TheOverseer714
Overseer
A Spear army is my choice as well, it will allow the swamp to be drained and then can be used as a pillager and defense for the horde army. With adherence to AW guidelines, there will be more armies to come.
SGFN-08: Random AWM Succession Game
- Thread starter TheOverseer714
- Start date
splunge the 2nd
King
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2007
- Messages
- 741
Full spear army it is.
I'll keep the horse army with just 1 for now for possible galley shipment.
Game question-I know units in armies can promote. Can they produce MGL's?
I'll keep the horse army with just 1 for now for possible galley shipment.
Game question-I know units in armies can promote. Can they produce MGL's?
IvanDolvich2
Order of Lenin
Nope: no MGLs from Armies, just a couple more HP from promotion.
splunge the 2nd
King
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2007
- Messages
- 741
Whew, finished my turnset.
Here's the breakdown:
Post play/self criticism:
I need to watch my happiness, not figuring CA2 is handicapping. Also I let Leipzig's tile asignment get away from me whiloe focussing on the milatary game.
Thoughts:
I'm researching at 90% towards invention looking towards eventual calvary(?) as we lack iron. Our cash situation is OK, but we're losing GPT on 90/10 research/entertainment with unit support. We could use some new cities. Settler is near the ruins of The Hague. I suspect Utrecht has saltpeter or oil otherwise why'd the AI plant a city there. We're poised to take it with 4 cats and 3 horses near. May want another horse. Ideally catch it when size 2 to avoid auto raze. There's iron and luxes in the swamps across the isthmus. I can't beleive we could get a secure settlement there though with the Greeks and Persians harrassing us.
Longterm plan-amphibious attack on Vikings or Greece. I built up a bit of a navy and some ground forces. may want to balance them out. Horse army only has 1 unit for galley transport.
Here's the breakdown:
Spoiler :
Post play/self criticism:
I need to watch my happiness, not figuring CA2 is handicapping. Also I let Leipzig's tile asignment get away from me whiloe focussing on the milatary game.
Thoughts:
I'm researching at 90% towards invention looking towards eventual calvary(?) as we lack iron. Our cash situation is OK, but we're losing GPT on 90/10 research/entertainment with unit support. We could use some new cities. Settler is near the ruins of The Hague. I suspect Utrecht has saltpeter or oil otherwise why'd the AI plant a city there. We're poised to take it with 4 cats and 3 horses near. May want another horse. Ideally catch it when size 2 to avoid auto raze. There's iron and luxes in the swamps across the isthmus. I can't beleive we could get a secure settlement there though with the Greeks and Persians harrassing us.
Longterm plan-amphibious attack on Vikings or Greece. I built up a bit of a navy and some ground forces. may want to balance them out. Horse army only has 1 unit for galley transport.
Whata turnset! 
Finally things start going our way... We had good luck with the second leader and also with the fact that apparently the Greeks bought/traded Persia's free Engineering in the interturn, before we got our free tech. Being able to start Invention right away was more than I dared to dream of...
However, I think you cash-rushed a few things too many: only 231g left of the 480g I had saved.
We can not maintain the deficit research at -45gpt for long now, especially as there are still 7 catapults to be upgraded.
We will need to slow down research soon now. In fact, I think it is best to do it right away, wait until Berlin finished its library and then go back to 90%. That way we will loose the money at such a point in time, when it gives us the best return on beakers. Or to explain it this way: why blow all the remaining money now, and then in a few turns, when Berlin has a library, we need to lower research to 40%, because our cash is gone? It's better to reduce science now, collect some more money, and when Berlin has the lib go back to deficit research. That way we'll finish Invention faster.
Next steps:
BTW, who's next? Overseer, could you edit turn #1 and add our current team roster? That way we don't need to search through the last couple dozen pages to find it.
Cheers, Lanzelot
Finally things start going our way... We had good luck with the second leader and also with the fact that apparently the Greeks bought/traded Persia's free Engineering in the interturn, before we got our free tech. Being able to start Invention right away was more than I dared to dream of...
However, I think you cash-rushed a few things too many: only 231g left of the 480g I had saved.
We can not maintain the deficit research at -45gpt for long now, especially as there are still 7 catapults to be upgraded.We will need to slow down research soon now. In fact, I think it is best to do it right away, wait until Berlin finished its library and then go back to 90%. That way we will loose the money at such a point in time, when it gives us the best return on beakers. Or to explain it this way: why blow all the remaining money now, and then in a few turns, when Berlin has a library, we need to lower research to 40%, because our cash is gone? It's better to reduce science now, collect some more money, and when Berlin has the lib go back to deficit research. That way we'll finish Invention faster.
A town needs at least 10 culture (or size 2), otherwise it gets auto-razed. So this means in 10 turns from now we can take Utrecht. You may be right that there's a saltpeter resource. The AI can see the entire map. And why else would they settle up there in the desert? However, it could be oil as well...
Next steps:
- Setup choke point. I guess we use the spearmen Army to dry the marshes 1SW of the mountain. (That spot can later be reused for our canal city without the need to drain a further swamp.) An empty Eindhoven will play the role of "magnet", and the swamp tiles SE of the mountain will serve as a slow-down for the advancing Greek horsemen (giving more opportunities to hit them with trebs...)
- Prepare D-Day. I expect we will meet only 1-2 Hoplites per town and a few archers/horsemen which currently got produced. All the other Greek archers/horsemen will be on their way south towards the choke point, leaving the core quite undefended...
I think the remaining 2 Dutch towns can be neglected for now. "Collect" them at a moment when they won't auto-raze, but otherwise concentrate on the choke point and the D-Day now.
BTW, who's next? Overseer, could you edit turn #1 and add our current team roster? That way we don't need to search through the last couple dozen pages to find it.
Cheers, Lanzelot
Sparthage
Fighting Tyranny
It's my turn I believe. I'll probably play on Monday so that we have time to discuss what we're going to do with the game.
Sparthage
Fighting Tyranny
An Idea (Just to see what you guys think of it): Build the Art of War, or use it as a pre-build for Leo's Workshop (the Horsemen=> Cavalry upgrades will be expensive)
Lurker's comment:
AW games tend to not see upgrades, at least till late in the game. Even then it will normally only be a few units. Gold is best spend on rushing a few things and deficit research.
Totally a waste would be upgrading bombardment units, except for a couple of cannons in key locations.
Maybe a few horses, especially to fill a big hole or an army. Knights are about the only time it is cost effective, but you tend to not have a lot of them anyway as they go into armies right off.
Exchanging Sun Tzu for Leo is crazy. Saving some gold on upgrades, verse instant barracks on the front?
AW games tend to not see upgrades, at least till late in the game. Even then it will normally only be a few units. Gold is best spend on rushing a few things and deficit research.
Totally a waste would be upgrading bombardment units, except for a couple of cannons in key locations.
Maybe a few horses, especially to fill a big hole or an army. Knights are about the only time it is cost effective, but you tend to not have a lot of them anyway as they go into armies right off.
Exchanging Sun Tzu for Leo is crazy. Saving some gold on upgrades, verse instant barracks on the front?
splunge the 2nd
King
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2007
- Messages
- 741
Sorry on the cat to treb upgrades. I think it may have helped on the Eindoven defense though.
The rushed horse helped take The Hague (not worth the cost maybe). The rushed walls and spear in Eindoven turned out not to be needed as I avoided attack by bombarding and archer defense. The barracks for healing there was needed.
Turning down research till we have the library is good thinking.
If we're thinking of a wonder, already having GL, Sun Tzu will earn us a Golden Age (as will Leo's, but I'm thinking Wonder vs not).
The rushed horse helped take The Hague (not worth the cost maybe). The rushed walls and spear in Eindoven turned out not to be needed as I avoided attack by bombarding and archer defense. The barracks for healing there was needed.
Turning down research till we have the library is good thinking.
If we're thinking of a wonder, already having GL, Sun Tzu will earn us a Golden Age (as will Leo's, but I'm thinking Wonder vs not).
TheOverseer714
Overseer
Upgrades, meh, usually too expensive to justify. Even with Leo's, cat to treb is 30 gold and treb to cannon is more. Let our corrupt towns build them a shield at a time. Besides, Leo's will eventually be ours anyway...
Are you sure about that? In those games where I actually use artillery type units (Demigod and above), I make sure to upgrade them asap. A cat has many misses,a treb almost always hits, until the opponent has musketmen. And 30g is not that much?!
Perhaps you are right in an AW game, where one has to research every single tech himself. But here we have the luxury of the GLib, so we should be able to spare a few coins?!
And after all: upgrading is much cheaper than rushing! An upgrade is 3 gold per shield, a rush 4 gold per shield. So I think rushing things makes even less sense. (Unless in critical situations.)
The corrupt towns (once we have any...) can build settlers, 1 shield per turn. These will slowly ICS the conquered land, reduce unit cost and serve as science farms.
What things do we have to decide on? Not many I would say. My stomach tells me, a wonder is still too early, especially one that would trigger our GA. If we want to build any expensive building, I would say Heroic Epic should be next. (Make sure our first employment of the horse Army is something like 12/12 Army versus redlined archer...
)The rest should be clear: setup choke point, prepare D-Day in Greece, take Utrecht when it culture-expands.
No, I'm utterly certain about it. It's not particularly close. The gold is much better spent rushing/short rushing buildings and units, or making more useful unit upgrades (i.e. horses-knights, or in our case, even archers-longbows, as awful as that sounds). A catapult will still hit a decent amount of the time, especially against enemy attacking units.
Or, of course, researching. Trust me when I say, at some point, we will be short of gold, and we will desperately wish that we could keep researching at a higher pace.
Or, of course, researching. Trust me when I say, at some point, we will be short of gold, and we will desperately wish that we could keep researching at a higher pace.
Lurker's comment:
If you have played or read many AW SG games, you do not see ICS much or upgrading much. They have experiences that tell them that it is not the best move.
ICS, will eat all your pop as you will need so many settlers. You also want to keep moving your borders out to give you control of the roads and staying close to the next target and get replacements in a timely fashion.
The purpose of the GLB is to let you do zero research as you will have need of the money for research and some rushing, mostly settlers. Yes a small amount of upgrading. Cats to Trebs is not real expensive, but buys you almost nothing.
Gold get precious as you are in Monarchy, not Republic. You cannot get gold from, them other than capturing or razing towns. They will not have all that much as they are at war all the time as well.
Those obsolete units can sit and do MP duty and very cheaply at that. Prior to rails, you do not really have the ability to send those cat/trebs to where you need them, hence you have to have more of them to be in all the places they are need.
Could you please send me those trebs that almost always hit, mine need to attend that class.
Well, the truth is: I've done both exactly zero times so far... So I need to rely on the judgment of those among us, who have already a lot of experience in this area. The point about gold urgently needed for research later on makes a lot of sense to me. I know from my "normal" games, just how much I rely on trading and Republic in order to make progress in science, so I can understand how hard it will be with no trading at all and under Monarchy.
So in this case the GLib recapture trick should be even more important than usual?!
May not be "almost always", but nevertheless the difference is significant. Cat vs spear: 66% hit chance, treb vs spear: 75% hit chance. And treb vs archer/horse goes up to 86%.
lurker's comment: Yes, but by the time you have trebs, you're in the middle age. I think you should really be using pikemen for the comparison.
Sparthage
Fighting Tyranny
Which of course we don't have.
Similar threads
