New Beta Patch - 1/15
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stormfallen
Warlord
- Joined
- Mar 24, 2013
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- 123
It seems like Haciendas can inadvertently reveal hidden strategic and bonus resource locations. Replacing the mine north-east of Seville should reduce the tile's production by 3 (Seville has no visible resources under it), but instead EUI says it's only reduced it by 1.
For comparison, here's what replacing another mine with a Hacienda would do:
Similarly, here's a tile with no adjacent visible bonus resources saying a Hacienda will give 3 food instead of 1:
And sure enough, there's fish next to it:
Spoiler :
For comparison, here's what replacing another mine with a Hacienda would do:
Spoiler :
Similarly, here's a tile with no adjacent visible bonus resources saying a Hacienda will give 3 food instead of 1:
Spoiler :
And sure enough, there's fish next to it:
Spoiler :
Ultimately SV turned into an easy victory. Once again though I was the 3rd to get all of the SS part techs....I won with ease. No other civ had finished more than 1 part. I had several diplomats and thieves in their cities, and looking at them not a single city was building a SS part that I could see, so I don't know what the heck the AI was doing but it certainly wasn't trying to win
This is clearly worth addressing.
youngsteve
Prince
That is a general problem as well if buying units (same for AI) they are just put in the most vulnerable position in a war & usually killed. I liked the old rule whereby if you gain a unit or have to move one, it is put in the city & you are given the choice of where to put it in that radius.
LifeOfBrian
King
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2019
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- 757
RedHotTomato, I agree, that's why I suggested it should be placed back to the tile from where it launched the attack on the city, preferably with the remaining movement points.
AndreyK
King
When your GW of Art goes to castle you can't see it and you can't move it
General_Drax
Warlord
You can move and see it from city screen or using the automatic optimize. In culture screen the Castle slot became Mission slot.
RedHotTomato
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2017
- Messages
- 49
I just realize splash damage from siege units damages air unit in the city if the unit you are attacking is adjacent to the city. Is it as intended?
Standard Communitas_79 Deity with Poland. DV on Turn 348.
A pretty straightforward game. I originally was planning Progress with Poland but tried a Beauty + Tradition strat that I had wanted to try to get the Great Library, which actually worked. Ultimately I establish a solid 6 cities, and Arabia to my east was squeezed between Egypt and I, so once I had Winged Hussars I made a push right for his capital, and took it out relatively easily, vassalizing Arabia. I kept going against Egypt but he was much stronger, I managed to puppet one city of his and while I exchanged fire with him for a long time eventually I just didn't see the point in continuing the war, at this point Egypt had been knocked out of the top spot and Korea started doing what Korea does so I saved my strength in case it was needed to stop a runaway.
Arabia had a strong vote position (more votes than me for a good portion of the game), so DV was the plan. Ultimately it was a peaceful game after my conquests, I did a lot of tech tree and strategic resource trading with the AI, maintained a DP with Inca and Korea for a good portion of the game (broke off the DP with Korea later on in case it was needed).
With the raw science of Order and good trades I was able to stay level with Korea, even surpassing him tech wise for a time with Great Leap Forward. As Hegemony approached Arabia and I had a clean sweep of the votes, but Arabia was up for Independence so I kept a SV in my back pocket. And towards the end just for fun I decided to buy Hegemony outright, I secured votes from Portugal, Inca, and Indonesia for a total of like 5 techs and 1200 GPT. Hegemony was won with over 60 votes, the most I have had in quite a long time.
My notes:
1) Sometimes Poland gets a bad rap for being a "bland" civ but I quite like them. Their culture boost allows you to get early wonders you normally couldn't' snag, and its nice to be able to focus on science and culture just "takes care of itself". Winged Hussars are also a fun tactical problem in their own right, but quite strong if handled correctly.
2) Second game in a row I have seen a massive Order block, and no Autocracy taken. Two does not make a pattern yet but its on the watch list.
3) Most strategic resource trades were reasonable but every so often a civ would go crazy for Iron, like sell me their first born for 1 iron kind of crazy.
4) Recently I did a thread about "would you settle this", and a lot of people said that they would not create cities with only a few deer or sheep because of the limited food. So I wanted to turn your attention to my two southern most cities. Both cities are fairly food light, and by pop are pretty low compared to the rest of the civ. However, they both generate almost as much production as my capital. You don't need a big pop when you are working a ton of mines, these were my main diplomatic and military cities for the whole game.
5) I think the top player should get more votes if he fails to Hegemony. Often I don't even get a second hegemony vote before its time for the Spaceship, so if I do I think it should have a bit more pressure to make it interesting.
Spoiler :
A pretty straightforward game. I originally was planning Progress with Poland but tried a Beauty + Tradition strat that I had wanted to try to get the Great Library, which actually worked. Ultimately I establish a solid 6 cities, and Arabia to my east was squeezed between Egypt and I, so once I had Winged Hussars I made a push right for his capital, and took it out relatively easily, vassalizing Arabia. I kept going against Egypt but he was much stronger, I managed to puppet one city of his and while I exchanged fire with him for a long time eventually I just didn't see the point in continuing the war, at this point Egypt had been knocked out of the top spot and Korea started doing what Korea does so I saved my strength in case it was needed to stop a runaway.
Arabia had a strong vote position (more votes than me for a good portion of the game), so DV was the plan. Ultimately it was a peaceful game after my conquests, I did a lot of tech tree and strategic resource trading with the AI, maintained a DP with Inca and Korea for a good portion of the game (broke off the DP with Korea later on in case it was needed).
With the raw science of Order and good trades I was able to stay level with Korea, even surpassing him tech wise for a time with Great Leap Forward. As Hegemony approached Arabia and I had a clean sweep of the votes, but Arabia was up for Independence so I kept a SV in my back pocket. And towards the end just for fun I decided to buy Hegemony outright, I secured votes from Portugal, Inca, and Indonesia for a total of like 5 techs and 1200 GPT. Hegemony was won with over 60 votes, the most I have had in quite a long time.
My notes:
1) Sometimes Poland gets a bad rap for being a "bland" civ but I quite like them. Their culture boost allows you to get early wonders you normally couldn't' snag, and its nice to be able to focus on science and culture just "takes care of itself". Winged Hussars are also a fun tactical problem in their own right, but quite strong if handled correctly.
2) Second game in a row I have seen a massive Order block, and no Autocracy taken. Two does not make a pattern yet but its on the watch list.
3) Most strategic resource trades were reasonable but every so often a civ would go crazy for Iron, like sell me their first born for 1 iron kind of crazy.
4) Recently I did a thread about "would you settle this", and a lot of people said that they would not create cities with only a few deer or sheep because of the limited food. So I wanted to turn your attention to my two southern most cities. Both cities are fairly food light, and by pop are pretty low compared to the rest of the civ. However, they both generate almost as much production as my capital. You don't need a big pop when you are working a ton of mines, these were my main diplomatic and military cities for the whole game.
5) I think the top player should get more votes if he fails to Hegemony. Often I don't even get a second hegemony vote before its time for the Spaceship, so if I do I think it should have a bit more pressure to make it interesting.
Last edited:
psparky
King
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2011
- Messages
- 623
There are 120 GM currently in the game. You play standard games I believe so that's 15 each on average. Does it make sense that they run out or could there be a bug here?
See the More GPs Module thread for what they are planning, but yes, I think there will be more musicians.
Could be a bug. While I do see writers run out on occasion I see it commonly with musicians.
AHA! I think I found the bug with AI peacing out too easily. Will have to see if this fixes it.
SuperNoobCamper
King
Epic speed, Immortal Difficulty, Standard size, 16 CS, 8 civs, Ruins enabled, no tech trading, no good, neutral or bad events as The Shoshone.
Won a Domination victory at 408 after a prolonged siege of the other continent that housed 5 AIs.
It was a pretty enjoyable match despite the last siege being such a grind it's one of the most enjoyable experiences in pretty much every aspect and i got to try going full red eyed warmonger Authority/Fealty/Imperialism/Autocracy experiencing the extreme difference between warring as Autocracy and Order/Freedom.
Won a Domination victory at 408 after a prolonged siege of the other continent that housed 5 AIs.
Spoiler :
It was a pretty enjoyable match despite the last siege being such a grind it's one of the most enjoyable experiences in pretty much every aspect and i got to try going full red eyed warmonger Authority/Fealty/Imperialism/Autocracy experiencing the extreme difference between warring as Autocracy and Order/Freedom.
- The first change i got to notice is the difference that AI starting scouts do not get experience made playing with ruins and investing early in exploration pays off and i really like it.
- I intentionally have not tributed city states in the early game at all to test if it's sustainable to not abuse tributes and i think it's doable.
- Military AI is superb, Shaka in particular is freaking scary (Shaka vassalized Arabia, Denmark, England and was crushing Mongolia before i came knocking on his door, His fusiliers were murdering mine and if it was not for my nav providing support and threatening his coastal cities he would have won the land battle .... i came again after picking autocracy with a better land forces and bigger numbers breaking the stalemate.
- Comanche Raiders are pretty strange units , i think they are available at a time when skirmisher lines feel the weakest,
- Aluminum is in such a weird spot unlocking on the top part of tech tree, the first unit using aluminium is the light tank but if you beelined it (unlocks at ballistics) you would not be able to build it/upgrade your cavalry ..... i think we could give it the Oil treatment that was moved from biology to combustion to make beelining landships meaningful.
- Prora -again- unlocking later at flight unlike MLC or SOL have a bad mouth feel.
- Autocracy T1: are all amazing and push autocracy's game plan really well;
- Military industrial complex: feels like an always first pick if you go autocracy, it's a huge boost to science and also makes mercenaries cheaper to buy.
- Lebensraum: is an amazing policy as it makes generals a nice merchant/engineer hybrid
- Elite forces: Combined with Brandenburg gate, orders and the three military training buildings makes newly trained units and mercenaries start at level 5 .... terrific.
- Iron fist: not always a first pick as it does something very specific but it's situationally amazing when you are not in control of WC.
- Futurism: makes cultural victory a bit easier, not on par in terms of effect with MIC or Lebensraum but it's solid.
- New world order: my fifth pick most of the time just as a step to get the fourth T2 tenet; it's nice but not game changing.
- United front: moar supply? yes, please.
- Autocracy Tier 2:
- Lightening warfare: Pretty much the reason why i go autocracy in addition to the amazing Air supermacy .... either a first or a second pick depending on the map but it's always a solid domination victory card.
- Commerce Raiders: generates more gold than i thought through prize rules promotion, the Oil from CS alliance is particularly useful, seaport bonus is also a nice topping on the cake.
- Third alternative: i.e. global monopoly on every strategic for more science and less gold spent on maintenance, always a solid pick.
- Martial spirit: A flexing tenet, a nice boost CS but i never picked it to be honest ... competing with other more useful tents.
- Syndicalism: translation: let your vassals keep more cities and profit; solid if thegame is going to last past the late modern era or if you are not going for the domination victory.
- Police state: is this T2 tenet? feels really weak tbh.
- total war: unnecessary bonus to be honest when other tenets are just better.
- Autocracy T3:
- Air Supremacy: The reason i personally choose autocracy in addition to lightening warfare; a gamechanger when it comes to logistics and establishing a foot on other continents and the extra airport space changes the tide of late game battles .... i did not get to try Zeros but nonetheless it's always a first pick
- Tyranny: ok, i was really disappointed with two things .... late game tributes are really low; at 100% i got 600 hammers and 70 influence .... bullying allies cost you the quests.
- Cult of personality: pushes CV considerably, better than Tyranny but not as flashy as Air Supremacy.
As I've gotten used to Deity, something I've noticed about war as I've gone up the difficulties.
So on Emperor, the AI has a "lot" of units. You generally have to set up lines and kill a bit before going in for the prize. If you try to just grab cities without dealing with the standing army you are likely to get knocked back hard, but with proper tactics you will succeed, even if you make a mistake here and there.
On Immortal, the AI has a "whole lot" of units. With a combination of smarter AI (this is where the AI is using its "maximum brain"), and more units.... I find that you have to plan wars well. You need solid kill lines, as your going to need to sit back and kill for a while before the AI is exhausted. You generally need really good siege works (citadels, road), good medic networks, and a great sustainability plan (how do I keep cycling units out and fresh ones in). This to me is the epitome of "tactical warfare" in VP currently.
On Deity, the AI hired Zap Brannagin, because you get wave after wave after wave of units. While on Immortal I generally get a big surge after I've killed the first mass, with Deity I can see that several times. However, because you have already had to hone your war skills on Immortal, you aren't really doing anything new on Deity, your just doing it more. You set the same lines, you just have to sit there and kill more and more. So to me Deity warfare is less about stressing your tactical capabilities and more your economic. Can you sustain the war weariness for a long enough period of time to get the benefits you want?
People have talked about grind on Deity, and I'm starting to understand it. On Immortal, the surge of extra units tests my tactics. Did I set up my lines properly, did the AI find a crack they can exploit, are they going to do something crazy? However, the test doesn't last THAT long, you get tested, and you either wither and die, or your plans hold and after a bit you start the city assault. With Deity I feel like I sit there well past the test point, my lines are good, the AI is not going to break them....but I have to sit back and kill lots of units before making a push. All its doing now is testing my patience
Against Tall civs its not that bad. Peaceful Tall Civs on Deity have the military forces of super war nations of Emperor....which again to a deity level player isn't that many. But against the wide war nations, holy cow its a lot of units!
So on Emperor, the AI has a "lot" of units. You generally have to set up lines and kill a bit before going in for the prize. If you try to just grab cities without dealing with the standing army you are likely to get knocked back hard, but with proper tactics you will succeed, even if you make a mistake here and there.
On Immortal, the AI has a "whole lot" of units. With a combination of smarter AI (this is where the AI is using its "maximum brain"), and more units.... I find that you have to plan wars well. You need solid kill lines, as your going to need to sit back and kill for a while before the AI is exhausted. You generally need really good siege works (citadels, road), good medic networks, and a great sustainability plan (how do I keep cycling units out and fresh ones in). This to me is the epitome of "tactical warfare" in VP currently.
On Deity, the AI hired Zap Brannagin, because you get wave after wave after wave of units. While on Immortal I generally get a big surge after I've killed the first mass, with Deity I can see that several times. However, because you have already had to hone your war skills on Immortal, you aren't really doing anything new on Deity, your just doing it more. You set the same lines, you just have to sit there and kill more and more. So to me Deity warfare is less about stressing your tactical capabilities and more your economic. Can you sustain the war weariness for a long enough period of time to get the benefits you want?
People have talked about grind on Deity, and I'm starting to understand it. On Immortal, the surge of extra units tests my tactics. Did I set up my lines properly, did the AI find a crack they can exploit, are they going to do something crazy? However, the test doesn't last THAT long, you get tested, and you either wither and die, or your plans hold and after a bit you start the city assault. With Deity I feel like I sit there well past the test point, my lines are good, the AI is not going to break them....but I have to sit back and kill lots of units before making a push. All its doing now is testing my patience
Against Tall civs its not that bad. Peaceful Tall Civs on Deity have the military forces of super war nations of Emperor....which again to a deity level player isn't that many. But against the wide war nations, holy cow its a lot of units!
As I've gotten used to Deity, something I've noticed about war as I've gone up the difficulties.
So on Emperor, the AI has a "lot" of units. You generally have to set up lines and kill a bit before going in for the prize. If you try to just grab cities without dealing with the standing army you are likely to get knocked back hard, but with proper tactics you will succeed, even if you make a mistake here and there.
On Immortal, the AI has a "whole lot" of units. With a combination of smarter AI (this is where the AI is using its "maximum brain"), and more units.... I find that you have to plan wars well. You need solid kill lines, as your going to need to sit back and kill for a while before the AI is exhausted. You generally need really good siege works (citadels, road), good medic networks, and a great sustainability plan (how do I keep cycling units out and fresh ones in). This to me is the epitome of "tactical warfare" in VP currently.
On Deity, the AI hired Zap Brannagin, because you get wave after wave after wave of units. While on Immortal I generally get a big surge after I've killed the first mass, with Deity I can see that several times. However, because you have already had to hone your war skills on Immortal, you aren't really doing anything new on Deity, your just doing it more. You set the same lines, you just have to sit there and kill more and more. So to me Deity warfare is less about stressing your tactical capabilities and more your economic. Can you sustain the war weariness for a long enough period of time to get the benefits you want?
People have talked about grind on Deity, and I'm starting to understand it. On Immortal, the surge of extra units tests my tactics. Did I set up my lines properly, did the AI find a crack they can exploit, are they going to do something crazy? However, the test doesn't last THAT long, you get tested, and you either wither and die, or your plans hold and after a bit you start the city assault. With Deity I feel like I sit there well past the test point, my lines are good, the AI is not going to break them....but I have to sit back and kill lots of units before making a push. All its doing now is testing my patience
Against Tall civs its not that bad. Peaceful Tall Civs on Deity have the military forces of super war nations of Emperor....which again to a deity level player isn't that many. But against the wide war nations, holy cow its a lot of units!
You could also add that because the "kill line" portion of the war lasts longer, your units are even more highly promoted, making the military (as opposed to the economic) part of the war easier than Immortal.
"When I'm in charge, EVERY mission's a suicide mission!"
Just wanted to show how the best laid plans sometimes go horribly, horribly wrong.
So after a very long and arduous war with Rome, we peaced out, and with the power of Lebansaum I set up some new citadels to setup for the next big city capture. I've gotten 4 artillery ready to pounce, and a well fortified series of units. My only hiccup is that the canal trick is not working on this version (which I forgot about), so I can't get my navy through that canal into the southern waters. That is going to be very important. But my plan is to quickly take out the city with 4 artillery pieces.
And.... yeah that didn't happen
With military bases, Rome's city defense is now godly and my artillery pieces mere dent the mighty cities defenses.
Further, my foolish puppet governor in Neapolis haven't even built basic defenses. No walls even! I take out several of Rome's Modern Destroyers (I am trying out the Enhanced Naval Warfare mod), but I just can't do it fast enough, as the modern destroyer's air defense starts to eat up my bombers and I have to let them rest.
Rome takes Neapolis, which creates a really big issue. All of those beautiful citadels I made....now work for the other team
Rome wastes no time, and obliterates all of the defense against Antium in a single stroke.
I am going to retry this again from a saved game and see if I can do better, but man that went downhill quickly
My only note here.... Puppets should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS build walls and castles as their first buildings....period. I can respect arsenals being more of a debate, but a city can't withstand even a few units without those basic defensive buildings.
So after a very long and arduous war with Rome, we peaced out, and with the power of Lebansaum I set up some new citadels to setup for the next big city capture. I've gotten 4 artillery ready to pounce, and a well fortified series of units. My only hiccup is that the canal trick is not working on this version (which I forgot about), so I can't get my navy through that canal into the southern waters. That is going to be very important. But my plan is to quickly take out the city with 4 artillery pieces.
Spoiler :
And.... yeah that didn't happen
Spoiler :
With military bases, Rome's city defense is now godly and my artillery pieces mere dent the mighty cities defenses.
Further, my foolish puppet governor in Neapolis haven't even built basic defenses. No walls even! I take out several of Rome's Modern Destroyers (I am trying out the Enhanced Naval Warfare mod), but I just can't do it fast enough, as the modern destroyer's air defense starts to eat up my bombers and I have to let them rest.
Rome takes Neapolis, which creates a really big issue. All of those beautiful citadels I made....now work for the other team
Rome wastes no time, and obliterates all of the defense against Antium in a single stroke.
I am going to retry this again from a saved game and see if I can do better, but man that went downhill quickly
My only note here.... Puppets should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS build walls and castles as their first buildings....period. I can respect arsenals being more of a debate, but a city can't withstand even a few units without those basic defensive buildings.
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