March 18th (3/18) Hotfix

[ExpiredReign]

Just received a city state quest to build the Murano Glassworks. Problem is, I'm not Venice, nor is anyone else in my game.

Edit: Received another for the Arsenale di Venezia, so looks like all of the new Venice wonders aren't flagged right.

I too received this quest and was about to make the same report, so +1 to this.

 

[Atlas627]

On a similar note, I've gotten quests for those wonders as Venice, and of course once I build the "wrong" one they never go away. Not sure if it takes up a "quest slot" or something, but it does clutter the UI.

 

[regenshine]

I think to get one spy with statecraft rank 1 is to early. On Deity the AI assassinated my Great Engineer and I had no chance to counter it. I mean, yeah, I could invest also in statecraft rank 1 but that's forcing me to a predefined way.

 

[Gazebo]

I too received this quest and was about to make the same report, so +1 to this.

It is known, yep. Thanks for reporting.

G

 

[kaspergm]

It should be giving culture in the CBP, not gold. If just using the CP, it probably still scales the gold to game speed but I doubt it does it per era. Only G would know.

Yes, I'm only using CP. I guess I'll just scale down the gold yield from 100 gold to 50 gold as base, to make it more balanced.

 

[Gazebo]

Yes, I'm only using CP. I guess I'll just scale down the gold yield from 100 gold to 50 gold as base, to make it more balanced.

This is something I can revert, however it felt like a bugfix, as some instant yields in the base game scaled, and others did not. It was inconsistent. I made it so that all scale for the sake of that consistency.

G

 

[Gazebo]

Update:

I'll be working on bugfixes tonight and tomorrow, but reports are quite scattered at present. I've tried to write down the ones I see, but I know I've missed some. I'd greatly appreciate any assistance in organizing and collating reported bugs since 3/18 either here, or on github.

Also, in the interest of discussion, how's the new Authority scaler feeling? Also Pantheon and new UA balance? We can discuss this in their appropriate threads, but I'm curious to see how things are shaking out.

G

 

[Atlas627]

Update:
Also Pantheon and new UA balance? We can discuss this in their appropriate threads, but I'm curious to see how things are shaking out.

G

There are definitely some weak pantheons, but I haven't had time to test all of them. The Unique Luxury one seems particularly weak.

As for UAs, I've just been trying to extensively test Venice so far. Glassworks is bonkers OP (won culture victory before corporations on continents, with 80% of my tourism coming from the Glassworks), and imo the most fun (so I haven't gotten a chance to try the other buildings with a good strategy)

 

[Enrico Swagolo]

Update:

I'll be working on bugfixes tonight and tomorrow, but reports are quite scattered at present. I've tried to write down the ones I see, but I know I've missed some. I'd greatly appreciate any assistance in organizing and collating reported bugs since 3/18 either here, or on github.

Also, in the interest of discussion, how's the new Authority scaler feeling? Also Pantheon and new UA balance? We can discuss this in their appropriate threads, but I'm curious to see how things are shaking out.

G

Authority seems fine. I still prefer Progress but it's fine and not broken. Tradition is now the worst early tree (unless you're Korea/Arabia and/or took mastery, in which case it's probably broken)

Pantheon wise, God of the Sun is the worst pantheon in the game, with only +1C+1F per only one, rare resource (Wheat) and a mere +2Food in Granary. I never take it and an AI who takes it inhibits both his early and late faith growth, all for a silly 2F. I made some suggestions on this one already before, like maybe +1Faith or Production or something for every two worked Farms, or just +1F/+1F from Granary. Even on Wheat starts I never take it, it's too weak.

Besides that it's sort of balanced, but perhaps Ancestor Worship should get a tiny nerf to faith to compensate for +1F+1C per city council? It's just my opinion though but it's pretty easy to get it to give you the most F from all the pantheons (especially now it isn't even weak early on unlike it was previously) and it's no longer even weaker early than others (if anything it starts just as strong or stronger and only ever goes up).

UA I can't say, didn't play any of the changed UA civs yet, been playing new games lately so had little time to deviate from my fav civs.

 

[Gazebo]

There are definitely some weak pantheons, but I haven't had time to test all of them. The Unique Luxury one seems particularly weak.

As for UAs, I've just been trying to extensively test Venice so far. Glassworks is bonkers OP (won culture victory before corporations on continents, with 80% of my tourism coming from the Glassworks), and imo the most fun (so I haven't gotten a chance to try the other buildings with a good strategy)

What about glassworks is breaking balance? The on-improvement Tourism?

Authority seems fine. I still prefer Progress but it's fine and not broken. Tradition is now the worst early tree (unless you're Korea/Arabia and/or took mastery, in which case it's probably broken)

Pantheon wise, God of the Sun is the worst pantheon in the game, with only +1C+1F per only one, rare resource (Wheat) and a mere +2Food in Granary. I never take it and an AI who takes it inhibits both his early and late faith growth, all for a silly 2F. I made some suggestions on this one already before, like maybe +1Faith or Production or something for every two worked Farms, or just +1F/+1F from Granary. Even on Wheat starts I never take it, it's too weak.

Besides that it's sort of balanced, but perhaps Ancestor Worship should get a tiny nerf to faith to compensate for +1F+1C per city council? It's just my opinion though but it's pretty easy to get it to give you the most F from all the pantheons (especially now it isn't even weak early on unlike it was previously) and it's no longer even weaker early than others (if anything it starts just as strong or stronger and only ever goes up).

UA I can't say, didn't play any of the changed UA civs yet, been playing new games lately so had little time to deviate from my fav civs.

I'm considering a small yield bump on the Tradition buildings by +1.

God of the Sun needs love, yes, and All-Creation needs a pantheon cap (I'm thinking 1/2 the # of pantheons instead of the full amount). Probably could reduce the per pop on Ancestor Worship a hair.

G

 

[kaspergm]

This is a bug I've been experiencing for the last several couple of versions - I don't know if it's you or Ilteroi who's working on this, but whenever I have a unit moving in foreign territory, moving the unit through a foreign city will consume all its movement when it exits the city. Here's a screenshot showing what I'm talking about - the unit stops when exiting Berlin, even though it should move several more hexes since all tiles have road.

Spoiler :

Another movement issue which is not exactly a bug but rather an optimization issue, but still very annoying is the fact that a unit will walk off a road if it can't consume all its movement on a road because the tile it can reach on the current turn is occupied. This means the unit will use a full movement point moving back on the road on the next turn, causing it to reach its destination later than it would have, had it instead forfeit the last part of its movement on the turn before.

 

[Atlas627]

What about glassworks is breaking balance? The on-improvement Tourism?

Right. The food ensures you can work all the tiles, and that means that you have a Great Work for each tile in your capital...at the cost of other things of course. Its too good right now though, but making it 2f1t might be too weak.

I'm considering a small yield bump on the Tradition buildings by +1.

I'm not sure this is necessary, but I've been playing all Venice since the patch so...

God of the Sun needs love, yes, and All-Creation needs a pantheon cap (I'm thinking 1/2 the # of pantheons instead of the full amount). Probably could reduce the per pop on Ancestor Worship a hair.

G

God of the Sun is a little weak. Ancestor worship seems fine to me since it doesn't provide as much in the way of non-faith yields.

I don't think All-Creation needs a lower cap. Keep in mind that it provides no faith, its bonuses don't scale with number OR size of cities, and for each extra pantheon that can/does exist you have one more to compete with to found/spread a religion. Please leave All-Creation as-is.

 

[Gazebo]

Right. The food ensures you can work all the tiles, and that means that you have a Great Work for each tile in your capital...at the cost of other things of course. Its too good right now though, but making it 2f1t might be too weak.




I'm not sure this is necessary, but I've been playing all Venice since the patch so...



God of the Sun is a little weak. Ancestor worship seems fine to me since it doesn't provide as much in the way of non-faith yields.

I don't think All-Creation needs a lower cap. Keep in mind that it provides no faith, its bonuses don't scale with number OR size of cities, and for each extra pantheon that can/does exist you have one more to compete with to found/spread a religion. Please leave All-Creation as-is.

Two AI test games over the weekend revealed that Pangaea + Brazil + God of All Creation = hilariously early Culture Victory. Problematic.

G

 

[Atlas627]

Two AI test games over the weekend revealed that Pangaea + Brazil + God of All Creation = hilariously early Culture Victory. Problematic.

G

Pangaea + Brazil is leading to silly early Culture Victories too.

Perhaps the solution is to change the Culture Victory, as it is one of only 2 victories that can be completed at any time, but the other at least lets the AI resist.

How about a new National Wonder, unlocked when you unlock Ideologies (so if you fill 3 branches, build factories, or get into the Modern Era), called "National Identity". Gives the effect of the policy in Aesthetics that boosts tourism and enables Cultural Victory (we could change the Aesthetics policy to be something less required for Cultural Victories while being near useless for everyone else)

This would bring it to a point somewhere inbetween Domination and Science/Diplomacy as far as victory timings are concerned.

 

[Gazebo]

Pangaea + Brazil is leading to silly early Culture Victories too.

Perhaps the solution is to change the Culture Victory, as it is one of only 2 victories that can be completed at any time, but the other at least lets the AI resist.

How about a new National Wonder, unlocked when you unlock Ideologies (so if you fill 3 branches, build factories, or get into the Modern Era), called "National Identity". Gives the effect of the policy in Aesthetics that boosts tourism and enables Cultural Victory (we could change the Aesthetics policy to be something less required for Cultural Victories while being near useless for everyone else)

This would bring it to a point somewhere inbetween Domination and Science/Diplomacy as far as victory timings are concerned.

I don't think changing a core mechanic of the game's victory conditions is worth retaining an aspect of a pantheon belief. God of All Creation just needs a rebalance, and Brazil's UA a little more balance, that's all.

G

 

[Atlas627]

I don't think changing a core mechanic of the game's victory conditions is worth retaining an aspect of a pantheon belief. God of All Creation just needs a rebalance, and Brazil's UA a little more balance, that's all.

G

I think the core mechanic has been busted ever since we gave tourism in the early and mid-game.

This would also solve the problem I mentioned with Venice. I've had this problem as Byzantium too.

This would solve a lot of problems. I'm not suggesting it just to save the pantheon and Brazil's UA. That's just the last straw

 

[Gazebo]

I think the core mechanic has been busted ever since we gave tourism in the early and mid-game.

This would also solve the problem I mentioned with Venice. I've had this problem as Byzantium too.

This would solve a lot of problems. I'm not suggesting it just to save the pantheon and Brazil's UA. That's just the last straw

Mayhaps. I don't necessarily like the idea of time-gating culture victories, but science/diplo are also time-gated. A WW that unlocks @ all influential could be fun. I'll look into it.

G

 

[Atlas627]

Mayhaps. I don't necessarily like the idea of time-gating culture victories, but science/diplo are also time-gated. A WW that unlocks @ all influential could be fun. I'll look into it.

G

I'm not sure if that would help at all. You mean a WW that has a tech and needs all influential? That would help.

Culture victories were time-gated in vanilla by virtue of no tourism being available until lategame. Letting people get the smaller levels of tourism bonuses earlygame is great, but that also means nothing prevents an early victory if all civs are met somehow.

At least Domination is gated by the ability of your opponents to resist while you fall behind in economy, which could cause the victory to get delayed until modern era.

Letting CVs happen starting at the modern era would be closer to vanilla (good for a "vanilla enhancement/balance mod"), make flavor sense (nobody would call that a victory in earlier ages, they'd just go conquer them once they're the envy of the world, assuming the people care at all), stop all these weird scenarios that were caused by enabling early tourism, and be a nice mid-point between early Domination strats and Diplo/Science victories.

Anyway, thanks for taking a look at it. You're the best!

 

[Gazebo]

I'm not sure if that would help at all. You mean a WW that has a tech and needs all influential? That would help.

Culture victories were time-gated in vanilla by virtue of no tourism being available until lategame. Letting people get the smaller levels of tourism bonuses earlygame is great, but that also means nothing prevents an early victory if all civs are met somehow.

At least Domination is gated by the ability of your opponents to resist while you fall behind in economy, which could cause the victory to get delayed until modern era.

Letting CVs happen starting at the modern era would be closer to vanilla (good for a "vanilla enhancement/balance mod"), make flavor sense (nobody would call that a victory in earlier ages, they'd just go conquer them once they're the envy of the world, assuming the people care at all), stop all these weird scenarios that were caused by enabling early tourism, and be a nice mid-point between early Domination strats and Diplo/Science victories.

Anyway, thanks for taking a look at it. You're the best!

It's one of those ideas that I've been thinking about for some time, but just never got around to really investigating it. I wouldn't tech-gate it, though, I'd ideology-gate it. And I probably wouldn't do a Wonder.

In essence, I'd just tweak it so that you have to have an ideology and influential with all civs in order to win a Cultural Victory (the idea being that a 'Cultural Victory' isn't just about Cultural influence, it is about a specific world-view becoming dominant).

G

 

[Atlas627]

It's one of those ideas that I've been thinking about for some time, but just never got around to really investigating it. I wouldn't tech-gate it, though, I'd ideology-gate it. And I probably wouldn't do a Wonder.

In essence, I'd just tweak it so that you have to have an ideology and influential with all civs in order to win a Cultural Victory (the idea being that a 'Cultural Victory' isn't just about Cultural influence, it is about a specific world-view becoming dominant).

G

I think that will work just fine.

I'm not sure that a Cultural Victory is about world-view. The impression I got is that your culture has permeated the masses of all the other nations to the point where you are regarded as the height of civilization, but it is still distinctly "your" culture. This only makes sense in the modern era, since it is only recently that the common people have enough knowledge of the rest of the world to know that somewhere else has it better. Even more important is that they CARE that somewhere else has it better, because its possible to a) move there or b) get their stuff to come here.

So I'm not sure that Ideology works thematically, but it should do the trick gameplay-wise. Maybe Ideology is necessary to have that national identity stay distinctly foreign when spreading to other countries? Just trying to see if there's a way to justify the flavor, but its not that important.