pawelo
Emperor
Well said
Let's go Sushi!
Btw, how about settling at the end of the peninsula as well ?
PW-01: Holy word
- Thread starter pawelo
- Start date
Well said
Let's go Sushi!
Btw, how about settling at the end of the peninsula as well ?
r_rolo1
King of myself
I think that that strip of land is more a isthmus than a penisula ...... but who knows
?Either way we should settle it ASAP : whipping, Drafting, globe, wathever.....
Food is power!
Ah, I misread the rules. I assumed a crusade would be ok so long as we weren't actively participating.
If we get desperate, we can always gift Stalin a few techs to make him open up. He isn't exactly the tech leader among the AIs.
Giving him a buddist city isn't a bad idea though, especially once we have seaworld settled and the cost of putting out an extra settler or two is practically zero.
If we get desperate, we can always gift Stalin a few techs to make him open up. He isn't exactly the tech leader among the AIs.
Giving him a buddist city isn't a bad idea though, especially once we have seaworld settled and the cost of putting out an extra settler or two is practically zero.
r_rolo1
King of myself
The only way that we can participate in a crusade ( and it was discussed before the game starts ) is a AP vote of war against the infidels ( pawelo decided to left that option open )... Not sure if will be useful, but it is a viable option to keep in mind
Ah, that's exactly what I had in mind. Since the whole world will be our religious friends, I naturally assumed a holy war on the odd man out would be the easiest way to dispose of him. Plus the rest of us would get another sizable relations bonus towards the lovefest.
Or does it not count as converting everybody if we murder one AI and convert the rest?
Or does it not count as converting everybody if we murder one AI and convert the rest?
pawelo
Emperor
Let's play vatican and make others do our dirty work 
I think we can call a holy crusade as long as we use the others to execute it
Btw, pholk are you up for 15?
I think we can call a holy crusade as long as we use the others to execute it
Btw, pholk are you up for 15?
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
didn't know that I was, but I've got the save now.
I think that now that we've got the Buddhist shrine working, there'll be a good chance one of his cities will get it sooner or later.
will continue on the path to Theo and use the GP for CS. After Theo, I'll see what the situation is, and go from there. Perhaps towards Philo ~
I think that now that we've got the Buddhist shrine working, there'll be a good chance one of his cities will get it sooner or later.
will continue on the path to Theo and use the GP for CS. After Theo, I'll see what the situation is, and go from there. Perhaps towards Philo ~
stuge
Emperor
We got philo already, from the Oracle, no less.
There's something fishy about this game, I'm telling y'all. It's going too well...
There's something fishy about this game, I'm telling y'all. It's going too well...
pawelo
Emperor
@pholkhero
Sorry, should have posted the roster.
Btw, can you guys copy/paste it at the end of your report [please] ?
Methinks DR should be one of our next goals - otherwise some defense tech - I don't know where we stand
@stuge
me too I think it goes just too well...
Sorry, should have posted the roster.
Btw, can you guys copy/paste it at the end of your report [please] ?
Methinks DR should be one of our next goals - otherwise some defense tech - I don't know where we stand
@stuge
me too I think it goes just too well...
I think Divine Right can wait. After we pick up Theology & bulb CS, I'd say pick up defense techs as necessary, and then pick up alphabet so we can see where the other AIs stand in terms of tech.
As long as nobody else has Monarchy & Theology, and it goes without saying that we'll never trade either away, we can delay Divine Right. If we can delay DR all the way until after we research music (presumably first), we can burn the artist on DR, then research the rest.
Other than alphabet, not sure if we have any pressing short term tech needs. I'd just go for a general balance, and make sure we don't lose any of the good music line wonders. We have way too good of a wonder factory to not grab all of those.
As long as nobody else has Monarchy & Theology, and it goes without saying that we'll never trade either away, we can delay Divine Right. If we can delay DR all the way until after we research music (presumably first), we can burn the artist on DR, then research the rest.
Other than alphabet, not sure if we have any pressing short term tech needs. I'd just go for a general balance, and make sure we don't lose any of the good music line wonders. We have way too good of a wonder factory to not grab all of those.
r_rolo1
King of myself
@ stuge & pawelo
I do not agree.... This is simply the demostration of what a ( very ) good starting position can make to a game... If you don't belive me check a game with another map from our divinised Egyptian engineer friend ,like the DMI IV - The Grand Line (BtS) .... This one in particular had a truly devilish
start and National and heroic since the beggining ( but the world wonders were hidden in a barb city surrounded by mountains and only acessible by paradrop, without the knowledge of the players ( except the map maker, of course 
) ). Even being in deity, the team truly dwarfed the AI in all the regards, basically because they could whip the initial city like mad men and still produce enourmous ammounts of research. I think that we are experiencing a lesser but similar effect....But the game will be troublesome when we need to have all the religions in all the cities ( you know, the probability of sucess of missionary action diminushes with the increase of the number of religions in city ) and with the conversion to budha of all the cities, because we can only have 3 missionaries at a moment ( a thing that will make the conversion of far away cities a little more troubling ( let's just hope that our map maker didn't put a city of one civ in a far away city surrounded by mountains and only accesible by air
) )
pawelo
Emperor
I see your point r_rolo... I think we will have to think quite a bit to fulfil the Decalogue I think I'll have to rehearse the DM series tomorrow 
I think I'll have to rehearse the DM series tomorrow Getting the religions into the cities might be a pain, but it won't be anything we lose the game over. With enough missionary spam, we will eventually get there.
Just need to make sure we find and settle a few more good production sites in the future. There's many overpowered food sites laying around to grab first, but even 2-3 low-profile, borderline crappy production cities will be worth their weight in gold when it comes time to crank out one missionary after another to fulfill our city religions requirements. Our stone/marble city will be busy with more important things, like wonders and military.
Just need to make sure we find and settle a few more good production sites in the future. There's many overpowered food sites laying around to grab first, but even 2-3 low-profile, borderline crappy production cities will be worth their weight in gold when it comes time to crank out one missionary after another to fulfill our city religions requirements. Our stone/marble city will be busy with more important things, like wonders and military.
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
I see everyone was waiting for me as there've been no posts in over a day ~ a record
Well, first of all ~ none of my screenshots came out. On my keyboard, you need to turn on an F-lock to use your Fbuttons (F1, F2, etc). It also needs to be on to turn on or off the Type Over function in Word, but with it on, it doesnt take screenshots (since Insert shares the same key!). Long story short (too late!), no pics!! Extremely sorry all, but not a WHOLE lot happened.
Let me get the report up, and I can fill in any necessary screenshots later on.
Turn 75/500 (1000 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:46:14]
Nothing much. I noticed that Theo and the GP were both in 15 turns (rather than Theo in 13) so that works out perfectly for me. Press Enter again.
Turn 76/500 (975 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:51:07]
A Pasture was built near Thebes Ha, now this was a great event! I even had a pic. Those horses nearby were spontaneously pastured by our Industrious citizens. AWESOME event ~ I think that might be a Solver as Ive never seen it before.
Taoism has spread: Thebes
Memphis grows: 5
IBT: I didnt see this in-game: Judaism has spread: Guangzhou (Chinese Empire)
Turn 77/500 (950 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:52:18]
The Great Wall is BIFAL. Too bad for us as all the barbs will be coming our way
IBT:
State Religion Change: Mao Zedong(China) from 'no State Religion' to 'Judaism'
Turn 78/500 (925 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:53:03]
Ugh ~ notice Mao converted to Judaism on the IBT, as it spread to Guangzhou. Well, we know where our first missionaries should go.
IBT: Met another lovely neighbor: Contact made: Greek Empire Hes across the land bridge, and to the north.
Turn 79/500 (900 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:53:38]
Memphis finished its Barracks and I started on an Axeman (4 turns) in order to get some defense there. It has 1 unhappy from no garrison, and Thebes is at 2
because of it.
Turn 80/500 (875 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:54:31]
A Quarry was built near Memphis This was the stone. Im also roading it for use in our cities for something wonder-ful
Turn 81/500 (850 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:55:39]
Turn 82/500 (825 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:56:42]
Thebes finishes: Settler
Memphis finishes: Axeman
IBT:
Buddhism has spread: Beijing (Chinese Empire)
Turn 83/500 (800 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:57:19]
Thebes was done with its Settler, and it had a Granary in the queue. I let that go. We also finished the Axeman @ Memphis, and so I went on to a War Chariot (3 turns) for Thebes defense.
Our workers quarried and roaded teh stone. I figure after we get some units built, we can go ahead and start Angkor there. I also am going to connect that gold for another happy face, as well as cottage that FP grass. We might as well be getting some extra commerce from it, eh?
Memphis grows: 6
Turn 84/500 (775 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:59:46]
Nothing much happened.
Turn 85/500 (750 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:00:20]
Memphis: done w/WC, and so I start on the Pyramids (14 turns). All wonders there were 13 turns (despite this saying 14), so I chose this as we had the biggest chance to lose it.
Turn 86/500 (725 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:01:56]
After the Granary, Thebes begins: Buddhist Monastery (6 turns). This way, we can try and spread some more buddhism to china ASAP. I think 1 city is Buddhist.
Turn 87/500 (700 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:03:31]
Nada.
Turn 88/500 (675 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:04:03]
Our settler finally made it to the land bridge, and Heliopolis was founded. Its several tiles in, grabbing as many sea resources as it could, at least 8, maybe more. I will try and get a pic of this ASAP.
IMAGE
Heliopolis begins: Work Boat (15 turns) I figure we can swap to an obelisk the turn before it grows to pop2, then whip it for some cultural expansion.
Turn 89/500 (650 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:05:24]
Press Enter, thats it.
Turn 90/500 (625 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:05:50]
Okay, during the IBT, a lot happened. Theology came in, and was founded in Heliopolis. It's a shame god has forbidden us to swap out of state religion so we could border pop this baby. I initially chose Monarchy, but then saw that Tsongkhapa (Great Prophet) was born in Thebes, and chose CS instead. 26 turns to CS, pre-Lightbulbing ~ after, 3 turns till CS. Nice!!
And that's my (picture-less) 15. Heliopolis nabbed Christianity. Pyramids in 5 turns at memphis, and thebes will have the monastery built next turn. Two of the workers are improving a hill near Thebes, while one has just started making a road to Helio. With it being so far out, we'll need it for quick access for our troops ~ just in case, of course. Speaking of troops ~ we have but one axe in memphis and a war chariot in Thebes (such a waste of good early UU); we could use some more so that we dont look like a tasty morsel to some aggressive AI leader, though where wed find such a crazy nabob, I dont know
Well, first of all ~ none of my screenshots came out. On my keyboard, you need to turn on an F-lock to use your Fbuttons (F1, F2, etc). It also needs to be on to turn on or off the Type Over function in Word, but with it on, it doesnt take screenshots (since Insert shares the same key!). Long story short (too late!), no pics!! Extremely sorry all, but not a WHOLE lot happened.
Let me get the report up, and I can fill in any necessary screenshots later on.
Turn 75/500 (1000 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:46:14]
Nothing much. I noticed that Theo and the GP were both in 15 turns (rather than Theo in 13) so that works out perfectly for me. Press Enter again.
Turn 76/500 (975 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:51:07]
A Pasture was built near Thebes Ha, now this was a great event! I even had a pic. Those horses nearby were spontaneously pastured by our Industrious citizens. AWESOME event ~ I think that might be a Solver as Ive never seen it before.
Taoism has spread: Thebes
Memphis grows: 5
IBT: I didnt see this in-game: Judaism has spread: Guangzhou (Chinese Empire)
Turn 77/500 (950 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:52:18]
The Great Wall is BIFAL. Too bad for us as all the barbs will be coming our way
IBT:
State Religion Change: Mao Zedong(China) from 'no State Religion' to 'Judaism'
Turn 78/500 (925 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:53:03]
Ugh ~ notice Mao converted to Judaism on the IBT, as it spread to Guangzhou. Well, we know where our first missionaries should go.
IBT: Met another lovely neighbor: Contact made: Greek Empire Hes across the land bridge, and to the north.
Turn 79/500 (900 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:53:38]
Memphis finished its Barracks and I started on an Axeman (4 turns) in order to get some defense there. It has 1 unhappy from no garrison, and Thebes is at 2
because of it.Turn 80/500 (875 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:54:31]
A Quarry was built near Memphis This was the stone. Im also roading it for use in our cities for something wonder-ful
Turn 81/500 (850 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:55:39]
Turn 82/500 (825 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:56:42]
Thebes finishes: Settler
Memphis finishes: Axeman
IBT:
Buddhism has spread: Beijing (Chinese Empire)
Turn 83/500 (800 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:57:19]
Thebes was done with its Settler, and it had a Granary in the queue. I let that go. We also finished the Axeman @ Memphis, and so I went on to a War Chariot (3 turns) for Thebes defense.
Our workers quarried and roaded teh stone. I figure after we get some units built, we can go ahead and start Angkor there. I also am going to connect that gold for another happy face, as well as cottage that FP grass. We might as well be getting some extra commerce from it, eh?
Memphis grows: 6
Turn 84/500 (775 BC) [24-Oct-2007 17:59:46]
Nothing much happened.
Turn 85/500 (750 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:00:20]
Memphis: done w/WC, and so I start on the Pyramids (14 turns). All wonders there were 13 turns (despite this saying 14), so I chose this as we had the biggest chance to lose it.
Turn 86/500 (725 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:01:56]
After the Granary, Thebes begins: Buddhist Monastery (6 turns). This way, we can try and spread some more buddhism to china ASAP. I think 1 city is Buddhist.
Turn 87/500 (700 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:03:31]
Nada.
Turn 88/500 (675 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:04:03]
Our settler finally made it to the land bridge, and Heliopolis was founded. Its several tiles in, grabbing as many sea resources as it could, at least 8, maybe more. I will try and get a pic of this ASAP.
IMAGE
Heliopolis begins: Work Boat (15 turns) I figure we can swap to an obelisk the turn before it grows to pop2, then whip it for some cultural expansion.
Turn 89/500 (650 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:05:24]
Press Enter, thats it.
Turn 90/500 (625 BC) [24-Oct-2007 18:05:50]
Okay, during the IBT, a lot happened. Theology came in, and was founded in Heliopolis. It's a shame god has forbidden us to swap out of state religion so we could border pop this baby. I initially chose Monarchy, but then saw that Tsongkhapa (Great Prophet) was born in Thebes, and chose CS instead. 26 turns to CS, pre-Lightbulbing ~ after, 3 turns till CS. Nice!!
And that's my (picture-less) 15. Heliopolis nabbed Christianity. Pyramids in 5 turns at memphis, and thebes will have the monastery built next turn. Two of the workers are improving a hill near Thebes, while one has just started making a road to Helio. With it being so far out, we'll need it for quick access for our troops ~ just in case, of course. Speaking of troops ~ we have but one axe in memphis and a war chariot in Thebes (such a waste of good early UU); we could use some more so that we dont look like a tasty morsel to some aggressive AI leader, though where wed find such a crazy nabob, I dont know
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
As for next steps, i feel that we're a bit . . . eh, undefended. Maybe that's just the hard, hard lessons of Agg AI (and a violent Shaka), but i think we need more troops ASAP.
We also seem to be light on cities for this point in time. Maybe one or two more pretty quickly is the way to go. We could have Thebes crank out 2 settlers (maybe a missionary or two in btwn), w/Memphis working on units after the Pyramids. Don't know what ya'll think, but we have everything but Islam founded, and that's a bit aways from all the AIs, imo. Oh, and that reminds me, i had a pic of possible tech trades, and we should check that out. Mao has ABCs as well as other tasty early techs we may want.
I had to go back a ways to get the roster. Seems like everyone knows their place, but me ~
And the Save:
We also seem to be light on cities for this point in time. Maybe one or two more pretty quickly is the way to go. We could have Thebes crank out 2 settlers (maybe a missionary or two in btwn), w/Memphis working on units after the Pyramids. Don't know what ya'll think, but we have everything but Islam founded, and that's a bit aways from all the AIs, imo. Oh, and that reminds me, i had a pic of possible tech trades, and we should check that out. Mao has ABCs as well as other tasty early techs we may want.
I had to go back a ways to get the roster. Seems like everyone knows their place, but me ~
da Roster said:
And the Save:
pawelo
Emperor
Thanks pholkhero for the report, even if it's picture-less
I have managed a little dotmap that might inspire us regarding future mainland cities:
I think it's critical to get two of them and would go for the blue-wine and green-ivory spots, blocking AI expansion.
Red and pink are great too, but wa can backfill them anytime.
I haven't put the land stripe in the dotmap beacause dotting is pretty easy on it
You're right on military urgency - we have to get 2 defenders in each city asap and road everything between. I would also place the two scouting warriors on garrison duty between us and Mao & Stalin, and one more at the end of the stripe. We need to know fast if someone comes for us
Wonders will have to wait after Pyramids...
Good move on bulbing CS!
Priority - spam buddhism to all Maos cities before he spams Juda.
I would try to convert him even before, he has buddha in his capitol.
We can also trade with Mao, but I wouldn't trade him Meditation / Monotheism to deny him missionary spamming before he gets buddha everywhere and forgets the Torah.
pholkhero - nice turns there - great to see the first of those silly peninsula cities get online. And a bonus religion! It's all good.
I like the dotmap!
Green will be a little food poor - but there's certainly no better place to put it... irrigated grasslands will do it.
Agree!
I don't think the wonders need to be a big priority for us, they're really nice extras, but I'd put expansion and religious security as much more important? Still, the mids is never a bad thing to have - especially with all those prophets we need to run.
Figure we could aim to convert 1-2 more of Mao's cities and bribe him to convert? We'd need alphabet, as he'd probably want a tech for it?
IMO, things could get really ugly if he starts spreading Judeism to the other AIs? Being stuck as the miliatarily weak religious bad guy, with a few - "You refused to adopt our state religion." diplo penalties... It'd be bad.
While we're at it, 1 missionary to each AI capital should pay us back many times over. They'll be friendlier and likely spread our religion for us?
I think it's critical to get two of them and would go for the blue-wine and green-ivory spots, blocking AI expansion.
Red and pink are great too, but wa can backfill them anytime.
I haven't put the land stripe in the dotmap beacause dotting is pretty easy on it
I like the dotmap!
Green will be a little food poor - but there's certainly no better place to put it... irrigated grasslands will do it.
Agree!
I don't think the wonders need to be a big priority for us, they're really nice extras, but I'd put expansion and religious security as much more important? Still, the mids is never a bad thing to have - especially with all those prophets we need to run.
Figure we could aim to convert 1-2 more of Mao's cities and bribe him to convert? We'd need alphabet, as he'd probably want a tech for it?
IMO, things could get really ugly if he starts spreading Judeism to the other AIs? Being stuck as the miliatarily weak religious bad guy, with a few - "You refused to adopt our state religion." diplo penalties... It'd be bad.
While we're at it, 1 missionary to each AI capital should pay us back many times over. They'll be friendlier and likely spread our religion for us?
stuge
Emperor
Checklist:
-military
-missionaries
-a settler?
I assume we're going to switch to representation. Nice dotmap pawelo, but I'd move green dot 1E. River access for some overlap with Thebes is a good trade IMO.
-military
-missionaries
-a settler?
I assume we're going to switch to representation. Nice dotmap pawelo, but I'd move green dot 1E. River access for some overlap with Thebes is a good trade IMO.
pawelo
Emperor
@stuge
I'd rather put it in this order:
- two missionaries for mao
- two settlers
- military
I don't think the AI is on the verge of attacking us. We are not close to a madman like Shaka, and we don't push anyone's borders.
I agree - 1E is a nice trade. I was trying to fill nicely
@TriviAl
A missionary for Athens, Ulundi and Uruk should also be our priority - there is no need to delay them. I would send the first one for Athens during the same time as the two Mao's missionaries. Next one should go for Uruk.
We can let them spread the right faith for us
I would trade anything to Mao for Alpha, except Missionary techs. I think CoL would be a nice choice and he will accept (if he hasn't it yet - I haven't check the save).
I'd rather put it in this order:
- two missionaries for mao
- two settlers
- military
I don't think the AI is on the verge of attacking us. We are not close to a madman like Shaka, and we don't push anyone's borders.
I agree - 1E is a nice trade. I was trying to fill nicely
@TriviAl
A missionary for Athens, Ulundi and Uruk should also be our priority - there is no need to delay them. I would send the first one for Athens during the same time as the two Mao's missionaries. Next one should go for Uruk.
We can let them spread the right faith for us
I would trade anything to Mao for Alpha, except Missionary techs. I think CoL would be a nice choice and he will accept (if he hasn't it yet - I haven't check the save).
I also think military can wait, aside from a single defender to get rid of those unhappiness penalties where needed.
On expansion: Wouldn't purple be better 1S? It would gain cows and lose 1 (or is that two?) hills. I'm not sure that it can work all of it's hills in it's present location unless we farm the floodplains, and I prefer cottaging to farming where possible.
I don't think we are in danger of losing the blue and green dots to AI expansion. Therefore, I would settle red dot first to jumpstart seaworld settlements, then blue dot followed by either green dot or more of seaworld.
On expansion: Wouldn't purple be better 1S? It would gain cows and lose 1 (or is that two?) hills. I'm not sure that it can work all of it's hills in it's present location unless we farm the floodplains, and I prefer cottaging to farming where possible.
I don't think we are in danger of losing the blue and green dots to AI expansion. Therefore, I would settle red dot first to jumpstart seaworld settlements, then blue dot followed by either green dot or more of seaworld.
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