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Mathematics can estimate the date of Adam and Eve

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Kruelgor, Feb 19, 2011.

  1. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    So, lets say you believe you were not designed, but you were a product of randomness.

    Some will argue there is no such thing as randomness, as there are forces which drives every tiny element. Randomness is just a state of something where your brain can't comprehend the reasoning behind its actions and movements.

    Now, lets say you were indeed created by randomness. Then the question still remains, what created the elements involved with the randomness?

    What?
     
  2. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    I thought this thread was about maths :(

    Of course there is such a thing as randomness (see: quantum mechanics).
     
  3. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    Explain.

    Quantum mechanics, also known as quantum physics or quantum THEORY
     
  4. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    Like the theory of gravity.

    How do you think transistors work? Magic? Hint: quantum theory.
     
  5. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    Let's do this. We can do a "worse case" scenario where say the average life expectancy is 25 years old, the average birth rate is 3 kids per female. Figure it out and that would definitely be the maximum years ago. It would be very safe to assume that whatever date you come up with, that the real date is much less time ago. I can also guarantee you that the years proposed by the THEORY of evolution would be way off from our results.

    The point here is randomness. The human brain is incapable of predicting the pattern of randomness, it's just a word that we developed to conveniently justify our inability.
     
  6. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    So probability theory is nonsense then?
     
  7. uppi

    uppi Deity

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    Do you want to come into my lab and see how quantum mechanics can accurately predict how nature works? And yes that involves randomness.


    But back to your original Post: It is just plain wrong, and you are lying. This "model" uses exactly one data point: the population today. It then uses and assumption that humans were created 6000 years ago and then makes the calculation (in a very stupid way I have to say...).

    And if you compare the data coming out of this with real data, it does not fit at all (e.g. the population in 1850 was not 3 billion but more like one billion).

    So you put in the result you want to get and then you get the result you want (and contradict real data in the process) and then you say that this estimates the date of Adam and Eve. This is an outright lie.

    [insert rant about deceiving and lying Creationists here]
     
  8. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    So back to how you came into existence. If you don't believe you were created/designed then the only other option you could possibly believe in is that you are a product of randomness. So "randomness" is your god. I don't believe anything can be random. If I toss a box of marbles onto the floor, they appear to bounce around on the floor in a random fashion, but that's only because our brains are too inferior to pre-calculate the projection of each marble.
     
  9. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    Sounds reasonable to me. At least it has evidence supporting it.
     
  10. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    Even if randomness is valid, there are the elements which are being randomized. Then we are back to the same question, what created/designed those elements? Only a creator/designer could had.
     
  11. Gustave5436

    Gustave5436 Emperor

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    And the cosmic rays which damage a DNA molecule, causing mutations which are then propagated according to genetic drift, natural selection, etc. are just as deterministic. Calling evolution "random" just because you don't understand it, is just as illogical as calling the trajectories of the marbles random because you lack sufficient data about their initial conditions.

    Who designed the creator?

    In order to create us, he must have been even more complex than we are. But if we are too complex to have come into existence through natural, deterministic processes, then surely it must have been even more impossible for him to arise.
     
  12. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    You are describing functions, causes and effects. Everything which requires a designer/creator.
     
  13. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    Is mathematics created or discovered?

    How come mathematics is inconsistent? (There are statements which are true but cannot be proved to be true).
     
  14. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    Mathematics cannot exist without a unit. It's that unit that was created/designed.

    That's where it gets mind boggling. Just as mind boggling as fathoming the universe that never ends, but goes on for infinity. Infinity? The two are related if not one in the same. The creator and the universe.
     
  15. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    No idea what you mean by "a unit" - that means an element of a ring which has a multiplicative inverse to me ;)

    How do you know the universe is infinite? I'm pretty sure you'd win a Nobel Prize or something if you could prove that ;)
     
  16. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    It would make much more sense for the universe to never end, than it would for there to be a wall there.
     
  17. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    You can have a topological space which never ends but which is not infinite. Like the surface of a balloon.
     
  18. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    Example, our knowledge of mathematics began with man counting objects. If those objects had never existed in the first place there never would have been mathematics. Those objects were designed/created. Therefore, mathematics is a side effect result of the existence of objects.

    No objects in the universe and there is no mathematics.
     
  19. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

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    So, mathematics can account for the complete lack of genetic abnormalities, with eight people allegedly fathering a race of six billion people? Or did "God do it" to make things easier?
     
  20. Kruelgor

    Kruelgor Emperor

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    What's above and below the balloon?
     

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