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RAND 1.76 Balancing and Suggestions

Discussion in 'Rise of Mankind: A New Dawn' started by Afforess, Oct 27, 2010.

  1. IronClaymore

    IronClaymore Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2010
    Messages:
    125
    Location:
    Aussie Land
    Just having a bit of a problem with realistic corporations game option. Normally when I find something I don't like I'd change the python or XML file (I don't play multiplayer) and leave it at that, but this is something firmly wedged into the dll.

    It's this section of code from CvCity.cpp (copied from the sourceforge.net site):

    Spoiler :
    //Decay
    else
    {
    //TODO: Should HQ ever relocate?
    if (this != GC.getGameINLINE().getHeadquarters((CorporationTypes)iI))
    {
    iAverageSpread = GC.getGameINLINE().getAverageCorporationInfluence(this, (CorporationTypes)iI);
    iSpread = GC.getCorporationInfo((CorporationTypes)iI).getSpread();
    iSpread *= getCorporationInfluence((CorporationTypes)iI);
    iSpread /= 100;
    iSpread *= kOwner.getCorporationInfluence((CorporationTypes)iI);
    iSpread /= 100;

    int iDiff = iAverageSpread - iSpread;
    //Our influence is lower than average
    if (iDiff > 0)
    {
    if (GC.getGameINLINE().getSorenRandNum(GC.getDefineINT("CORPORATION_SPREAD_RAND"), "Corporation Decay") < iDiff)
    {
    setHasCorporation((CorporationTypes)iI, false, true, false);
    break;
    }
    }
    }
    }


    As far as I can tell, this grabs the influence of an individual corporation presence in a city (from elsewhere in the file), compares it to the average, and if that particular corporation is lacking it's chucked into a random number generator. Rolling badly on the generator purges the corp from the city. Because it's compared to the average, generally about half the corporations are at risk of being purged at any given moment.

    (The influence function already includes the effect of taxation/subsidy, so if everyone is running the same civics the effect of these are cancelled out (both iAverageSpread and iSpread are altered to the same degree).)

    The problem I'm having in my games is that it's obliterating every corporate presence outside the headquarters. A corp will randomly set up in a city, as desired, stay for a few turns, then disappear. I don't even get the chance to build the special +yield% buildings unless I rush-buy.

    It's at its worse with food corps. They join a marginal city that already capped out its food supply, let it grow a couple of sizes, then leave, starving it back to the old size (while increasing the revolution index).Talk about the lack of empathy in a capitalist economy!

    It just seems...unrealistic. A city grows to rely on a corporation, only to have it leave within months, despite it having no competition. Perhaps the weighting should be edited, meaning a corporation has to be doing really badly to simply disappear. Or even get rid of the entire section of code, ensuring only civics and hostile takeovers can oust a corporation's presence.

    Otherwise, I'm loving realistic corporations. Not having to save up great people for when my tech advances, not building hundreds of executives (most of whom fail their missions anyway), buying all the headquarters off the AI then bankrupting their economies through maintenance costs...mmm, fun.
     
  2. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
    What version are you playing? I don't have any problem like that in my game...
     
  3. ichbinsehselber

    ichbinsehselber Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2005
    Messages:
    328
    The example is from one of my cities. Similar issues happened more than once (also in different cities).
     
  4. Koshling

    Koshling Vorlon

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Messages:
    9,254
    Ok. I fixed (somewhat) the routine the AI uses a couple weeks ago, but I have not looked at the player governer one. It is pretty brain-dead though, I do know. I'll get around to looking at it at some point (soooo much stuff to look at though...).
     
  5. antoca

    antoca Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2010
    Messages:
    98
    Location:
    Russia
    last official, 1.75c

    (added the save)
     

    Attached Files:

  6. Smikis

    Smikis Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2011
    Messages:
    93

    just luck, there are maps where you can select it to be balanced, been games where my capital and couple cities just skyrockets and i take over the game
    there been times when i get my starting area such useless place that i just give up 20 turns later, or never really catch up
     
  7. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
    That's why flexible difficulty is so great - btw we need some difficulty levels harder than deity : there should be a difficulty level that only the best player can win with extreme luck, right now, when I reach Deity, it's a sign that I most likely will win this game.

    When ships and land units are present in a city, alt-clicking the land units will instead select all ships.
     
  8. Stelmack

    Stelmack Warlord

    Joined:
    May 21, 2010
    Messages:
    111
    We have it. Its called, start at a harder difficulty, one city challenge etc.
     
  9. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
    I'm already starting at Deity (or one lower). What if I don't want to play OCC?
     
  10. zeinul

    zeinul Warlord

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2010
    Messages:
    143
    i'm playing deity, but the ai is too tough. they build army like crazy. making huge stacks of 50+ that no way you can defeat.
     
  11. os79

    os79 Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2009
    Messages:
    3,070
    Location:
    Eastern USA Coast
    So? Deity is supposed to be hard...
     
  12. Stelmack

    Stelmack Warlord

    Joined:
    May 21, 2010
    Messages:
    111
    Go down a level?...
     
  13. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
    I didn't see any big stacks in my games. Even if they did, the IA is completely clueless about combat tactics. Also, that's what siege units are for : killing big stacks.

    Is it normal that merchants are so much easier to get than scientists?
     
  14. Koshling

    Koshling Vorlon

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Messages:
    9,254
    You're COMPLAINING that the AI is TOO GOOD???? My ideal with AI tweaks (which will NOT be achieved, lol) would be to force mere humans to play on a fully level playing field with the AI (so at Noble). If you can regularly win at diety the AI is FAR too weak since there is no more adjustment to be had. I'd LOVE to get the AI to a point where people can't win on diety without being EXTREMELY lucky, but it's SOOO dumb currently, so I doubt I'll even meet that goal (working on it though)
     
  15. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
    Well, no, as you can see, I'm complaining that the AI is too bad. But that's something common to all civ (and most 4x) games...

    Actually abandoned one game (deity the whole time) because I felt that I was going to lose... but I'm probably not a very good player either.
     
  16. Stelmack

    Stelmack Warlord

    Joined:
    May 21, 2010
    Messages:
    111
    I think you have missed some point somewhere. If you quit a game because it is too hard, then the AI is doing good, not bad.
     
  17. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

    Joined:
    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
  18. Isabelxxx

    Isabelxxx DoaNE Explorer

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2010
    Messages:
    376
    This is what BlueTemplar or Zeinul are trying to say, a detail:

    A good AI is not equal to an AI with x20 more units than the player at the start of the game. That makes you quit the game sometimes but the AI will still be beatable by a monkey.

    It knows what to do with the resources but not how to achieve those aims in an optimal way.

    Don't confuse tactics and strategy. AI totally lacks one but -usually- knows well the other.
     
  19. BlueTemplar

    BlueTemplar Prince

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    May 14, 2006
    Messages:
    376
    It would be clearer if when resources are in your borders, but you still haven't build the improvement on them, that their circle would stay white.
     
  20. Aline

    Aline Cat

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2007
    Messages:
    465
    Dunno if this has been reported or not but not having slavery gives +1:mad: instead of +1:)
     

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