnt hit 3 til the worker is free to get back there.:egypt:
 

ChrTh

Happy Yule!
Joined
Oct 13, 2001
Messages
6,255
Location
Piedmont Triad, North Carolina
This is both a great and a horrible start...

Great, because you can build up your core cities without other Civs pissing you off...

Horrible, because if the other civs are in contact with one another, you may find yourself WAY behind in the Tech race (unless they've started fighting one another)

Has there been any mention of what other civs are in this game?
 

Rain

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Feb 28, 2002
Messages
699
I'll check my .Sav and see... Hmmmm well besides the Ugly Americans (us as opposed to u.s.) Our incredibly accurate demographic pollster and phrenologist Benedict Gallop :rolleyes: suggests we shall at some point encounter civs known as the Zealous Zulu (Schizophrenic), the Aggressive Aztecs (psychotic), the Fantical French (Christian zealots), the Geriatric Germans (meglomaniacs) and the Itinerant Iroquois (suffer from ADHD) at a bare minimum. :egypt:
 

Plux

Emperor
Joined
Mar 3, 2002
Messages
373
Location
the Netherlands
2590 BC: Our noble leader Rain I dies young and expectedly. After a very short period of mourning, Plux I rises up and takes lead over the Americans. Lots to be done, so little time...

1- 2550BC: Road to Rain completed! Are worker is set to hunt down those elephants south of the city, as the citizens of Washington will soon begin to express their anxiety for ivory necklaces. Our scouts wander around picking their noses

2- 2510BC: Worker is beginning to chase the first elephant. A royal slave hears leader Plux mumbling about the bad judgement of his predecessor Rain I; it's a pity that the city of Rain was not settled one tile north, then it would use the grassland two tiles east of Wahington, and the small peninsula would be better to settle. Oh well..

3- 2470BC:One scout is tired from the first 1500 years of exploring, and is put to rest in the city of Washington. The other finishes off the coasts of this little continent we will call 'North-America'.

4- 2430BC: MW
5- 2390BC: MW
6- 2350BC: MW

7- 2310BC: Our scientists come up with a big box full of things they call letters. Seems nice, but if you cannot put them on paper, they look pretty wothless, so they are told to study Writing. Our worker is set to build roads and mine near Washington

8-13: MW

14- 2070BC: Our scout in the west meets some petty barbarians and returns home as there remains nothing to be explored. Rain has finally finished setting up two citizens to settle new lands. They will go to the area west of Washington to form a new spicy city and are accompanied by Rain's warrior to slay them barbarians. Rain will form a spearman.

15- 2030BC:MW

16- 1990BC: As our great capitol Washington grows size 4, we need to contain it's growth as it will only lead to uproar. The worker is set to mine the hills, for more production and less food.

17-19: MW

20: Our warrior defeats the barbarian that came after the scout!

21- 1790 BC: Pluxity is founded on a nice spot near game and spice, and is set to build a spearman. Of course Plux I is helping during the buildup, but when he wants to have a taste of the spices he is food-poisoned and dies. That shows to always leave the spice-exploitation to certified workers and citizens..

It's clear that we will have to get to mapmaking as soon as possible, it's pretty boring like this :) Maybe Washington should be switched to Colossus as we are getting behind in tech, and Washington will be a great city for it. Will grow big without an aquaduct (lake), so will make lots of trade. I do not think we really need the Pyramids as we might not even succeed in expanding a lot, so we could just build granaries. If Washington is switched it can already start building settlers so that we can quickly develop our surrounding islands, once we get to mapmaking. And of course it's a good idea to start a palace for that Lighthouse in Rain after it has completed the next settler.

Mind you that barbarians are to the left, so we could chase them with our warrior. One scout is left in Washington and if you look closely to the right, you see the border of the German empire. No settling there?? :'(
 

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LKendter

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!
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@ Plux -
This is a max of **TEN** moves game.
Please limit to ten in the future.

With our new knowledge of the world - I agree with shifting the city to yellow dot. Still a low corruption site.

The settler is starting to SOON in Rain. When the city goes to size 2, another shield may gained. If the shield is kept, the settler will be stuck waiting for city growth. My suggestion - another warrior - for Washington (get max military police), then the settler.

@Rain - since this is a learning game, why was Rain put in the spot it was? It did NOT match my dot map (of which Plux found a flaw, and has killed city site #2.

The learning game will work the best if we talk reasons why!
 

LKendter

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!
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here are your ground rules:

You start the game by playing 20 turns, then one full rotation of your team, then 10 more turns. After that, the rotation continues WITHOUT YOU, unless you feel the need to take some turns (the group is in dire straits, you really want to play, etc.). Note that your place outside the rotation does not excuse you from the game--you'll be needed even more.

Each Veteran starts his (or her; on the Internet, no one knows you're a dog) own game with the following settings:
Regent Level
Random Civ
Standard Map
Roaming Barbarians
All Opponents should be Random, with one NONE (one less opponent than typical)
The Geography should be fully Random
 

Rain

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Feb 28, 2002
Messages
699
Well i didnt put it where your dot was because that was a hill square. The settler should have been finished ok if the worker had built a mine on the shield square as i suggested in my last note. If not then a micro managment check could have allowed switching to a warrior. I left it on settler becuase that was the ultimate goal but the reuslts owuld depend on what the next player did. We didnt need a road to luxuries right off. Alternatively if the mine wasnt going to be built then the production should have been switched to a warrior I agree. But with no barb threat at that end. The mine made more sense to me. We didnt need a road to luxuries right off given we could shuffle warriors to Washington as Rain produced settlers and dropped back to pop 1.


Since you started the pyramids in Washington (not something i would have done btw but thats another issue) the next city had to have decent growth for settler creation and building on a hill wasnt helping that. Washington is the only city with fresh water that is going to rapidly grow and putting the city on the hill meant it would also have more overlap with washington. Less overlap with your cap means less corruption. The site on the peninsula was always going to be mainly a harbour city and still could be put there in my opinion. Its matter of choice as to crowding Washington or crowding the other two. :egypt:
 

Pagan

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Apr 5, 2002
Messages
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Location
Menomonee Falls, Wisconsin
Nice work man. I won't be home for another 5 hours so I'll just sit at work and think about it. (Not like I do much anyways here).


I think your right, since the pyramid only works for all cities on a continent it's probably better we are more productive rather than wasting all those shields on growth. Granaries are cheap and we really don't need them yet.

I'll play with this more when I get home. :D
 

Plux

Emperor
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Mar 3, 2002
Messages
373
Location
the Netherlands
Building a city on a hill gives the same center tile as building on plains/grassland so that's one thing you've learned. Gives extra defense bonus as well, so too bad you didn't knew that. Also I don't understand what you mean by 'closer to capital, more corruption'. The general rule is the other way around, but if you mean 'less overlap, more resources per city' you're right. Only now we miss that fertile grassland tile, which is pretty regrettable.

How are the opinions on switching Washington to Colossus?

PS: sorry about the 20 turns, I must have overlooked some rule somewhere.
 

Plux

Emperor
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one other thing on the settler
Originally posted by Rain
Well i didnt put it where your dot was because that was a hill square. The settler should have been finished ok if the worker had built a mine on the shield square as i suggested in my last note. If not then a micro managment check could have allowed switching to a warrior. I left it on settler becuase that was the ultimate goal but the reuslts owuld depend on what the next player did. We didnt need a road to luxuries right off. Alternatively if the mine wasnt going to be built then the production should have been switched to a warrior I agree. But with no barb threat at that end. The mine made more sense to me. We didnt need a road to luxuries right off given we could shuffle warriors to Washington as Rain produced settlers and dropped back to pop 1.
The settler you started in Rain WAS finished, that's where Pluxity came from. The ivory was already necessary since Washington became size 4, and was busy with the Pyramids. We do indeed need to wait for Rain to grow for more settlers, but switching to Colossus now (ready in 9 turns) means we can pop a few settlers out of our capitol quickly, and settle this continent for good.

BTW: Rain, just want to make clear there are no personal attacks here, just commenting on gameplay.
 

Arathorn

Catan player
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Jan 10, 2002
Messages
3,778
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Illinois
Contain growth??????? No, no, no. Always grow at max rate unless you need extra shields ASAP. In this case, there's a shielded grassland in range that will provide the same shields as the mined hill (once mined). The grass can be mined/roaded faster than the hill can be for the benefit sooner.

If the city would go into disorder, there are a few options.

Make an entertainer/taxman/scientist: This population point is doing SOMETHING for you, whether it's simply keeping the other people happy or providing one beaker/gold per turn, it's something and helpful. Plus, he's around later when you need a settler/worker.

More MP: Either there originally or produced in another city and sent there for that purpose. Limits fog-busting and requires another city to possibly give up its own defense. Still a better option than specialist, though, if a unit is at all available.

Increase the luxury rate a bit: This is even better. The new pop point BETTER be providing two arrows (put him on the lake if nothing else -- until the shielded grass is roaded). The capital (if wonder-building) will almost assuredly be the only city with enough trade to actually notice the 10% of luxury. This gives the best of all possible worlds, with the new population point getting the trade to keep itself happy while still building towards more pop and more shields.

More :smoke: in Rain's comments. The square a city is founded on ALWAYS produces two food and one shield -- whether it was desert, tundra, or a hill. Thus, the hill city will grow as fast as where you placed it -- even faster because it would've had access to more grass.

Less overlap means less corruption?? Nope. Overlap has nothing to do with corruption. Actually, the overlap with the capital would've meant the second city would've been founded closer to the capital, meaning LESS corruption there, not more. And the overlap would only really be an issue after hospitals, at which point the non-capital city can give up its squares a bit.

As far as the Pyramids so early go, I won't comment unless asked to.

It's hard to comment more without more in-depth reports. Please indicate your thinking and ALL moves in the early going (worker where why, etc.). 10 turns is short (especially EARLY) so it's easy to give exact details. With those in hand, it's easier to spot weedy moves.

Just some random comments,
Arathorn
 

Rain

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Joined
Feb 28, 2002
Messages
699
Also I don't understand what you mean by 'closer to capital, more corruption'.

From my reading of the posts on corruption and my own observations the more cities that are in close proximity to the capital the sooner you will hit corruption in outer cities. I understand what you mean in saying that that generally the farther a city is from the cap the more corruption it generates. But by keeping your initial cities, farther from the capital you can have more good core cities with less corruption. That is you can have say 8 cities in a small space or a 8 cities in a larger space. Corruption wont be much different but you have bigger cities.

And has to the point about the hill re food, no i wasnt aware ( or had forgottten) so thanks for pointing that out. As to the defense bonus, that I am aware of but its something i seldom give much wieght too unless thier are special circircumstances (e.g. border with a nasty neighbour). :egypt:
 

Rain

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Messages
699
Originally posted by Plux
one other thing on the settler
The settler you started in Rain WAS finished, that's where Pluxity came from. The ivory was already necessary since Washington became size 4, and was busy with the Pyramids. We do indeed need to wait for Rain to grow for more settlers, but switching to Colossus now (ready in 9 turns) means we can pop a few settlers out of our capitol quickly, and settle this continent for good.

BTW: Rain, just want to make clear there are no personal attacks here, just commenting on gameplay.

No problem :)

Re settler I was just responding to LK's post about starting the settler too soon :egypt:
 
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