Sieg Heil

[Valka D'Ur]

These days, it seems odd to me when the national anthem is sung prior to a sporting event, and it almost always is in professional sports. It would fit in at national-teams-level soccer match or an Olympic medal ceremony or when a military academy team was participating, but at an ordinary hockey game? We don't do it before a theater performance or a concert or a group dinner, so I'm not sure why we do it at sporting events. I also wonder whether it is done in Canada, or if the Canadian teams only have O Canada played when they are playing abroad?

Not sure about other sports, but at hockey games here, both countries' national anthems are performed. Some Americans have occasionally butchered the Canadian anthem or have displayed our flag upside down... which causes a fair bit of ill-feeling here.

 

[Quintillus]

My first thought is amazement that someone could get the Canadian flag upside-down... I could see swapping a flag with bars of three colors, but the maple leaf would look silly upside-down, and unlike Romania or Belgium, Canada's nearby enough that I'd have thought peripheral exposure to it would be sufficient.

But then I remember the general lack of geographic knowledge in North America. While occasionally amusing (when in Ontario recently, I heard a couple locals discussing where the Carolinas were, in the context of the recent hurricane, and one asserted they were between Texas and Louisiana), on the whole the ignorance is more unfortunate and common than anything (I'd be surprised if more than 5% of U.S. residents could correctly place the seven Canadian provinces that border the lower 48 U.S. states, and admit that I tend to forget New Brunswick myself).

 

[HoloDoc]

My first thought is amazement that someone could get the Canadian flag upside-down... I could see swapping a flag with bars of three colors, but the maple leaf would look silly upside-down, and unlike Romania or Belgium, Canada's nearby enough that I'd have thought peripheral exposure to it would be sufficient.

But then I remember the general lack of geographic knowledge in North America. While occasionally amusing (when in Ontario recently, I heard a couple locals discussing where the Carolinas were, in the context of the recent hurricane, and one asserted they were between Texas and Louisiana), on the whole the ignorance is more unfortunate and common than anything (I'd be surprised if more than 5% of U.S. residents could correctly place the seven Canadian provinces that border the lower 48 U.S. states, and admit that I tend to forget New Brunswick myself).

"The kids couldn't find Canada on the map!"

"Well, you can't blame them Marge. It's hard to find, all tucked away down there."

 

[Timsup2nothin]

My first thought is amazement that someone could get the Canadian flag upside-down... I could see swapping a flag with bars of three colors, but the maple leaf would look silly upside-down, and unlike Romania or Belgium, Canada's nearby enough that I'd have thought peripheral exposure to it would be sufficient.

But then I remember the general lack of geographic knowledge in North America. While occasionally amusing (when in Ontario recently, I heard a couple locals discussing where the Carolinas were, in the context of the recent hurricane, and one asserted they were between Texas and Louisiana), on the whole the ignorance is more unfortunate and common than anything (I'd be surprised if more than 5% of U.S. residents could correctly place the seven Canadian provinces that border the lower 48 U.S. states, and admit that I tend to forget New Brunswick myself).

Percentage wise they don't get the Canadian flag upside down any more often than they get the US flag upside down. It's an error in mechanics of hanging the flag, not a failure to recognize which way it goes. In most arenas the US flag is permanently attached, so it will always be right side up. The Canadian flag gets broken out when a Canadian team comes to town and attached to a rig that raises it for the anthem. A small amount of spatial reasoning is required to figure out how it is going to look when the rig pulls it up, and some people are completely lacking when it comes to spatial reasoning.

As to identifying Canadian provinces...why? If I am going to Canada, I'm going to Canada. While I do understand that you have provinces, which are basically like states, I don't see any reason why I would be gaining anything in identifying them, or any reason a Canadian would be well versed in how the US is laid out internally. Other than Baja California I couldn't tell you anything regarding Mexico's internal organization either, and I actually spend time in Mexico. In Baja California, which is why I know where it is. That lack of knowledge stems from having absolutely no use for such knowledge. I can generally recognize Canadian provinces and Mexican states, but as to where they fall in their countries it makes no difference to me.

Now, not knowing where Canada or Mexico is would be a different thing. Not knowing the basic organization of your own continent is an actual handicap. But how other continents are organized is similarly useless information. I know that Mali, Ethiopia, and the Sudan are in Africa. Do I know enough about the internal organization of Africa to tell you where they are in relation to each other? No, because it would be useless knowledge. I know where Africa is, and in the time it would take me to get to Africa I could develop a fairly thorough knowledge of how it is organized, but since I don't see myself heading for Africa any time soon, if ever, I just don't need that information right now. I also don't expect that you would have any reason to be able to tell me where Tulare county is in relation to Fresno county because unless you are in California our internal structure is not really useful for you to know.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

As to identifying Canadian provinces...why? If I am going to Canada, I'm going to Canada. While I do understand that you have provinces, which are basically like states, I don't see any reason why I would be gaining anything in identifying them, or any reason a Canadian would be well versed in how the US is laid out internally.

This reminds me of a conversation I had with a tourist many years ago in a campground, on a trip with my mother, aunt, uncle, and cousins (we were going from Red Deer to Prince George, British Columbia to visit another aunt). I asked this American tourist how he liked Alberta so far. He got a blank look on his face and said, "Is that where I am?"

It gave the impression that he was an idiot, and if I were to go to the U.S. and display equal ignorance about not bothering to know which state I was in, whoever I was talking to would likely think me an idiot as well.

There are some practical reasons for knowing which province or state you're in, considering that some laws are different from place to place. For instance, British Columbia had seat belt laws before Alberta did, and I remember the first thing my mother did when we crossed the border into Alberta on the way home from Prince George was to pull over and undo her seat belt.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

There are some practical reasons for knowing which province or state you're in, considering that some laws are different from place to place.

No kidding. That would be why I am familiar with the state of Baja California, since it is a state that I actually spend time in. Knowing where the BFE province of Alberta is in relation to some other BFE province in a country I am not in, and not going to be in, is pointless. Were I going to Canada I would familiarize myself with the part I was going to, and still wouldn't have any need to know about the layout of the BFE parts I wasn't going to, or have any reason to care about that.

 

[Lemon Merchant]

Percentage wise they don't get the Canadian flag upside down any more often than they get the US flag upside down. It's an error in mechanics of hanging the flag, not a failure to recognize which way it goes. In most arenas the US flag is permanently attached, so it will always be right side up. The Canadian flag gets broken out when a Canadian team comes to town and attached to a rig that raises it for the anthem. A small amount of spatial reasoning is required to figure out how it is going to look when the rig pulls it up, and some people are completely lacking when it comes to spatial reasoning.

While I have no doubt that what you say is true, the upside down case that I most remember was the time that the Marines got it wrong at the World Series (I think). The Marine in question was wearing the flagpole at his waist in a marching sort of formation. All they had to do was put the flag on the little flagpole right side up and they failed at it. I felt sorry for him. He was probably marching in a circle for several days after that one. Given how incensed some Canadians were, I suspect that the US Consulates and the Embassy got some hate mail. Most of us just laughed though and shook our heads, and muttered "Stupid Americans."

 

[Valka D'Ur]

No kidding. That would be why I am familiar with the state of Baja California, since it is a state that I actually spend time in. Knowing where the BFE province of Alberta is in relation to some other BFE province in a country I am not in, and not going to be in, is pointless. Were I going to Canada I would familiarize myself with the part I was going to, and still wouldn't have any need to know about the layout of the BFE parts I wasn't going to, or have any reason to care about that.

"BFE"?

And yeah, it makes sense to familiarize yourself with the area where you're going but not bother about the rest. After all, during the trips I made to Washington (various places in the state), I studied several maps and got some information about various places it might be interesting to see.

But it didn't occur to me to look up anything about Idaho or Montana. In retrospect I should have, since on my last trip we took a route that passed through both states.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

"BFE"?

And yeah, it makes sense to familiarize yourself with the area where you're going but not bother about the rest. After all, during the trips I made to Washington (various places in the state), I studied several maps and got some information about various places it might be interesting to see.

But it didn't occur to me to look up anything about Idaho or Montana. In retrospect I should have, since on my last trip we took a route that passed through both states.

Yep. Certainly would have made sense.

 

[HoloDoc]

I recall watching a TV show several years ago. It was a travel show featuring Ewan McGregor and a buddy of his. They were riding motorcycles around the world, no doubt in an attempt to find someone who hadn't seen The Phantom Menace and wouldn't mock McGregor for it. They were starting in the UK, riding all through Eurasia, including Russia and the former Soviet Central Asian republics, then hopping across to Alaska and working their way down to Mexico.

The only place in the world their security advisors wouldn't let them camp by the side of the highway was the US. It was considered too dangerous.

So yeah, learning about where you're going might be a good idea.

 

[cardgame]

My brothers did literally that on a road trip halfway across the U.S. and back. Highway-sides up to 10 feet are federal (public) land, which means they didn't have to pay for lodging or anything.

 

[HoloDoc]

My brothers did literally that on a road trip halfway across the U.S. and back. Highway-sides up to 10 feet are federal (public) land, which means they didn't have to pay for lodging or anything.

It seemed a little weird yo me too. I figured it was an insurance thing or a legal issue rather than a "you'll be killed" thing.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

It seemed a little weird yo me too. I figured it was an insurance thing or a legal issue rather than a "you'll be killed" thing.

Legal issue. While it is seldom enforced on a first night basis, roadside camping is illegal pretty much everywhere in the US. Cardgame's brothers did fine, probably by not staying more than one night and being always ready to say "look, we are just passing through, got too tired to keep driving, thought we'd catch some rest here and move on." That will almost always get you a "make sure you clean up, be safe, don't be here tomorrow night." If you are filming a TV show that excuse doesn't hold water.

 

[Grisu]

that whole pledge is still a thing in the US today? I was kinda expecting that kinda thing would have died out after the Bush era.

 

[cardgame]

that whole pledge is still a thing in the US today? I was kinda expecting that kinda thing would have died out after the Bush era.

It really varies by location and I'm not even sure there's a good trendline for that. My conservative schools had abandoned it completely by the time I rolled through in 2005 (they could have stopped even before that).