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Screenshot analysis!

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Camikaze, May 11, 2016.

  1. Atlas627

    Atlas627 Deity

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    I agree, which is why I like keeping them as friends until you declare war on all of them and try to snipe their capitals. :D
     
  2. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    Deft hand at diplomacy and executing the well timed attack = backstabbing your friend (well timed attack to their back, using diplomacy to get their guard down)

    They should have a solution for the "raze capitals" issue
    (Say if you raze a civs original capital they get a new one...either among their existing cities, or if they have been eliminated among cities they founded but controlled by someone else)
     
  3. rastak

    rastak Emperor

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    Yea, there is that!

    I guess having an option to keep an ally all game long would be good too. We're not playing Avalon Hill's Diplomacy.
     
  4. Magil

    Magil Monarch

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    If the Settler reduces city pop then I hope the cost scaling isn't too harsh (i.e. has been toned down since we last saw). That's kind of a return back to III and earlier; in IV they decided that it should just stop city growth instead, which carried over to V (though in a worse way, the food to hammer ratio in IV was 1 to 1)--wonder why they decided to go back to that way of doing it?
     
  5. m15a

    m15a Emperor

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    Not sure if it is the reason, but stopping growth instead of losing population makes purchasing settlers or policies with bonus settler production more valuable (and makes increased settler production costs more of a negative). -1 population makes the cost to growth equal in that respect... Although it also means that building a settler in a large city costs more food than in a small one.
     
  6. Enrchd Iranium

    Enrchd Iranium Chieftain

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    What it really means is that my tactic of purchasing settlers to avoid the population penalty of no growth goes out the window. Now, it doesn't matter whether you build or buy settlers, your city will lose population.
     
  7. Cyon

    Cyon Cosmonaut

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    Du you lose 1 pop even if you purchase the settler with gold?
     
  8. AriochIV

    AriochIV Colonial Ninja

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    True global domination has never happened in Earth history, so if that's what domination victory is supposed to represent, then I guess you can make up whatever conditions you like, because it's pure fiction (much like the other victory conditions). At least the MOO2 style "beat people up until the survivors and your remaining frields elect you leader" has some kind of plausibility to it.

    My point is that it's very unsatisfying to play a Machiavellian game of thrones and earn devious allies and vassals, only to have to suddenly turn on them to finish the game "just because." And to those saying, "well, conquer half the world and win some other way," you're making my case for me. If the Domination mechanics are so lame that you have to win some other way... then the Domination mechanics are lame.
     
  9. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    Well, there is a population cost to building settlers in both games, but whether you will, net-net, lose population when building settlers in Civ VI will depend on your food generation rate in the city where you build your settlers (if time to next citizen roughly equals the time to build each settler, population will remain essentially static, just as in Civ V). Assuming you still lose one pop when buying settlers, Civ VI will be more costly than Civ V (in terms of population cost) if you habitually bought your Civ V settlers, rather than building them.

    I'm hoping that one potential benefit of this change will be to eliminate the "exploit" where you could avoid losing population in a city that was under siege by shifting that city's production to a settler (which could be beneficial even if you had no plans to complete production of the settler once the siege was lifted).
     
  10. Gintoki89

    Gintoki89 Warlord

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    Possibly, we know relics are a thing but I don't think we have any concrete details on how they're generated, aside from special instances like Joan of Arc. There's still a lot we don't know about apostles, like we know they get their own special abilities some how, as referenced by Mont St Michel, but we don't know what those are or the specifics on how you get/choose them. Hopefully we'll get some more livestreams soon to clear up these details.
     
  11. ftl

    ftl Warlord

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    You don't have to win some other way! You can CHOOSE to win a different way if for some reason you don't feel like winning by domination! Or you can win by domination if you want! (The example at hand was not wanting to win by domination because that involves backstabbing an ally.)

    The Machiavellian game of thrones is a tool to get to one of the other victory conditions. It's not a victory condition on its own. You can stab the people that are doing well to slow them down in their progress towards different victories, but at some point you should pick a victory condition and go for it. It sounds like you want some version of diplomatic victory, where you can win by having alliances.

    I think the current domination victory is a pretty good setup to represent military conquest. It captures the essence of the victory, without making you go through tedious mop-up. You need to win at least one decisive war against every opponent (to grab their capital), and hold on to your gains. (I suppose the very last one you don't need to hold onto.)

    It also matches the other victories pretty well, I think. To win the culture victory, you have to have more tourism to ALL the civs than their domestic tourism, you don't get to say "hey this guy over here is my ally so I don't have to have more tourism than them." To win religious victory, you have to convert 50% of each other civilization - you can't skip converting one because you were really good at converting another. The odd one out is a science victory, because that one is just a race and you can do it on your own without interacting with others.
     
  12. Magil

    Magil Monarch

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    I was always weirded out by that Civ V mechanic that made it so you couldn't starve when building Settlers. It wasn't like that in IV, you can absolutely starve while producing Settlers in IV. It was also annoying since you needed to micro to work max hammers making working Settlers since the food to hammer conversion was messed up (why did they change that too? So strange).

    I just hope they're not starting to stack penalties on Settler production. That would make me very sad. The production cost scaling already looked pretty rough from what we saw, if that wasn't reduced to compensate then this could be problematic.

    If buying Settlers is a problem the easiest solution would just to be to pull a Vox Populi and make it so you can't cash-rush Settlers...
     
  13. Atlas627

    Atlas627 Deity

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    No, we're not. If you want to win by domination, then prove your domination. If you want to win by being the most technologically advanced, but you get there by being huge, conquering your opponents, and manipulating your allies? Thats Science.

    The mechanics are not lame. You don't like them, that's your problem. Complaining about the flavor makes no sense, which is the argument we are currently having.
     
  14. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

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    Bottom right.
    I think "Water Availability" haven't been discussed much anywhere yet.
    Well, it affects housing.

    Spoiler :
     
  15. fmm

    fmm Warlord

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    It has been discussed. Basically, "freshwater" (river or lake, I presume) adjacency gives +3 housing whereas "seawater" adjacency (coastal hexes) gives +1 housing. That's all there is to the "water availability." Note that the red squares don't have to do with water- they denote hexes you cannot settle because e.g. they are too close to other cities, or they're impassable terrain, etc.
     
  16. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

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    My bad then.. but as you see in the screenshot, there's coastal tiles that's not light green.
     
  17. Magil

    Magil Monarch

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    The only coastal tiles I see that aren't light green are red because they are (a) within 3 hexes of a city or (b) a mountain or other obstacle.
     
  18. Silverdawn

    Silverdawn Prince

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    Thanks for taking that picture as can now compare it to the build that the casters have been playing. As I mentioned in the notes from when the livestream ran, the changes that stood out to me were 1) the addition of the legend you are pointing out in the settler card to explain the colors and 2) the city placement suggestion icons. The gray icons for those suggestions are more subtle than the yellow ones in Civ 5 and seem more numerous in this example--I count 12.

    Comparing it to the current Yogscast game, the colors still seem to be the same. A second change to the settler card is that they removed the line with melee strength = 0. A third change is that the portrait in the circle is zoomed in instead of trying to show the whole model.

    Spoiler :
    settler_lens.JPG


    You can get dark green tiles on the coast at the mouth of a river. In the screenshot I've attached that would be the case NW of Zanzibar if the coast was outside its 3-tile radius.
     
  19. MadDjinn

    MadDjinn Deity

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    I really hope the AI doesn't end up using those suggestions. Or that they at least fix them.

    The 'prime' locations are 'river here, don't mind the fact that you'll be 4-5 hexes away from both your capital and another civs city... jammed right in there!'

    meanwhile that nice lake to the west isn't considered despite all of the resources around it.
     
  20. Silverdawn

    Silverdawn Prince

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    I also hope the UI also no longer puts every city 4 tiles from the other. Such a pain to attack. :)
     

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