MacAttack
Just the tip
Will Spain be as gracious as Britain to allow a referendum? Would it be devastating to Spain?
Protesters demand Catalonia independence referendum
- Thread starter MacAttack
- Start date
kramerfan86
Deity
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- Feb 10, 2008
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Spain wont allow one because they know they will lose. I honestly think the only reason the UK allowed one is they didnt think there was any chance they would lose.
JohannaK
Heroically Clueless
JohannaK
Heroically Clueless
And this video shows pretty impressive images.
MacAttack
Just the tip
Counterpoint
Perfect! it is settled then. No referendum!
gangleri2001
Garbage day!!!
Referendum is set for November 9th and no, they won't allow it.
Yes.
MacAttack
Just the tip
how so? Can you elaborate?
That was not what I was trying to say. The shirt needs to say "should not" rather than "is not" as, at least for now, it clearly is part of Spain.
Akka
Moody old mage.
Being a separatist and claiming your region is somehow a country is the new fad.
Bunch of idiots.
Bunch of idiots.
Tahuti
Writing Deity
- Joined
- Nov 17, 2005
- Messages
- 9,492
Two-front war. Soon, the Muslims will take advantage of the Catalan insurrection and start the re-reconquista!
Of course, Catalonia will soon be part of the mighty Islamic state as well!
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
Is there a legal way for independence to be achieved?
If not, is that why they're not allowing the referendum to be "valid" ? (That's what's happening, right?)
If not, is that why they're not allowing the referendum to be "valid" ? (That's what's happening, right?)
Borachio
Way past lunacy
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- Jan 31, 2012
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- 26,698
It is confusing. Perhaps it could have said "Catalonia is not Spanish"?
Or "Catalonia is not part of Spain". (Clearly "Catalonia is not Spain" fails on a number of counts. It's obviously not the whole of Spain, which would be how that reads to me.)
But making hyperbolic statements on T-shirts is fairly standard rhetoric, imo. I think we could allow the absence of "should not be".
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
There are two ideas here, the idea of a state and the idea of a nation.
I think that the state of Spain clearly contains Catalonia.. I mean, just look at the map. But the nation of Spain is not a thing to be found on a map - it is a collection of people and ideas. So it could exclude Catalonia hypothetically speaking.
Or maybe I have those two confused..
I think that the state of Spain clearly contains Catalonia.. I mean, just look at the map. But the nation of Spain is not a thing to be found on a map - it is a collection of people and ideas. So it could exclude Catalonia hypothetically speaking.
Or maybe I have those two confused..
JohannaK
Heroically Clueless
Catalonia is not Spain is meant in a national-cultural way more than anything, I think. That's how I've always seen it. EDIT: xpost
Well, there is a way, but it involved amending the Constitution and for some reason neither Big Party would ever want to do that to allow secession. A committee of experts actually identified five ways to legally get there, but they all involve Madrid ceding, and that's not going to happen.
In fact the 'referendum' is technically not a referendum, more like an official opinion poll. The regional law establishing this was worded this way so that it would fit into existent legality, but as soon as it is passed the government will appeal to the Constitutional Court, suspending it until Court ruling (it could and most probably would take years). The trick here is that members of the Court get chosen by the Congress and the Senate, so the two big parties choose half of the Court each, and the ruling would most probably be favourable to their interests.
Well, there is a way, but it involved amending the Constitution and for some reason neither Big Party would ever want to do that to allow secession. A committee of experts actually identified five ways to legally get there, but they all involve Madrid ceding, and that's not going to happen.
In fact the 'referendum' is technically not a referendum, more like an official opinion poll. The regional law establishing this was worded this way so that it would fit into existent legality, but as soon as it is passed the government will appeal to the Constitutional Court, suspending it until Court ruling (it could and most probably would take years). The trick here is that members of the Court get chosen by the Congress and the Senate, so the two big parties choose half of the Court each, and the ruling would most probably be favourable to their interests.
Domen
Misico dux Vandalorum
Sardinia follows:
What next ??? I hope some part of Germany (Germany is far too big!). Bavaria ???
Germany should return to its natural condition - political "Flickenteppich", like this:
What next ??? I hope some part of Germany (Germany is far too big!). Bavaria ???
Germany should return to its natural condition - political "Flickenteppich", like this:
Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
FriendlyFire
Codex WMDicanious
What next ??? I hope some part of Germany (Germany is far too big!). Bavaria ???
Greater Germany is NOT too big.
(its just big boned
)
The state of Spain is not necessarily the nation of Spain. This stuff is complex. The Spanish constitution itself is as clear as mud describing the country rather delicately as a "nation of nationalities". Positing that a single unitary entity called "Spain" even exists as anything other than a de jure state is taking a strong political stance.
