Remember remember the 11th of September

[Mechanicalsalvation]

An excelent article by P.C.Roberts on true nature of the conspiracy theories:

In the United States “conspiracy theory” is the name given to explanations that differ from those that serve the ruling oligarchy, the establishment or whatever we want to call those who set and control the agendas and the explanations that support the agendas.

The explanations imposed on us by the ruling class are themselves conspiracy theories. Moreover, they are conspiracy theories designed to hide the real conspiracy that our rulers are operating.

The CIA introduced the term “conspiracy theory” into public discourse as part of its action plan to discredit skeptics of the Warren Commission report on the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. Any explanation other than the one handed down, which is contradicted by all known evidence, was debunked as a conspiracy theory.

And the 9-11:

For example, the official explanation of 9/11 is a conspiracy theory. Some Muslims, mainly Saudi Arabians, delivered the greatest humiliation to a superpower since David slew Goliath. They outsmarted all 17 US intelligence agencies and those of NATO and Israel, the National Security Council, the Transportation Safety Administration, Air Traffic Control, and Dick Cheney, hijacked four US airliners on one morning, brought down three World Trade Center skyscrapers, destroyed that part of the Pentagon where research was underway into the missing $2.3 trillion, and caused the morons in Washington to blame Afghanistan instead of Saudi Arabia.

Clearly, the Saudia Arabians who humiliated Ameria were involved in a conspiracy to do so.

Is it a believable conspiracy?

The ability of a few young Muslim men to pull off such a feat is unbelievable. Such total failure of the US National Security State means that America was blindly vulnerable throughout the decades of Cold War with the Soviet Union. If such total failure of the National Security State had really occurred, the White House and Congress would have been screaming for an investigation. People would have been held accountable for the long chain of security failures that allowed the plot to succeed. Instead, no one was even reprimanded, and the White House resisted all efforts for an investigation for a year. Finally, to shut up the 9/11 families, a 9/11 Commission was convened. The commission duly wrote down the government’s story and that was the “investigation.”

Moreover, there is no evidence to support the official conspiracy theory of 9/11. Indeed, all known evidence contradicts the official conspiracy theory.

For example, it is a proven fact that Building 7 came down at freefall acceleration, which means it was wired for demolition. Why was it wired for demolition? There is no official answer to this question.

It is the known evidence provided by scientists, architects, engineers, pilots, and the first responders who were in the twin towers and personally experienced the numerous explosions that brought down the towers that is described as a conspiracy theory.

And more:
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/08/25/conspiracy-theory/


My personal maxim to live by:

To know is best no matter how hard to bear.

 

[Kyriakos]

The airplane mock-up and plot.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

BBC reporting the destruction of WTC 7 twenty min. before it has happened is a classic:

 

[Bamspeedy]

it is a proven fact that Building 7 came down at freefall acceleration

Gravity works differently?

BBC reporting the destruction of WTC 7 twenty min. before it has happened is a classic:

People were suspecting for at least 3.5 hours the building was going to collapse, is it any surprise a news reporter 'jumped the gun' by 20 minutes?

At approximately 2:00 pm, firefighters noticed a bulge in the southwest corner of 7 World Trade Center between the 10th and 13th floors, a sign that the building was unstable and might collapse.[37] During the afternoon, firefighters also heard creaking sounds coming from the building.[38] Around 3:30 pm, FDNY Chief Daniel A. Nigro decided to halt rescue operations, surface removal, and searches along the surface of the debris near 7 World Trade Center and evacuate the area due to concerns for the safety of personnel.[39] The fire expanded the girders of the building, causing some to lose their structural integrity. This led column number 79, a critical column supporting a large part of the 13th floor, to buckle, causing the floors above it to collapse to the fifth floor; however, this could not be seen from outside the building. The structure also developed cracks in the facade just before the entire building started to fall.[6]:21[40] According to FEMA, this collapse started at 5:20:33 pm EDT when the east mechanical penthouse started crumbling.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

Gravity works differently?

The falling building behaves differently when wired up for demolition then otherwise. WTC 7 collapsed the way it would when explosives were used: at free fall speed.

People were suspecting for at least 3.5 hours the building was going to collapse, is it any surprise a news reporter 'jumped the gun' by 20 minutes?

You know the difference between lying and reporting? You have been lied to but thats no reason for stop trusting BBCs reporting, is it?

 

[Bamspeedy]

You have videos of a skyscraper falling under 'natural' circumstances so we can compare them to controlled demolitions?
The speed at which it falls, I don't understand how it could be any different. Explosives don't make something fall faster. Skyscrapers are built so if the structure fails, it will fall on itself, and not fall over like a tree.....

Out of 1000 engineers, 999 say it was not a controlled demolition, but that 1 engineer who say it was, just HAS to be right?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

More conspiracy nonsense?

Yes, there was erroneous information on the news that day (I was glued to the TV after the first tower fell and a friend phoned me to tell me to turn on the TV NOW and explain to her what was going on).

Nobody knew what was going on at first, other than a plane had run into the first tower, and everyone was hoping it was a tragic accident and not a terrorist act.

Of course that hope was quashed when the second plane hit (I saw that happen live on TV).

Did Bush, Cheney, et. al take advantage of this situation? Yep.

Did they perpetrate the destruction of the towers themselves? I don't think they did, unless they arranged for those 19 hijackers to get on the planes and do it.

It's like the Moon landing conspiracy. Do you realize the sheer number of people who would have to have been in on this, to make it work? It's been nearly 16 years. In all this time, someone would have talked. They'd have come forward and said, "I knew about this. I was part of it. I'm confessing to clear my conscience and give evidence against the ringleaders and their immediate circle, and btw, please don't give me the death penalty."

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

You have videos of a skyscraper falling under 'natural' circumstances so we can compare them to controlled demolitions?

WTC was a controled demolition since normaly the buildings may completely burn down without the steel structure falling down by design:

The speed at which it falls, I don't understand how it could be any different. Explosives don't make something fall faster.

Of course they do. Here is dismantling of a high rise building without explosives:

Skyscrapers are built so if the structure fails, it will fall on itself, and not fall over like a tree.....

Thats a queer idea. Either are skyscrapers build to withstand extreme conditions or they are build the way you describe since you cant likely have both...

Out of 1000 engineers, 999 say it was not a controlled demolition, but that 1 engineer who say it was, just HAS to be right?

I dont know were you came to this idea. The WTC towers was build to witstand multiple hits by plane so its complete colapse after few hours of limited fire is surprising to most engineers. Here is the author of design giving interview after the first bombing of the WTC in 1993:
"Our analysis in-
dicated the biggest problem would be the fact that all the
fuel (from the airplane) would dump into the building.
There would be a horrendous fire. A lot of people would
be killed," he said. "The building structure would still be
there." Skilling went on to say he didn’t think a single
200-pound [90-kg] car bomb would topple or do major
structural damage to either of the Twin Towers. "How-
ever," he added, "I'm not saying that properly applied
explosives—shaped explosives—of that magnitude could
not do a tremendous amount of damage…. I would im-
agine that if you took the top expert in that type of work
and gave him the assignment of bringing these buildings
down with explosives, I would bet that he could do it."

 

[red_elk]

About Moon landing, for me the decisive argument was that the Soviets confirmed it indeed happened. And that faking it would be not much easier than actual landing.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

More conspiracy nonsense?

Since when conspiracy is a nonsense? It makes pretty good sense when you have a centralized form of government where you can by influencing/controlling relatively few key positions in the governmental structure create an effect which would otherwise takes extreme resources and great lenght of time to produce.
Besides itsnt like there is no precedent:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/02/vietnam-presidents-lie-to-wage-war-iraq

 

[warpus]

The person responsible for 9/11? Moses.

If you can part the seas, you can melt steel beams.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

The person responsible for 9/11? Moses.

If you can part the seas, you can melt steel beams.

Either that or you could just use this:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nano-thermite

 

[Silurian]

Since when conspiracy is a nonsense? It makes pretty good sense when you have a centralized form of government where you can by influencing/controlling relatively few key positions in the governmental structure create an effect which would otherwise takes extreme resources and great lenght of time to produce.
Besides itsnt like there is no precedent:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/02/vietnam-presidents-lie-to-wage-war-iraq

So as evidence you give Operation Northwoods that did not happen.

You also give the Gulf of Tonkin incident details of which began to leak seven years latter.
As Valka stated someone you have come forward about 911.

From your Guardian link

""At the time a devout cold warrior, Ellsberg told me his initial reaction was “We must strike back”. Yet within a few days, when Johnson repeated his accusation that “the attacks were deliberate. The attacks were unprovoked”, and assured the world that “we seek no wider war”, Ellsberg knew “all of those statements were false” – the beginnings of a disillusion that would eventually lead him to leak the top secret Pentagon Papers seven years later."""

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/02/vietnam-presidents-lie-to-wage-war-iraq

 

[Senethro]

Its a conspiracy theory, and not even a good conspiracy theory. For 9/11 to be an inside job would require a conspiracy of thousands.

So it would be great if 9/11 truthers could shut the hell up about jet fuel and steel beams and find evidence of widespread collusion instead, or how such a plot could be performed on a skeleton crew.

 

[warpus]

The Manhattan Project was a conspiracy the government managed to keep secret even though 100,000+ were employed to work on it.

Mind you I dont' think there was any inside conspiracy that lead to 9/11

 

[Senethro]

The Manhattan Project managed only a few years of reasonable secrecy before it was in the newspapers among other leaks and was aimed at an external enemy. Its evidence against imo.

 

[Silurian]

The Manhattan Project was a conspiracy the government managed to keep secret even though 100,000+ were employed to work on it.

Mind you I dont' think there was any inside conspiracy that lead to 9/11

It was not kept secret.

From Wiki

""Emil Julius Klaus Fuchs (29 December 1911 – 28 January 1988) was a German theoretical physicist and atomic spy who, in 1950, was convicted of supplying information from the American, British, and Canadian Manhattan Project to the Soviet Union during and shortly after the Second World War. While at the Los Alamos National Laboratory, Fuchs was responsible for many significant theoretical calculations relating to the first nuclear weapons, and later, early models of the hydrogen bomb.
""

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Fuchs

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

Its a conspiracy theory, and not even a good conspiracy theory. For 9/11 to be an inside job would require a conspiracy of thousands.

That doesnt seem to be totally improbable though. The only thing is that if its to work different people in different degree of involvement has to get their version of the story/truth.
I think what is required in the first place is a network of people in the key position and that would needs perhaps a couple decades of slow and steady build up. And that eventually together with corruption, blackmail, couple persistent people against it killed can get you a fairly workable system which can from the pov of regular ignorant population pull off unthinkable "miracles".
Of course the corruption we are talking about would need to be huge, intricate and in several layers and necessarily going on for decades.

So it would be great if 9/11 truthers could shut the hell up about jet fuel and steel beams and find evidence of widespread collusion instead, or how such a plot could be performed on a skeleton crew.

I wish I could shut up m8 as it makes me sick to even thing about the implications but I cant. Molten steel pouring out of the buildings and at their base is a fact.
The number of people involved can be big while keeping the masterminds with their inner circle fairly small.

 

[warpus]

It was not kept secret.

From Wiki

""Emil Julius Klaus Fuchs (29 December 1911 – 28 January 1988) was a German theoretical physicist and atomic spy who, in 1950, was convicted of supplying information from the American, British, and Canadian Manhattan Project to the Soviet Union during and shortly after the Second World War. While at the Los Alamos National Laboratory, Fuchs was responsible for many significant theoretical calculations relating to the first nuclear weapons, and later, early models of the hydrogen bomb.
""

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Fuchs

Not 100% secret, no. But it did employ 100,000+ people and the general public did not know a thing until after the bomb went off over Hiroshima.

 

[red_elk]

It was not kept secret.

There is a big difference between keeping it secret from Soviet intelligence and from general public.