Rebalance of 2/3 of all civs in April!

[Stringer1313]

The main thing I would like to see in a general overhaul is a rework of the stupid 'denounce, denounce, denounce' nonsense that currently stops all diplo favour after a successful war.
A good example was yesterday - I was playing as John Curtin, and Spain were on my Eastern border and friendly with them (as with all the other civs) right up to the point where on the very turn the friendship with Spain expired he declared a surprise war on me.
This went about as well as you might expect given Curtin's bonuses when declared on by surprise and I promptly eviscerated the Spanish Empire, wiped him out in the North-East by taking 4 cities including his Capital & then peaced out.
From that point onwards, I was in negative diplo favour for the rest of the damned game - nothing I could do stopped this, everyone denounced me as soon as they could & remained unfriendly for the rest of the game even though I never attacked anyone, and did all the usual stuff - I remained in permanent negative diplo favour, despite having Kilwa wonder and suzerainty of 7 city states (the others having been killed in the main by the AI apart from a couple over on the second continent that had survived).
All my cities were ecstatic or happy (I know how to do this) yet diplo favour remained absolutely negative for the rest of the game because 'I had caused grievances against them' when the only civ I hurt was Spain, who were PITA to everyone & I really should have just wiped the buggers right out and saved the world a lot of trouble, myself included.

The point is that right now, unless you go on a domination roll, then once you take one capital, then it seems you end up in negative diplo favour for the rest of the game.

I support this outcome in your game. I currently find diplomatic favor to be way too easy to obtain, and the diplomatic victory too easy, especially if you spam pagodas (which I think should only give 0.5 diplo favor, not 1) but even if you don't spam them. The grievance system is intended to handle the surprise war. If you had surprise war declared on you, you were only justified in taking 1-2 cities under the grievance system. Your overreaction rightfully made you unfit to be the peaceful leader of the world. I had a game where I won a diplomatic victory even though I captured tons of cities, only because I only captured cities to the point where it zeroed out the grievances (most of them were caused by protectorate wars - AI kept declaring war on my CS's). (And then, I used 3 nukes for the hell of it near the end of the game and still won a diplo victory LOL b/c i was winning various send aid quests --- using a nuke should definitely result in diplo favor negatives)

 

[Josephias]

For the CB bonuses, I think Cyrus and Chandragupta's are fine because to a large degree you control the ability to activate them. Australia's isn't really a CB bonus, but it's related and I think is also fine - it serves the purpose of protecting you if you get declared on, and it's not too hard later in the game to find cities to liberate if you want to. Tamar's is ok, since I've found protectorate wars are reasonably common. I like the idea of letting her do it earlier and with any city-state where she has an envoy.
Scotland's is pretty garbage. I would be a fan of having theirs work for protectorate wars as well as wars of liberation, and/or having it borrow from Australia and apply to liberating cities as well. As it is, I've played a few games with Scotland and never had an opportunity to activate it, and the one game where I did, there is actually an incentive to not recapture the city for your ally (since if you leave it in enemy hand's you can just keep declaring a war of liberation then making peace and get the bonus 10 turns on and 10 turns off).

Yes, I agree Scotland's CB is pretty unuseful as it is based in a Casus Belli that it is not that usual to have option to. As commented, extend it to Reconquest and Liberation wars, or better even, extend it to anytime you join a war because an ally is attacked, or to "civ city" capture emergencies (yes, that is extending Robert to a GS mechanic, but why not . Tone down the production bonus if necessary. I think it's more fun a smaller bonus that triggers once in a while, than a very big bonus you hardly see (that last is playing lottery).

Same with Tamar, to have more opportunities to use her bonus, allow her to trigger it as well when joining city-state emergencies. And probably advancing it a bit would be interesting too. I'd say Divine Right is fitting tematically and gameplay-wise for her to trigger Protectorate wars.


And regarding this, although units might deserve its own tree

Does anyone hope that they review units in the update? I really hope that they buff recon units. They just seem too useless to bother with building after the initial exploratory phase. I wish they could ignore borders and become invisible to non-adjacent units without an upgrade, like a land privateer. Maybe have them boost spies in cities they are camped in, like you would expect a recon unit to do.
Also why do need to choose between movement penalties in forests or penalties on hills?? Why not just make that one promotion?

Said once ill say it agaim, scout and l cav fill the same role and encroach on each others abilities. They are both light, mobile, raiders/pillagers. Eliminate l cav and consolidate the two units.
Scouts will now be the flank, pillage, mobile unit that can snipe back line siege units and go behind enemy lines.
Making an entire unit just to uncover map is great for the first 50 turn. This game doesnt even need scout upgrades past skirmisher.

Valid Point. Updated below.
General
- Scout class reworked to not be bad at their job after horses are discovered, and Skirmisher and Spec. Ops. buffed to useful levels of power.

I think the best option is Kung-Fu initial proposal: from skirmisher on, give them stealth and "ignore-borders". This would be a strong way to differentiate them from light cav. They will act for reconissance before you send your troops...

and

If you want to give them a greater buff and extra usefulness: provide them a 1-tile aura were any of your units entering these tiles ignores movement penalties. (This is, your scouts have recognized the terrain, and even if it is normally a difficult terrain to move, you know which is the shortest, cleanest path around him).

 

[Archon_Wing]

EDIT. Second Example Poland. You have two paths here Military/religion with UU in culture tree (really?) and UB as a support for a military game.

It's easier to push culture than it is to push science, especially since Poland would prefer a religion instead of campuses early on. And you need trade/gold to fund an army.

Also as a whole military and religious victories have a strong synergy with each other. Advancing a domination victory also advances a religious victory and faith also is very powerful in a domination victory. In reality though, any military bonus is a general benefit.

The greater problem is the hussar needs to be hard built and it is not what it once was because of the problem vs walls.

 

[bbbt]

A "bad" civ I would say is England-Eleanor. Her problem is that her leader ability means you need to be going down the faith/culture path in order to get great works from either relics or art. But the UB and UU are both naval, so she also needs to be a coastal empire. But coastal empires are also usually more spaced out, which contradicts her leader bonus. But then on top of that, the civ ability is now all about industrialization, which means you need an encampment for engineer spam, and need to be building out your industrial zones. But then none of that are science bonuses, so when exactly can she build campuses?

Did they make her LUA work with the products from the corporations game mode? That would at least be a bone thrown to integration. But I agree England remains a bit of a hodgepodge. Maybe they will get revamp number 4(?) in April?

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Did they make her LUA work with the products from the corporations game mode? That would at least be a bone thrown to integration. But I agree England remains a bit of a hodgepodge. Maybe they will get revamp number 4(?) in April?

I would assume that's the case. The Royal Navy Dockyard, with a seaport, now has slots for products that fit in with her playstyle.

 

[greenOak]

Being disagreeable but:

Phoenicia's move capital project is perfectly fine the way it is. Sure it costs the same as a wonder and realistically can only be done once, but when properly planned for it gives a empire wide 25% boost to gold, and 10% boost to production contingent on using the colonial taxes card. Casa has great synergy with it as well. I have played Phoenicia more than any other civ outside maybe Japan, and I can't remember the last time I wasn't able to take advantage of this project. All you need is a patch of coast with some trees/stone/deer. Last Phoenicia run I had the project chopped out just before turn 110.

Being in negative diplo favor for the rest of the game seems like a small price to pay for conquering an entire civ. The balance surrounding warmongering is currently in a good place in civ 6. Yes it is heavily slanted in the favour of the defender, but that's a good thing IMO. The snowball effect of taking over an entire civilization is immense. I personally don't want to go back to the old versions of civ where conquering your neighbour ASAP was the correct strategy regardless of victory condition. It's much more nuanced now.

It's fine having certain leaders with garbage abilities (Peter), or certain civs having garbage buildings/improvements/abilities (Aztec arena). Leaders are tied to their nations in civ 6 so it doesn't make sense to talk about a leader's ability without talking about their civ's bonuses. Don't see why we need to make Peter's ability better when Russia is already super strong. Moreover, I see zero reason why good Lavra/Mother Russia and good Peter should be preferred to stupid good Lavra/Mother Russia and garbage tier Peter if the overall strength ends up being similar.

 

[8housesofelixir]

I agree, Phoenicia is one of the almost perfectly designed civ, they don't really need a lot of balancing, maybe besides fully unlock Writing and give Bireme another +1 movement.

Still, I would say that the Phoenician design of Civilization Expanded is more flavorful:

Begin the game with the Writing technology unlocked.
Gain access to the Move Capital unique project in cities with a Cothon.
Cothons gain extra +1 Great Merchant Point.
+50% Production towards buildings in the Capital.
Founded coastal cities on the same continent as the Capital have 100% Loyalty.
Settlers gain +2 Movement and +2 sight range while embarked. Settlers ignore additional Movement costs from embarking and disembarking.
Coastal cities begin with a free Trading Post and receive +25% Production towards their first specialty district.
Trade Routes gain +1 Science and +1 Gold for every 5 tiles traveled.
Traders generate +1 Great Scientist point while traveling within 3 tiles of any Campus.

 

[anonxanemone]

I agree, Phoenicia is one of the almost perfectly designed civ, they don't really need a lot of balancing, maybe besides fully unlock Writing and give Bireme another +1 movement.

Still, I would say that the Phoenician design of Civilization Expanded is more flavorful:

I like the extra Great Merchant point from Cothons, which is lacking in Phoenicia's moveset in an otherwise (I feel like I'm repeating what's already said) well-designed civ.

 

[greenOak]

I agree, Phoenicia is one of the almost perfectly designed civ, they don't really need a lot of balancing, maybe besides fully unlock Writing and give Bireme another +1 movement.

Still, I would say that the Phoenician design of Civilization Expanded is more flavorful:

I mean it might be more flavorful but its also broken AF. Granted, the entire point of that mod is to make every civ broken, but I hope they don't take that route in the April re-balance. There's already enough ridiculously powerful stuff as it is.

 

[Pietato]

It's fine having certain leaders with garbage abilities (Peter), or certain civs having garbage buildings/improvements/abilities (Aztec arena). Leaders are tied to their nations in civ 6 so it doesn't make sense to talk about a leader's ability without talking about their civ's bonuses. Don't see why we need to make Peter's ability better when Russia is already super strong. Moreover, I see zero reason why good Lavra/Mother Russia and good Peter should be preferred to stupid good Lavra/Mother Russia and garbage tier Peter if the overall strength ends up being similar.

So Russia can get another leader.

 

[BD123]

Russia always annoys me bc it's a religious civ with its Lavra but Peter himself wasn't exactly the most friendly to the Orthodox establishment during his time but oh well. I think a simple fix for Russia would be to tie the +1 GWAM points to the Lavra's buildings like the Civilizations Expanded mod, so +1 GW for shrine, +1 GA for temple, and +1 GM for worship building. Then maybe beef up Peter with +1 science/culture on intl routes scaling with era?

Honestly I think all of the CB-based leader abilities need to go. It's been 4-5 yeas since release we can surely be more creative than "production boost for special type of war for 10 turns." Cyrus and Chandragupta are fine but I'd prefer they get worked over completely too just to eliminate CB abilities entirely.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Some of my personal suggestions

:cracks knuckles:

America:
> No changes. (well rounded civ)
America's strengths lie in their powerful late-game culture victory, which they can pull of reliably.

Arabia:
> The Last Prophet: gains +1% Science for every city following Arabia's religion, as opposed to a flat +1 Science
> Righteousness of the Faith: Worship building increases Science, Culture and Faith yields by 15% (is 10%)
> Mamluk: Iron cost reduced to 1.
Improving the scalability of Arabia's bonuses should polish them up a bit.

Australia:
> Land Down Under: Negative appeal reduces district adjacency (to a minimum of 0)
Australia's yield gains through their CUA is absurd. Reducing adjacency from unappealing tiles will nerf their science and production enough to no longer make them the best Science Victory Civ under the sun.

Aztec
> Legend of the Five Suns: Now grants +50% Production towards Entertainment Complexes and their buildings.
> Tlachtli: +1 GGP, +1 Culture and +1 Faith from each district adjacent to the Entertainment Complex.
A few minor bonuses to make the Tlachtli more appealing.

Babylon
> Enuma Anu Enlil: Science yield reduced to -100%, increasing by +5% for every era reached. Eureka percentage starts at 100%, but decreases by -5% every era.
> Sabum Kibittum: replaces the Spearman, upgrades into the Pike&Shot.
A more extreme and scalable version of Babylon's CUA should make them highly Eureka dependent early on and put them on the same level as other civs in the late game. Sabum Kibittum is largely useless as it's rendered obselete too quickly to really affect things. Making it replace the Spearman (or Warrior) should amend this.

Brazil
> Magnanimous: GPP recoup bonus increased to 25% (is 20%)
Brazil's fine the way they are. The only room for improvement would be increasing the effect of Pedro's LUA.

Byzantium
> No changes (bonuses are strong but hard to make use of)
Byzantium's bonuses are challenging to pull off, but not impossible. I see no reason to change them.

Canada
> Last Best West: All tile improvements on Tundra grant +1 of their base yield. Discovering Civil Engineering extends this bonus to Plains and Snow tiles as well. (retain ability to cheaply purchase tundra snow, extra extraction and build farms on tundra)
> Four Faces of Peace: +1 Diplomatic Favour for every 50 Tourism earned.
> Mountie: Range from National Parks extended.
This should make Tundra significantly better for Canada, while also keeping the nearby Snow and Plains tiles appealing. The other changes improve their Diplomatic game, as I feel this should be the victory type they should be going for.

China
> Dynastic Cycle: Eureka/Inspiration boost increased to 60% (was 50%)
> Crouching Tiger: Now replaces the Crossbowman.
China's weakest abilities are improved, to better synergize with Kublai Khan.

Cree
> Nihitaw: Start the game with a recon unit, and all recon units gain double experience from combat and +5 Strength when attacking. (trader and land claiming bonuses retained)
> Favorable Terms: Yields scaling upon reaching the Medieval and Industrial era's.
> Okhichitaw: Cost reduced to match that of a regular scout
This should make Cree Recon units better and allow them to retain them for the remainder of the game.

Egypt
> Iteru: Flood Plains grant +1 Appeal as opposed to -1 Appeal. Wonder/District bonus from rivers increased to +25%
> Mediterranean's Bride: Bonuses increase by 50% per alliance level.
Much needed boost to river-related production to keep pace with the other production bonuses introduced since. The appeal bonus synergizes well with the Sphynx. Cleo's trade routes should be better per alliance.

England ~ Reworked
> Workshop of the World: Reworked - Industrial Zones, Encampments and Royal Navy Dockyards grant a major adjacency bonuses to all adjacent specialty districts. Cities with an IZ, Encampment or RND extract +1 extra strategic resource per turn (all resources, not just Iron and Coal) and build all buildings +15% faster. Power from owned Power Plants is doubled, and Powered Buildings grant +4 of their respective yield. Receive a Free Military Engineer when completing a Factory, Armory or Shipyard building, whichever is built first.
> Pax Britannica: The first city settled on a new continent (including the starting continent) grants Victoria +1 Trade Route capacity and a free trader. Owned cities on a different continent than the Capital ignore 50% of other Civilizations's loyalty pressure.
> Court of Love: Each different Great Work displayed in a city grants it +1 Amenity (in addition to the usual bonus). Capitals flipped by this ability do not incur a Diplomatic Favor penalty.
This polishes England's rougher edges and streamlines their industrial and expansive capabilities. Also fixes Eleanor's problem of no early game bonuses / negative Dip from flipping Capitals peacefully.

Ethiopia
> No changes
Ethiopa is strong and their bonuses have good synergies. They need no changes.

France
> Grand Tour: All cities with a World Wonder gain +1 Appeal to all tiles. Wonder Tourism Bonus increased to +200% upon reaching the Renaissance era. Construction bonus retained.
> Court of Love: Each different Great Work displayed in a city grants it +1 Amenity (in addition to the usual bonus). Capitals flipped by this ability to not incur a Diplomatic Favor penalty.
> Château: No longer require a river. Instead must be placed on a tile with Charming appeal or better, and receive +2 Tourism if built on a tile with Breathtaking appeal.
Grand Tour now actively aids France's CV in a more meaningful way. Tying Châteaux into appeal would be a logical follow-up here. CdM's abilities (either form) stay the same - she's a good leader.

Gaul
> No changes
Gaul is powerful enough and I see no reason to buff or nerf them.

Georgia ~ Reworked
> Glory to the World, Kingdom and Faith: Have access to the Golden Age War Casus Belli whenever in a Golden Age. All units receive +5 Combat Strength when in a Golden Age and lost -5 Combat Strength when in a Dark Age. Every Envoy sent to a City State while in a Golden Age counts as two envoys. -15% to ALL yields when in a Dark Age.
> Strength In Unity: : All faith purchase costs are increased by 100%. All buildings can be bought with faith. Gain +1 Era Score from buying units or buildings with Faith. Allied City States provide +2 Faith per stationed Envoy.
> Khevsur: Now replaces the Musketman, Combat Strength adjusted accordingly. Costs no Niter.
> Tsikhe: Now built automatically in every city with Medieval Walls upon the discovery of Siege Tactics. They are also built automatically in every city upon discovering Steel, regardless of whether they have other Walls present or not.
Massive changes, but they turn Georgia into an asymetrical religious warmonger who live and die by their ability to chain Golden Ages.

Germany
> Holy Roman Emperor: Receive +1 Diplomatic Favour for every 5 unspent Envoys.
Patches up Germany's weak Dip somewhat. Doesn't feel right that a Holy Roman Emperor should be so bad at Dip, right?

Gran Colombia
> Ejecito Patriota: Movement bonus now exclusive to all Civilian units and military units in range of a Commandante General.
> Hacienda: retconned back to their original value.
Adds a condition to Gran Colombia's crazy CUA, and buffs the useless Hacienda's.

Greece
> Surrounded by Glory: Culture yields decreased to +3% culture per City State Suzerainity.
> Thermopylae: Culture gained is now 50% of the defeated unit's production cost.
This should improve the balance between Greece's leaders and make Gorgo more viable. (Alternatively, Pericles could get +5% Science, Gold, Culture or Faith based on the City State type, but I feel iffy about giving him Science bonuses. Science is too precious to just hand out like Candy)


Hungary
> No changes
Hungary are one of the best Civs in the game without being ridiculous. No changes needed.

Inca
> No changes (Strong, balanced Civ)
The Inca are one of the most fun Civs to play and hold up well against the others. No changes needed.

India:
> Dharma: Instead of increased religious pressure, all trade routes receive +1 Faith and Culture for each different majority religion present in the sending and origin city.
> Satyagraha: +5% faith per peaceful Civ met, not +5 (up to +35% extra Faith)
> Stepwell: Provide an Amenity at Civil Engineering.
Chandy stays the same as his Varu rush remains very dangerous. Gandhi is buffed to patch up his pathetic Faith economy. Stepwells need to be buffed, and giving them an Amenity seems like the easiest way to do so.

Indonesia
> Great Nusantara: Adjacency bonus from coast and lakes increased to +1. Water Parks now also benefit from the extra amenity from being built adjacent to coasts and lakes.
Indonesia struggle on land maps, and this should make them more reliable.

Japan
> No changes
Japan is an easy Civ to play and master. No need to change them.

Khmer ~ Reworked
> Monasteries of the King: All districts built adjacent to a river provide +2 Housing and Culture bomb adjacent tiles and reduce the cost of the next district by 5% each. (capped at 50%)
> Grand Barays: Aqueducts, Dams and Canals provide major adjacency bonuses to adjacent specialty districts. Improvements adjacent to Aqueducts, Dams and Canals provide +1 of their associated yield.
> Prasat: Grants double Tourism from Relics stationed in their city.
Makes Khmer's bonuses more generalistic and easier to pull off, as opposed to awkwardly pigeonholing them into faith and growth, two weak yields to be specializing in. Khmer also needs a boost to their relic tourism, as it's one of the few 'Win Conditions' they currently have.

Kongo
> Nkisi: Extra appeal on tiles adjacent to a Mbanza or Preserve District. (in addition to the usual bonuses)
Kongo are strong, but the extra appeal can help them make use of the new Preserve District (which sucks for Kongo due to their start bias)

Korea ~ Reworked
> Hwarang: +3% Culture and +3% Science per specialist citizen in that city. All Districts and World Wonders provide +1 Housing to their city.
> Three Kingdoms: Receive a Governor Title each time they build a World Wonder in their Capital city. Governors provide +1 Amenity and +5 Loyalty to their city per promotion level. Cities without Governors suffer a -1 Amenity and -5 Loyalty penalty.
> Seowon: +1 Science from each adjacent Mine, Lumber Mill or Quarry. No science from Districts, Reefs or Mountains. Must be built on a hill.
These changes should make Korea fun and asymetrical. Please implement them, tyvm.

Macedon
> error 404 no footage found

Mali
> No changes
honestly, this Civ is not for me and I doubt I'll ever play them but they have their purpose.

Maori
> Pa Fortress: Grant +1 Production, increasing to +2 at Conservation. After Flight, provide Tourism equal to Production yield.
Makes Pa's better. Maori don't need anything else.

Mapuche ~ Reworked
> Swift Hawk: Loyalty losses due to this abilty cannot be recouped for the next five turns. Cities flipped by this ability skip the Free City stage and join the Mapuche outright. Free Cities NEVER attack Mapuche units.
> Toqui: Military units gain +10 Strength against Civs in a Golden Age or Free City units. All Governor bonuses extend to any owned city within 6 tiles of their city. (bonus experience is dropped)
This fixes Lautaro's negative leader ability, while Toqui's changes synergize with the whole "anti-GA, anti-Free City" shtick they've got going on. Mapuche should be a wide Civ and hopefully these bonuses help with that.
Note: while you are at it, fix their godawful city list, tyvm.

Maya
> Mayab: All cities start with +2 Housing, irrespective of Fresh Water or Coast. (other bonuses retained)
> Ix Mutal Ajaw: Range extended to 7 (is 6), bonuses increased to +15%, penalties decreased to -10%
> Observatory: +1 Science from each adjacent Camp, Farm and Plantation. No adjacency bonus from Districts, bonus from Reefs and Mountains reduced to minor boosts. Must be built on flat lands.
Mayans are rather underwhelming, but these small adjustments should aid their empire. Observatory adjacencies amended to make it a better district (and the flatland counterpart of my reworked Seowon).

The Netherlands
> Radio Oranje: Culture/Loyalty bonus increased by +1 for every era reached after the Classical.
> Polder: +1 Production.
The Dutch are a good Civ already, so all we need is increased scaling for the Polder and Billie's LUA and we're set.

Mongolia
> Örtöö: Reduces the time a trade route remains active by -50%
A small change that allows Mongolia to extend their trading post network faster.

Norway
> Knarr: +1 Production from Fishing boats and Fisheries, +2 Faith from reefs. (in addition to the usual bonuses)
> Berserker: Can be purchased with faith, grants Faith when killing units or if killed.
> Stave Church: Reduces Faith Purchase costs by -25%.
Helps Norway's religion (which is needed as their UI is a temple), while also giving them a window of opportunity for a Berserker time push/rush in the early medieval era.

Nubia
> Nubian Pyramid: +2 Yields from adjacent districts, as opposed to +1. Can now be built on Tundra (hills) and Snow (hills).
Buffs the weak Nubian UI to acceptable levels.

Ottomans
> No changes
The Ottomans are good at what they do, and I see no reason to change their abilities.

Persia:
> Satrapies: Domestric Trade Route yields increased upon entering the Medieval and Industrial era's.
Adds scaling to yet another weak trade-related ability.

Phoenicia:
> Founder of Carthage: Receive the cheapest Tech or Civic they can research for free when meeting a new Civ for the first time (in addition to other bonuses)
> Mediterranean Colonies: Cities with a Cothon District build Settlers +100% faster. No Eureka for Writing (other bonuses retained)
> Cothon: Grants Production equal to its gold bonus (Settler recruitment bonus moved to CUA)
Shuffles Phoenicia's abilities around while polishing them up. Phoenicia is very close to being a good Civ but falls just short of being one.
Note: the cheapest tech or civic includes the cost reduction after the Eureka/Inspiration has been attained. So basically, it grants them a tech or civic they've already boosted but haven't researched yet. Moved this part of the ability to Dido to reflect her lore (and interactions with the Numidians and Aeneas)

Poland
> Golden Liberty: Receive +1 Faith and +1 Culture from each Wildcard Policy Slot in the government (scales with Government type) (other bonuses retained)
> Winged Hussar: cost reduced
This improves Poland's early Faith economy and their ability to get a better Pantheon. Cheaper Winged Hussar's improve their military, as their bonuses point towards Dom.

Rome
> All Roads Lead To Rome: All Roman cities within trade route range of the capital have double loyalty to Rome.
> Roman Fort: +1 Production, +1 Food when completed, gains +2 Culture after Conservation and +4 Tourism after Flight.
Buffs the Roman Fort to mirror my changes to the Maori Pa. Extra loyalty from Trading Posts makes sense for an expansionistic empire and makes Rome even more noob-friendly.

Russia:
> Grand Embassy: Now provides a random Eureka or Inspiration the foreign Civ has upon completing the Trade Route. Russian Trading Posts grant their city +1 slot for Great Works.
> Lavra: Provides a GWP point if it has a Shrine, a GAP, when it has a Temple and a GMP once the Worship building has been completed
One of the rare cases where I would advocate a nerf. Russia's problem is that they have the fastest Culture Victory in the game. These changes delay it without compromising on their competency.

Scotland:
> Bannockburn: Reworked: Military units receive +5 Combat Strength against Civs that have more cities than Scotland. Using a Casus Belli doubles Scotland's Great Person Points for the first 10 turns of the war. (doesn't stack)
> Golf Course: An additional Golf Course can be built upon discovering the Professional Sports Civic. It also allows Golf Courses to be built on Desert and Desert Hills tiles.
Bannockburn is utter garbage, and these changes make Scotland better adept at Domination (weird that a Civ so good as Science and Production is so bad at war, right? That doesn't feel right). Extra Golf Courses in the endgame should allow them to take advantage of their CUA even if they went wide.

Scythia:
> Killer of Cyrus: now affects religious units again.
> People of the Steppe: Light Cavalry no longer cost gold maintenance. Instead, cost Faith.
> Kurgan: +1 Faith from Mysticism and Reformed Church. Upon discovering Conservation, grants Culture equal to Faith. Upon Discovering Flight, Grants Tourism equal to Faith.
> Saka Horse Archer: Now replaces the Horseman, promotion tree changed to Light Cavalry. Remains a Horseman with +1 Range however.
This should buff Scythia back to acceptable (ie: high power) levels.

Spain
> El Escorial: Combat bonus vs Civs of other faiths increased to +6. Inquisitors can be bought immediately upon founding a religion (other bonuses retained)
> Treasure Fleets: Their default bonuses (+1F/+1P or +6G) apply to all trade routes and double for incontinental ones. Additionally, receive +5 Combat Strength to Fleets and Armada's.
This turns Spain into naval Zulu and gives their mediocre economy a much-needed boost. The combat buff helps their Dom game even when they don't have Conqs.

Sumeria
> No changes
I would give Sumeria a new CUA because of the flavor, but mechanically they don't need a change. They're good and will remain such after the balance.

Sweden
> No changes
Sweden have a strong mid-game Culture spike which can usually carry them to CV depending on who their opponents are.

Vietnam
> Nine Dragon River Delta: bonus Culture/Production/Science scales with building tier. All clearable features provide +1 appeal to adjacent tiles.
Vietnam's CUA is highly underwhelming and counterintuitive. Increased yields prevent falling behind, and the appeal allows them to use the Preserve to receive yields from Rainforest and Marshes before they spam districts everywhere.

Zulu
> No changes
The Zulu are boring, but reliable and not particularly unfun. I see no reason to alter them.


For the most part, i expect mechanics to stay the same, but tweaked. Some of the previous nerfs should be reverse-engineered to accomodate the new power creep.

 

[bengalryan9]

Canada
> Last Best West: All tile improvements on Tundra grant +1 of their base yield. Discovering Civil Engineering extends this bonus to Plains and Snow tiles as well. (retain ability to cheaply purchase tundra snow, extra extraction and build farms on tundra)
> Four Faces of Peace: +1 Diplomatic Favour for every 50 Tourism earned.
> Mountie: Range from National Parks extended.
This should make Tundra significantly better for Canada, while also keeping the nearby Snow and Plains tiles appealing. The other changes improve their Diplomatic game, as I feel this should be the victory type they should be going for.

If Pedro can get +1 appeal to rainforest I don't see why Canada can't get +1 appeal to tundra and snow tiles. Let them put national parks everywhere and you indirectly buff their mounties. Could even tie their diplo favor bonus to the amount of parks they build as well. Give them bonuses to ski resort tourism in tundra/snow as well.

 

[anonxanemone]

Much of the suggestion here on balancing civs is buffing the abilities, which always has a danger of runaway power creep. Nerfing powerful abilities doesn't feel too nice either. What do you think about designing a malus (like Mali and Maya) for civs that are generally considered "OP" instead?

 

[bengalryan9]

Much of the suggestion here on balancing civs is buffing the abilities, which always has a danger of runaway power creep. Nerfing powerful abilities doesn't feel too nice either. What do you think about designing a malus (like Mali and Maya) for civs that are generally considered "OP" instead?

I'd be fine with that but I would be surprised if they go that direction.

Someone like Peter kind of already has a malus anyways - lack of food if you really want to leverage his strengths - and he's still pretty OP. The Lavra needs to be knocked down a peg IMO.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Russia's problem is more a thing of timing than of raw power. America, Sweden, Vietnam and Canada all are stronger in endgame tourism. Someone reading Russia's ability for the first time would think they're Religious or Domination oriented. Russia's advantage over the others is the breakneck speed at which their Culture develops because they are inundated with Great Writers. Delay that stream to a more, ah, fitting window, and they'll be nerfed accordingly.

 

[Datgingah]

I'd be fine with that but I would be surprised if they go that direction.

Someone like Peter kind of already has a malus anyways - lack of food if you really want to leverage his strengths - and he's still pretty OP. The Lavra needs to be knocked down a peg IMO.

Perhaps making the lavra lose 2/3 of the great person culture points would be enough. Leave them with just writer or artist for example.

 

[CoconutTank]

Just looking through some proposals real quick, haven't seen the full post, but one thing jumped out to me:

Babylon
> Enuma Anu Enlil: Science yield reduced to -100%, increasing by +5% for every era reached. Eureka percentage starts at 100%, but decreases by -5% every era.

Could you elaborate on what this means? Does it really mean Babylon literally has 0 science yield at the start of the game? If so, how would they research Animal Husbandry, Mining and Pottery?

 

[Josephias]

Perhaps making the lavra lose 2/3 of the great person culture points would be enough. Leave them with just writer or artist for example.

Lavra could be adapted to increase the GWAM point production of a TS in the city. This will adjust two issues: first: delaying the time the GWAM points are awarded; second: ensuring you have slots to use them. Maybe allow the capital to keep the base bonus linked to the palace.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Just looking through some proposals real quick, haven't seen the full post, but one thing jumped out to me:

Could you elaborate on what this means? Does it really Babylon literally has 0 science yield at the start of the game? If so, how would they research Animal Husbandry, Mining and Pottery?

lmfao, I forgot about that. Um... Unlock those techs with Culture instead?