Orbis Bug Thread (Old)

[Ahwaric]

If the giants have a tech prerequisite in the new version it probably removes the rationale for not letting them attack cities in the first place since you should have units capable of defending against after the very early game.

Well, there still be an occasional single hill giant from hillgiant steading, but groups will require appropiate tech (bronze working? currently it is animal husbandry )
So, I can as well remove animal tag from hill giants. Would make sense anyway.

I think I dislike units being able to carry around those battering rams.

Another valid point - and I agree. I like battering rams, but these are too easy to get. Also, maybe I should reduce the bombard rate?
So a gold cost increase? Minimum level? A need to make it in the forest (doviello spell for all)? Warlord attached?

 

[Opera]

Thanks a lot, that could explain endless turns in early game. It is probably caused by hill giants unable to enter cities. I should probably remove the block (will be able to attack), put a block on bombarding on units owned by barbarians () or remove the ability to bomabrd from giants ( pact of nilhorn ). Tough decidsion, help please!

Just try unmaking them animals. They will be tough to fight since they would be able to roam in cultural borders but, as AgentTBC said, if they come later...

I thought that these are not meaningfull, at least most of them. Consumption was simply pathetic, anyone ever used it (with i.e. scholarship in the same category)?
I decided to merge some of them into remaining ones (pacifism into liberty, scholarship into magocracy...)
I wanted a meaningfull category, more logical and reflecting real governments. Also, some options vere lacking. Now you can customize your empire to be a feudal republic, republic od one nation, centralized republic or just one consisting of semi-independent city states... I prefere that one.
But adding another, flavour centered category would be easy. This time though I would like it be balanced. Should I do it?

Well, I would like that. I guess that many Hated and Favorite Civics could come from something like cultural values rather than from labor or economy (even though it could in some cases). I don't know right now which values should be in the category but I will try to think of something...

Also, I want to add some extras to staring civics. Ideas?
I do not thing later civics should be always better than starting ones. FfH is not that kind of a game. I want all of the to be worth it, yet different, and have their own flavour.

I think the same

What about Animism instead of Neutrality? It seems to make more sense... to me at least. Maybe giving +1/animal den in the city? I could see an unhealth penalty for animal sacrifice and maybe some health/happiness bonus for specific pagan temples.

Another valid point - and I agree. I like battering rams, but these are too easy to get. Also, maybe I should reduce the bombard rate?
So a gold cost increase? Minimum level? A need to make it in the forest (doviello spell for all)? Warlord attached?

What about just building them like before but disabling them from moving? A unit should transport it. Or if you don't like the building part, just make it so that the spell takes some turns, simulating creation.

 

[Ahwaric]

Just try unmaking them animals. They will be tough to fight since they would be able to roam in cultural borders but, as AgentTBC said, if they come later...

Ok, then hill giants are no longer animals.

Well, I would like that. [...] I don't know right now which values should be in the category but I will try to think of something...

For now: consumption, religion (order? stability? - but that may be too close to social order), pacifism, war, knowledge. The names are temporary only, just general ideas. All civs will start with one, all possible from the start, but quite weak, flavour mostly (i.e. knowledge +10% science). Is it ok? Any ideas?

What about Animism instead of Neutrality? It seems to make more sense... to me at least.

I do not think it does for FfH. It is ok for real world, but people in FfH universe are well avare of the gods. They may not establish official cults yet, but they do know their past.
I am tempted to change religious civics a bit. Maybe remove humanism? Or just merge some civics? Or just leave them as they are? What do you think?

What about just building them like before but disabling them from moving? A unit should transport it. Or if you don't like the building part, just make it so that the spell takes some turns, simulating creation.

Building leads to a situation when AI is building battering rams just in case and has some in every city. But a small level requirement like 4 (shock troops ) and a few turn delay with removed gold cost (or not) would be fine I think.
Or perhaps a normal promotion costing you a level? With siege training for the name and city raider I as prerequirement?

 

[Jake the Peg]

Ok, then hill giants are no longer animals.

I am tempted to change religious civics a bit. Maybe remove humanism? Or just merge some civics? Or just leave them as they are? What do you think?

I was thinking that a new category should be added to describe what kind of society the civ has. At the moment, there isn't any civic to present an isolationist civ, like the Khazad, or an open society like Grigori and Kuriotates. Humanism could fit here perhaps.

 

[Barak]

0.23D is for 3.17 or is it updated to 3.19?

 

[Falc]

0.23D is for 3.17 or is it updated to 3.19?

It's not updated yet, all us Steam users are begging and pleading with Ahwaric for our fix

 

[Opera]

For now: consumption, religion (order? stability? - but that may be too close to social order), pacifism, war, knowledge. The names are temporary only, just general ideas. All civs will start with one, all possible from the start, but quite weak, flavour mostly (i.e. knowledge +10% science). Is it ok? Any ideas?

I am tempted to change religious civics a bit. Maybe remove humanism? Or just merge some civics? Or just leave them as they are? What do you think?

Why not putting Humanism in cultural values? That way, it would oppose Religion... As Peace/War, Knowledge/Consumption? Maybe also Tradition/Progressism? Nation/Interculturalism? (of course, name changes needed!)

I like this idea of already available civics just for flavour. However, how the AI would deal with them? This would certainly require some test games to see how they would change...

If you don't change neutrality, I think it need to not have +10%. I don't see why being neutral would give more culture...
About the religious civic: i like having one civic for each religion. Maybe changing their effects? I would need to check them first.

Maybe we should discuss civics in an appropriate thread, no?

Building leads to a situation when AI is building battering rams just in case and has some in every city. But a small level requirement like 4 (shock troops ) and a few turn delay with removed gold cost (or not) would be fine I think.
Or perhaps a normal promotion costing you a level? With siege training for the name and city raider I as prerequirement?

I like the small level requirement, the turn delay and no gold cost. This would increase unit specialization and usefulness of early highly promoted unit (I mean, they ARE useful but having a battering ram would make one even more useful before catapults!)

Edit:

I really like your changelog! Very nice

 

[Valkrionn]

What values did you go with for the Adventurer spawning? Might be better than what I have, or at least more balanced.

 

[AgentTBC]

Anything that makes battering rams rarer is okay by me. Level requirements, etc. I still like taking a movement hit, maybe +1 terrain movement cost. It's HARD to drag a battering ram through forest or up hills.

I suggest making them available to melee units only as well if they aren't already. I can't remember if they are or not.

 

[Falc]

It's not hard to carry a battering ram through a forest: you drop the battering ram, run through carrying some axes, chop down a tree at the other end...

 

[Nonobots]

Wild animals are once again blocked from entering civilization borders

Is it possible to wrap that up in an option? I really like the invasive animals.

 

[JanusTalaiini]

Playing as the Scions, I was able to turn the Black Lady into her haunt form, but there's no way for me to change her back - the "Become Corporeal" button isn't available.

Also, I got the Galen the apprentice quest chain, and on the final step the only option was to close the mage guild, which was unfortunate, being that I had already taken the unhappiness hit from the second step.

 

[AgentTBC]

Are we still waiting on fixes to base FFH2 for the new Orbis patch? Adaptive traits and so forth?

 

[Opera]

Ahwaric has found a fix and .24 is near release!

 

[civ_king]

Ahwaric has found a fix and .24 is near release!

Party,

French elf-centaur, want to dance?

 

[Raledon]

I came here in order to post a bug, and request help with another problem.
The first: My Gilden Silveric became a lycentrop and randomly gets feral strength which is kinda cool. However, the associated abilities/effects such as spawning werewolves, turning into a werewolf and turning back into a human do not appear (unuseable).
The second issue is a slowdown problem- at the start of the game it moves fast, but after some time (~200) the turns change ones every few mins. Mem useage was 1,163m and 1,169m the next turn, on turn 330 or so (large map). after restarting game and loadin game, it's down to 807m. anyway to get it to work faster?

 

[Wauthan]

There's not all that much you can do about slowdowns, save sticking to normal sized maps or smaller. I'm running the game on pretty strong machine but I still find the turns to be unbearably slow when the AI has to juggle around thousands of units (and cast spells, and change terrains, and switch civics etc).

Using smaller maps, and/or mapscripts that create a lot of deserts, mountains and jungles, speeds up the game considerably for me.

 

[Ahwaric]

Ahwaric has found a fix and .24 is near release!

Yup, got most of the bugs fixed and scheduled the release for saturday

Party,
French elf-centaur, want to dance?

Distracting members of the modding team is forbidden

I came here in order to post a bug, and request help with another problem.
The first: My Gilden Silveric became a lycentrop and randomly gets feral strength which is kinda cool. However, the associated abilities/effects such as spawning werewolves, turning into a werewolf and turning back into a human do not appear (unuseable).

It is not a bug.
Lycanthropic units can't create werewolves - only real bestial ones do, particulary the ones created by Duin.
Lycanthropy is a curse and only doviello can controll it being one with their animal side. Other civs units sometimes get lycanthropy, too (how did your Gilden get it?) but are unable to control the transformation. Full moon does it

The second issue is a slowdown problem- at the start of the game it moves fast, but after some time (~200) the turns change ones every few mins. Mem useage was 1,163m and 1,169m the next turn, on turn 330 or so (large map). after restarting game and loadin game, it's down to 807m. anyway to get it to work faster?

Unfortunatelly, it is how it works. I have included some spead tweaks i.e. for hell terrain spread, but the amount of units to control makes turns on big maps slow.
Is it slower than BtS or FfH? FfH may run slower than BtS for number of reasons there is not much we can do about short of removing features (spell system etc.) If Orbis runs slower than FfH, I will try to look for a cause.
I think demons (barbarian faction) might be a problem. What was the hell terrain/AC status?

Also, remember that FfH specific mapscripts create a lot of land and it allows for more cities/units.
Pangea or continents maps of the same size have much more water tiles so will run faster because of the limited settled areas. So, water maps (save perhaps for the archipelago) run faster.

 

[Falc]

yup, got most of the bugs fixed and scheduled the release for saturday

praise the lahd!

 

[Raledon]

There's not all that much you can do about slowdowns, save sticking to normal sized maps or smaller. I'm running the game on pretty strong machine but I still find the turns to be unbearably slow when the AI has to juggle around thousands of units (and cast spells, and change terrains, and switch civics etc).

Using smaller maps, and/or mapscripts that create a lot of deserts, mountains and jungles, speeds up the game considerably for me.

My machine runs [Generic First Person Shooter]* smoothly. There's no reason for these slowdowns, especially since I don't have this problem with FFH2 'classic'. I mean, FFH2 is still slow on huge maps, but with Orbis I experience 3 minutes downtime between turns, even on large maps with only 5 civs...

*Say, 'Prototype'.

Edit: I'm playing mostly on cintinent maps, which are ~70% water (rough guess). The slowdown occurs even without Hyborem being summoned (so no hell terain at all). Also, this occurs in *every* game I play.

Thanks for explaining the lychantropy bit, BTW.