Should I assume she doesn't like me and just move on?

[Tigranes]

This is borderline creepy, verging on stalking, and definitely narcissistic.

Times have moved on, and men should face up to the fact that women are losing all interest in them altogether.

Let me get this straight: if a woman says no to you twice, you take that as a double negative and assume she really means yes?

Arithmetic does not work with women. After first no you try art, not science. Start with shoes and end up with humor, poems, and guitar songs:

"For some reason, the first thing I notice in a man is his shoes. But it’s not to see how expensive or new they are. I think shoes or sneakers say a lot about a guy. I love when a guy’s wearing Jordans. I’m not exactly the biggest fan of those pointy Aldo shoes. I never really understood those.

"I am not one to care about body type. But I definitely would like a guy to be taller than me, because I hate when I wear heels and I get complaints like 'ugh, you’re too tall.' I want someone who isn’t going to break if he picks me up. But you really just have to be able to make me laugh and feel comfortable around you to earn major points."

(c) Miss USA Rima Fakih

Spoiler :

I did not invent her last name.

 

[Tigranes]

Epsilon girls get epsilon girls.

Without this thread I would never come across this one.

 

[warpus]

After first no you try art, not science. Start with shoes and end up with humor, poems, and guitar songs:

That only works in cheesy romantic movies in which a girl warms up to a suitor slowly over time as he tries more and more elaborate escapades in order to win her over, eventually resulting in a grand climax involving a mariachi band and/or the beating of a competing alpha male at an activity that the geeky suitor should stereotypically not be that great at.

In real life this suitor is going to be usually eventually seen as an annoying creep by the girl, forever in his mind self-identified as "a hopeless romantic", but in the eyes of the girl as a clingy weirdo who won't leave her alone.

No means no, take the hint and move on.

 

[Tigranes]

Why bother trying to "win someone over" when you can find someone who actually likes you from the get go?
No means no. Better to find a yes.

No means try harder, prove me that you like me (unless someone else is enjoying her yes). See, as the more active sex men are expected to show some creativity when met with the initial rejection. How can someone reject you if all she knows about you are your looks and few lines you have uttered so far? You need to go after YOUR dreams not her, because, if you really like her and think she is the one -- you have an advantage over her. Your mind is settled , her mind is not. Your yes is the decision, her no is the indecision. She means "Oh, wow, really? But, I am not there yet...", and not "I will never get there".

If you settle for her yes and your why not -- you will get swayed by your hell yes down the road. Don't make lots of people miserable. If you want maximum aim for impossible. If you aim for minimum you will end up with sub-optimal.

 

[warpus]

if you really like her and think she is the one

Thinking like this about every single girl you pursue, even after she's said no numerous times, is what is very quickly going to lead to you being the creep that she's trying to get away from. Life isn't a romance movie!

 

[Tigranes]

That only works in cheesy romantic movies

No means no, take the hint and move on.

No is the default factory set answer. That's why psychology exists. You use it to try different options and see if you can get yes, I am not suggesting doing the same thing over and over. Go to the menu and try different options. If it is meant to be -- something will work. And why are you so concerned why would she think about you if you will not end up living with her? But you always would need to live with yourself. It is better to regret something you have done in a good faith, rather than regret something you should have done but never grew balls.

 

[Tigranes]

Thinking like this about every single girl you pursue, even after she's said no numerous times, is what is very quickly going to lead to you being the creep that she's trying to get away from. Life isn't a romance movie!

How can "the one" be every single girl? 2-3 max over the life time. Life beats any romantic movie by large margin. Things can get very silly in the most real life.

 

[warpus]

Yeah, ask her out, and if she says no, that means it ain't going to happen. If she gives you an iffy answer, you can try again. Continually getting "no" for an answer and trying to fight to change that "no" into a "yes" only works in movies, and usually only in movies in which the protagonist is good looking. In real life it's usually going to lead to problems.

re: "the one"

See Mark Corrigan from Peep Show. He'd obsess over every girl he had the slightest attraction to as being "the one".. even before they even talked. That's the issue. Ignore this "the one" nonsense.

 

[Tigranes]

But yeah, I think here in North America trying to "date" your friends is going to be a challenging proposition for most..

Friendship between male and female is possible only if everything else is ALREADY impossible.

 

[Commodore]

No means try harder,

I'm pretty sure this is the motto of stalkers, creeps, weirdoes, and potential rapists everywhere.

 

[mrt144]

Remember: The beta male never gets the girl.

This is so sad.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

It is pointless to say "just move on."

It's not pointless, it is totally valid advice that he probably needs to hear. A lot of people in this situation need to hear it and more importantly, take it to heart. Mind you, I know it's not easy but at least acknowledging that it needs to happen can be a helpful first step.

He can't move on, and doesn't want to.

He can do the former, no one can help the latter. But that's his problem and not hers or anyone else's.


As for more in-depth advice, I would just re-read everything Owen has said here. Top notch stuff, that.

 

[Sommerswerd]

It's not pointless, it is totally valid advice that he probably needs to hear. A lot of people in this situation need to hear it and more importantly, take it to heart. Mind you, I know it's not easy but at least acknowledging that it needs to happen can be a helpful first step.



He can do the former, no one can help the latter. But that's his problem and not hers or anyone else's.


As for more in-depth advice, I would just re-read everything Owen has said here. Top notch stuff, that.

You're right. It is valid. When I said it was pointless I wasn't saying it was wrong. I was saying that he doesn't want to hear that and isn't going to listen to it, so its "pointless" to say it to him. My thinking was that he probably is either going to just keep lusting silently for this girl until the feeling goes away on its own... Or... Ask her out. And TBH he could do the former and it will probably be fine. People do it all the time.

 

[longtimelurker0]

You're right. It is valid. When I said it was pointless I wasn't saying it was wrong. I was saying that he doesn't want to hear that and isn't going to listen to it, so its "pointless" to say it to him. My thinking was that he probably is either going to just keep lusting silently for this girl until the feeling goes away on its own... Or... Ask her out. And TBH he could do the former and it will probably be fine. People do it all the time.

If I didn't want to move on, why would I be even asking here if I should do that? I'm perfectly willing and ready to move on if there's really very little chance that she likes me based off the evidence I provided. I posted here to simply confirm that it is indeed the case that she most likely isn't interested, in which case I can stop fooling myself thinking that i have a chance with her and get on with my life.

 

[Farm Boy]

I'm pretty sure this is the motto of stalkers, creeps, weirdoes, and potential rapists everywhere.

Depends. But lots of men way overthink crap and I'm not willing to write them off as stalkers, creeps, weirdoes, or potential rapists anymore than a different great ape with testicles that's more suave. When "no" is the answer to whether or not she wants to go on a date but continues to talk to you of her own accord every now and then it can be something else. She knows you're going to ask her out every couple/six months since you've made it clear what type of relationship you're interested in. She's still interested enough to keep talking to you despite that, or even possibly because of that. Maybe she's kinda interested but more interested in somebody else or just doing other things. The trick here is not to be "waiting" for anyone. You're not waiting, she's said no, there's nothing to wait for. Go out and do your thing, express interest in other interesting people. Maybe be more creative six months later if she's still interesting enough to want to spend time with, then repeat if it's still no. If she stops seeming to want to talk with you then this is no longer a person for you to be interacting with or probably even bothering to think much about at all.

 

[Tigranes]

I'm pretty sure this is the motto of stalkers, creeps, weirdoes, and potential rapists everywhere.

Well, you must be sure of a wrong thing then. Rapists never ask and don't wait for rejection, they assume rejection from the start, they just take and say -- you like it, don't you. Every good endeavor always starts with no. Nothing that is worth holding in your hand will ever fall in those hands. You just have to work it out.

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

The English language (or whatever language they happen to speak) does not work with men, they don't really understand it, and you have to try to communicate with them in ways they understand, like farting and pooping; something their brain, as the less intelligent sex, can understand.

 

[Borachio]

If I didn't want to move on, why would I be even asking here if I should do that? I'm perfectly willing and ready to move on if there's really very little chance that she likes me based off the evidence I provided. I posted here to simply confirm that it is indeed the case that she most likely isn't interested, in which case I can stop fooling myself thinking that i have a chance with her and get on with my life.

That's fine.

But you should still ask her, rather than just "assuming", then you'll know for sure. And also get some experience in being rejected. And the next time will be even worse....

No, hang on. Take no notice of me.

 

[Tigranes]

See Mark Corrigan from Peep Show. He'd obsess over every girl he had the slightest attraction to as being "the one".. even before they even talked. That's the issue. Ignore this "the one" nonsense.

So you ask us to ignore romantic movies but you use peep shows to illustrate why we should ignore "the one" concept? Does not work that way, does it?

I know very well a couple who were 39 years together. The male part of the union never had girlfriend before he met her, "the one". Four years of relentless courtship -- and they get married. And did I mention something about 39 years more or less happily ever after?

 

[Farm Boy]

<shrugs> Took me 6 years. But I don't think I'd call the courtship relentless. There were long breaks, I just checked in from time to time to see if she'd gotten more interested yet.