New Version - 2.6 (August 16, 2022)

[andersw]

I play Aztecs with new version, after a very long time, and I do not really remember the Jaguars' abilities. They have CS10 now, and with Brute force CS13 vs Barbarians. But they loose this promotion on upgrade; as Spearmen they have CS12 and are weaker vs Barbarians than before... Is that intended? If so, I'd prefer there were no unintentional upgrades by ancient ruins.

Btw, I read on Civilopedia that even Barbarian Brutes get the "Brute force" promotion. What do they need it for?

See it as an upgrade you can postpone, similar to rome who's Legions are not worth upgrading to longswords until you unlock tercio.

 

[looorg]

So you really really doesn't want my Lapis? I think some variable might have rolled over.

In some regard, is it better for the AI to buy ONE luxury for massive amount of gold per turn when it needs it or better if it more or less constantly buy all the luxuries it can to have a buffer of luxuries for a few gold each?

 

[SpecifiedUsername]

They hate you for that they have to ask you for help. Perfidious Albion.

 

[CppMaster]

View attachment 637497

So you really really doesn't want my Lapis? I think some variable might have rolled over.

In some regard, is it better for the AI to buy ONE luxury for massive amount of gold per turn when it needs it or better if it more or less constantly buy all the luxuries it can to have a buffer of luxuries for a few gold each?

The latter imho.

 

[balparmak]

They can't trigger WLTKD if they buy it constantly, and they'll buy indiscriminately if they're having happiness issues, so a buffer isn't really needed as far as I understand. I agree that the value is somewhat overtuned though, AI doesn't usually have monetary problems but getting 30GPT in Medieval while they are willing to sell for 8GPT feels off. I've been told that this applies to AI-to-AI transactions too and they're building positive relations by overpaying, I'm not sure what to think about that.

 

[CppMaster]

They can't trigger WLTKD if they buy it constantly

I'm open to it for WLTKD, not for City-State quests as those are more of an interactive mechanic. Enabling it for one of them would justify the AI always being willing to pay something for a luxury.

@Recursive Have you decided on this change?

 

[looorg]

They can't trigger WLTKD if they buy it constantly, and they'll buy indiscriminately if they're having happiness issues, so a buffer isn't really needed as far as I understand. I agree that the value is somewhat overtuned though, AI doesn't usually have monetary problems but getting 30GPT in Medieval while they are willing to sell for 8GPT feels off. I've been told that this applies to AI-to-AI transactions too and they're building positive relations by overpaying, I'm not sure what to think about that.

While that aspect of it is true it is not without issues. I have seen a lot more AI civs that are now forced into unhappiness. After all if they only buy when they need it's really easy to prevent them from buying it. Just say no. Some of them are running into money issues as they previously used to just sell and buy everything it was a small but steady income. In some regard I now find it a lot easier to crash an AI economy then it was before. They have become a lot more vulnerable now compared to previously. It's more common now to see AI being unhappy when you are in wars, which I guess is good for the player.

For the player and I guess civs that are more trade dependent when it comes to abilities, buildings, religions, policies etc are probably suffering a bit more since trade have become a lot more stingy. Not to mention then as the player it's really annoying when the main UI doesn't work as it no longer shows what they want to buy or it still lists everything they can buy but not what they want to buy or what they actually want to buy so you have to go in there and just ask for one item after another and that is a lot of micromanagement and clicks involved. In that regard things got massively worse for the player and for trade in general. In some regard it completely shifted in the AI favor as it's now so tedious to do that you are just better waiting for the AI to ask for something instead of offering them things. So trade is now more or less all on the AI plate as offering them things is pointless since it will always be an impossible deal unless they want it and if they want it they'll ask and make a ridiculous offer for it.

In some regard they only now buy things out of what seems like desperation and in that regard are willing to pay almost anything. I have noted when they make offers to buy something that they are usually willing to pay something in the range for 20-30-50% of their entire GPT value for an item. So those quests they might have that may trigger a WLTKD or fulfill a city-state quest are probably not going to be a net profit for them.

So the question in that regard remains I would say -- is it better to pay say 25% of your GPT for ONE luxury or is it better to buy like 5-6 luxuries for the same amount. Is it better to buy so you have a surplus of iron and horses, since they tend to use up all they have they are always in that regard very vulnerable to pillage during a war which negates all their shiny units as they now move into a no-heal land.

While I understand the basic idea that of what the AI was supposed to accomplish with the change I don't think it worked out as intended and it made it a lot worse for the player as you can now no longer build an economy based on trade, or well it became a lot less usable. So in usual fashion it solved one problem perhaps but created a bunch of new once, the trade UI not working anymore being what makes it horribly bad.

 

[4CV]

See it as an upgrade you can postpone, similar to rome who's Legions are not worth upgrading to longswords until you unlock tercio.

Yes, and very good tercios they will be, as they keep all their movement and combat promotions in forest and jungle. And now I managed to snipe Mt Kilimanjaro during a co-op war with Songhai vs. the Zulu....

 

[beginner_]

AI doesn't usually have monetary problems but getting 30GPT in Medieval

Yeah I'm selling my monopoly lux to 3 civs each givning me 30 GPT. that is 90 GPT for free.

 

[pineappledan]

I’m not liking the new ship movement at all. I want the old cannot end turn on deep ocean back. Half moves in deep ocean fixes a tactical combat flaw in the early game at the cost of blowing up the renaissance exploration, new continents phase.

Meeting everyone first and getting to scout the whole map early used to be Polynesia’s core strength, now their UA boils down to just the embarkation bonuses. This completely blows up the race to found the World Congress, and the New World map setting as well, because those both assume you can’t just meet or scout half the map until the mid game.

This isn’t worth the tradeoff

EDIT: Turns out I was mistaken and that ocean impassable has not been removed from Trireme and Dromon

 

[4CV]

I’m not liking the new ship movement at all. I want the old cannot end turn on deep ocean back. Half moves in deep ocean fixes a tactical combat flaw in the early game at the cost of blowing up the renaissance exploration, new continents phase.

Meeting everyone first and getting to scout the whole map early used to be Polynesia’s core strength, now their UA boils down to just the embarkation bonuses. This completely blows up the race to found the World Congress, and the New World map setting as well, because those both assume you can’t just meet or scout half the map until the mid game.

This isn’t worth the tradeoff

EDIT: Turns out I was mistaken and that ocean impassable has not been removed from Trireme and Dromon

But the Galeass can cross ocean, which is too strong, imo, so early in game. And with Great Lighthouse they go 3 tiles pt on ocean, without other promotions.

 

[4CV]

Askia's reaction when he noticed his horsemen being so pitiful...

But he is still good at pillaging, smoke is everywhere over Zulu land.

 

[Recursive]

@Recursive Have you decided on this change?

No.

 

[Dimmy]

Can't say I like not seeing what research I am on or what unit/building is going to be bought with faith auto... Extra clicks instead of a glance, really really not a big fan.

EDIT: Or is it from another mod? ><
EDIT2: Yup coming from UI improv mod. Not really improving anything anymore to me I guess.

 

[greenfieldpark]

Can't say I like not seeing what research I am on or what unit/building is going to be bought with faith auto... Extra clicks instead of a glance, really really not a big fan.

EDIT: Or is it from another mod? ><

I see both those things with this version

 

[Recursive]

@balparmak Personally I'd say those are valid points re: the UI if those are not displayed. I've always found those useful.

Also, everyone, I've fixed a few crashes that have been reported for 2.6. Replace your DLL in MODS > (1) Community Patch with this one to apply the fix. Savegame compatible.

I don't have time to make a new autoinstaller at the moment.

 

[balparmak]

Can't say I like not seeing what research I am on or what unit/building is going to be bought with faith auto... Extra clicks instead of a glance, really really not a big fan.

EDIT: Or is it from another mod? ><
EDIT2: Yup coming from UI improv mod. Not really improving anything anymore to me I guess

TechIcon can be re-enabled in "(3a) VP - EUI Compatibility Files\ImprovedTopPanel.ua" by setting HideTechIcon to false. Missionaries, inquisitors, prophets and religious buildings have their own font icons, but if you want the old cropped, outsized icons back, you can also set ReplaceIcons to false. Or remove ImprovedTopPanel folder completely to get the old EUI panel back.
Tech-in-progress is still visible when you hover on the science, I can make it automatically re-appear when players do not have the large tech progress icon visible (majority do). Justification for changes is provided here, I considered basic principles instead of edge cases when making these decisions. That said, anyone is welcome to make a poll to revert some or all of the changes and I'll work on it. I won't have the time to implement them soon though, so just remove the folder in the meantime.

 

[JohnnyNT]

I upgraded after a while (from 2.1.1 to 2.6) and started the game with all the additional goodies updated as well (3/4 uc, more wonders, unique city states, enhanced naval and air warfare). All seems to run well, but the loading screen images are not working (the ones visible when you create/load the game). Anyone else had this problem?

EDIT: Found the issue, VP was installing VPUI to the wrong Steam folder, all good now. Modpack works as well

 

[frktest]

After 4 games with 2.5 ver (2 lost and 2 won) I 'll go with 2.6 ver. I found 2.5 ver, very well balanced, challanging AI and fun to play.
Reading the huge changelog I do foresee further improvements, thanks a lot to devs.
The only change I dislike is Medieval era ships that can now travel through the ocean. It is very unrealistic with regard to history and ruins the discover of overseas civs at pretty advanced level and most times the competitor for victory: I strongly recommend to reconsider that, maybe with a new poll after 2-3 months of game testing.

 

[Tekamthi]

The only change I dislike is Medieval era ships that can now travel through the ocean. It is very unrealistic with regard to history and ruins the discover of overseas civs at pretty advanced level and most times the competitor for victory: I strongly recommend to reconsider that, maybe with a new poll after 2-3 months of game testing.

I tend to agree, should require astronomy to unlock the ability on galleas