[R&F] Poll: which are the last 4 R&F civs?

[ferretbacon]

Ugh.

My four guesses were the Ottomans, Mali, Inca, and Georgia.

I'll entertain the idea that we're getting the Zulu and the Celts...

I've got to have my Ottomans out of those four. I really don't want to wait on them any longer.

I guess the Zulu would take Mali's spot. I'm not thrilled about it though (I'm never thrilled about the Zulu).

But damn. I'd like both the Inca and Georgia (what can I say, Tamar's grown on me). If we're getting the Celts in some form, I just hope they hone in and get more specific with it. The Celts always come across as "the Vikings" or "the Native Americans" did. If they pick Scotland specifically, I hope they don't go with William Wallace. That would be a bit hokey.

 

[Naktis]

Well if they actually gonna release Scotland and not Celts as whole , then its 100% clear that Irish Civ will come with next expanssion , since it seems firaxis would focus on british civs as a whole.Can't blame them , market in those countries are great.

 

[Vahnstad]

I wouldn't have the idea that the Celts are in, if Scotland makes it into the game. Scotland is to me a bit different than the Celts i have in mind.

 

[Kimiimaro]

I hope for this "leak" to be fake. Zulu and William Wallace would be kinda disappointing for me.

Admittedly, I don't really understand what's happening on the Chinese forum thread that was linked, but I didn't see anything that convinces me this is a leak.

However, someone earlier said that maybe the Zulu and Celts will be a post-expansion DLC, which makes perfect thematic sense:

Isn't this from the show that put Napoleon vs George Washington and according to them, Washington was better?

 

[Manifold]

I am too late for the poll but my guesses for this expansion with the name and the specific topic Rise and Fall would be:

1. Italy - Europe
When I think about ....Rise (Rome) and Fall (post Gothic War)... and the rebirth, I think of Italy and the Renaissance primarily.

2. Babylon / Assyria - Asia
Currently there are much too less ancient and what I would say real Civilizations ingame and both Babylon and Assyria had more than one rise and one fall during their more than 1000 years lasting glory history.

3. Inca - America
Very quick and extensive rise but hard and abrupt fall.

4. Carthage - Africa
They rose after each of the lost wars. Btw personally this time I prefer the Phoenicians with Carthage included.

-------------------------
And here are two other expansion surprise Civs

5. Byzantine Empire
More than 1000 years of ups and downs.

6. Ottoman
They fit very good to the new golden / dark age theme. Maybe their UA could be that golden ages are like heroic ages but dark ages last for two eras.

...will never happen until Linear A and/or Minoan Hieroglyphics are translated, which is nowhere close to happening.

Where is the problem there are already some playable Civs without an own writing system in game.
And maybe some future scholar will be encourage to translate Linear A and/or Minoan Hieroglyphics after playing this game.

 

[Arianrhod]

Where is the problem there are already some playable Civs without an own writing system in game.
And maybe some future scholar will be encourage to translate Linear A and/or Minoan Hieroglyphics after playing this game.

It's not the fact that we don't know their writing system, it's the fact that until we know their writing system we don't know enough about them to possibly make a good civilization that can truly be said to represent them. Ideally we should try to figure out their name and some of their leaders before we consider adding them to Civ.

There's always the Hittites if the Mediterranean Bronze age civ niche needs to be filled. They're documented enough and even come with an obvious gimmick (i.e. something relating to strategic resources.)

 

[Liufeng]

I'm too late for the poll either, but if I could have voted, I guess it would be as such :
- Ottoman Turks : one civilization from the Middle East will probably come, and we know by now that it won't be Babylon nor the Hittites. The Ottomans being demanded for such long time, being extremely important in (early) modern history, I firmly believe they are to be added now.
- A west african civ (Ghana, Mali, Songhai, Benin, Ashanti, or else) : Ed Beach explained that within R&F, he wished to add ethnic and gender diversity, so an african civ is probably going to be added to represent Black Africa. Also, he explained that he wished to fill the gaps in TSL maps, and West Africa is absolutely empty from any civilization at all. Thus, I believe one of these are to be added.
- Inca : The reasoning is the same as my two choices before (diversity, gap filling, great empire), and also the fact that now we know the Maya are not included within the game (Palenque being still a CS).
- Italy : this long absence of italian CS is fishy. Also, they really fit the R&F theme.

AND ... I just read about the leaks, and, as most people here, I am so disappointed ... Scots (or Celts) led by William Wallace ? This guy is more like a great general, and the leader should be more Robert the Bruce (especially that I feel like Wallace will look like that anachronic freak Mel Gibson). And the Zulus ... with so many great civs from Africa, with so many possibilities, from civs with a rich history (Zimbabwe, Ethiopia, Mali, Benin, Swahili even Carthage), they had to go with not even a century old empire that is known to have won one battle against the brittish ... I'm disappointidly speechless ...

 

[conorbebe]

I’ve placed my bets on the Ottomans, Inca, Georgia, and Italy, based on potential clues from the trailer, fan popularity, and Firaxis’ Eurocentrism.

I wouldn’t have voted on Georgia, as much as I’ve become fond of them as of late, but I just don’t know of any other female rulers other than Tamar that could be built around the Golden Age system and also represent a civ which is not yet featured in the game.

I also think Italy could be exchanged for an African civ, possibly the Zulu if we’re thinking from a TSL perspective, or maybe even the Māori.

 

[Merciorum]

While I don't particularly want the Zulu, you people are far too dismissive of them. Shaka revolutionised warfare and statehood in Southern Africa, and would be remembered as a far more pivotal figure in African history had the British not come along so soon after him. Certainly not my first choice, but still a perfectly reasonable option.

 

[marius_kaparius]

Has there been any further proof that the alleged leak is legitimate? If you place some of the other replies into another chinese to english translator the reply "这个应该不是秘密了吧 大家都猜到了并且也不是新鲜的文明了" appears to say This should not be secret everybody to guess correctly, and was not the new civilization (emphasis added by me). The translation software might be losing the plot completely but the recognition of the negatives must mean something.

 

[liv]

I love the Zulus as a civ. They were fierce in civ 5 and always a great opponent. I would love to have a civ like that in the game. If they really are going to add them I hope they can be like that. As it is none of the AI civs currently are really any threat. Even Gilgamesh can be dealt with once you have figured out how. But with the Mongols added, I was hoping for the rest of the civs to be non warmongers.

For me Celts is one of the great civs out there. They are bigger than any national state and show that sometimes culture can just prevail over politics and force. Which is why I would want them in. I do not understand the blob argument at all. Nation states are not the same as civilizations and yes perhaps the celts in the game will have a geographical focus to not have too much overlap but that does not bother me that much.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I love the Zulus as a civ. They were fierce in civ 5 and always a great opponent. I would love to have a civ like that in the game. If they really are going to add them I hope they can be like that. As it is none of the AI civs currently are really any threat. Even Gilgamesh can be dealt with once you have figured out how. But with the Mongols added, I was hoping for the rest of the civs to be non warmongers.

For me Celts is one of the great civs out there. They are bigger than any national state and show that sometimes culture can just prevail over politics and force. Which is why I would want them in. I do not understand the blob argument at all. Nation states are not the same as civilizations and yes perhaps the celts in the game will have a geographical focus to not have too much overlap but that does not bother me that much.

My biggest beef with the Zulus is Firaxis' inevitable one-dimensional approach of always making them 100% warmonger. I feel this should be avoided with indigenous cultures, as it promotes stereotypes.

 

[liv]

I just want to play a game. No one in real life are just warmongers but a civ as competent as the Zulus were would be great. And just because you know how to fight does not mean you cannot be great in other things. The civ5 zulus were always good at trying to win a diplomatic victory. And that put the fear into me
I do not worry that much what the labels are. Make the super warmonger Canadian if that is easier to swallow.

 

[Gabhar]

Well if they actually gonna release Scotland and not Celts as whole , then its 100% clear that Irish Civ will come with next expanssion , since it seems firaxis would focus on british civs as a whole.Can't blame them , market in those countries are great.

A Scottish civ would preclude an Irish civ imo due to filling the same niche, they are simply too similar as both would be Medieval Gaels. Careful calling Ireland a "British" civ, it's been a matter of some political disagreement.

 

[Liufeng]

haka revolutionised warfare and statehood in Southern Africa, and would be remembered as a far more pivotal figure in African history had the British not come along so soon after him

Which makes Shaka an excellent choice for a Great General, but not the leader of a whole civ (and the same goes for Alexander, that would have been far better as a greek leader or a GG, but not the leader of Macedon). Of course, I'm no fan of one leader-civs, like the Zulus (Shaka), the Timurids (Tamerlane), the Huns (Attila), Palmyra (Zenobia), and so on. What drives the most off is that even though Shaka may have changed warfare, the Zulus merely conquered their neighbours just to lose their empire soon after against the british. Their empire did not even last or 100 years, while you have so many others next to them (Ethiopia, Swahili, Zimbabwe, Ghana, Mali, Songhai, Benin, Ashanti, Dahomey, and so on.

 

[Ivan Hunger]

My biggest beef with the Zulus is Firaxis' inevitable one-dimensional approach of always making them 100% warmonger. I feel this should be avoided with indigenous cultures, as it promotes stereotypes.

Even outside of the cultural sensitivity reasons, I hope Firaxis can find some way to avoid this, because Civ 6 already has it's 100% warmonger civilizations in Macedon and Mongolia. Not to mention several 75% warmonger civs in England, Scythia, Norway and the Aztecs.

I feel like Civ 6 has met it's quota for war civs and doesn't really need any more.

 

[Sagax]

If you place some of the other replies into another chinese to english translator the reply "这个应该不是秘密了吧 大家都猜到了并且也不是新鲜的文明了" appears to say This should not be secret everybody to guess correctly, and was not the new civilization (emphasis added by me).

A better translation would be “This one shouldn’t be a secret. Everyone has already figured it out, and it’s not a brand new civ.” “Brand new civ” as in “they’re not new to the Civ franchise”

 

[blackcatatonic]

A better translation would be “This one shouldn’t be a secret. Everyone has already figured it out, and it’s not a brand new civ.” “Brand new civ” as in “they’re not new to the Civ franchise”

See, if I saw that, and Zulu and Celts hadn't been mentioned, my first thought would have been Ottomans...

 

[earlc]

The phrase 'cutting off the nose to spite the face' springs to mind.

It was an intentional exaggeration clearly, because I am that confident that the 'leak', at best, isn't entirely correct. I'd guess it's a joke, maybe a reference to that video posted earlier.

If I'm wrong I'll still be buying the expansion, but I will actually be disappointed.

 

[Proclo]

What's the matter with Willian Wallace? I'm no expert on Scotland history but I can't imagine why is he such a bad leader?