SKNES II: The Bonaparte Legacy

OOC: The proposed and accepted referenda are of concern only to Bohemia-Moravia, and would hopefully be held by a neutral third-person party. Y'all can leave this to that third-person party and stop trying (and failing) to influence things.
 
OOC: The proposed and accepted referenda are of concern only to Bohemia-Moravia, and would hopefully be held by a neutral third-person party. Y'all can leave this to that third-person party and stop trying (and failing) to influence things.

Pseudo-OOC: My gigantic army says I can influence whatever and whoever I want, and I'll fight anybody who says otherwise. Com @ me cuz, ill drop u.
 
France echoes calls for the Sudeten High Germans to join Austria. Austria has been pushing for their freedom for years. Austria has been at the forefront in the liberation of its people from Slavic tyranny.

Germany is merely an opportunist vulture seeking to steal the fruits of the labour from the High German. Such attempts at splitting the vote and dividing the voices of the Sudeten people is the lowest form of brigandry.

In other news, France and Italy, along with the other members of the Rome-Berlin Axis, would like to formally welcome Croatia to the Rome-Berlin Axis. We hope our cooperation will be fruitful.

Italy confirms with and agrees with what France has stated above.
 
America wonders why it's called the Rome-Berlin Axis :<


In other news, can people stop freaking out about "OH NOES ANOTHER COUNTRY FALL TO TEH FASCISTS". Seriously. Fascism is not a global spanning ideology, it's a nationalistic, militaristic, anti communist ideology specifically tailored to your nation. Two fascist nations could very easily fight one another. Freaking out about a nation falling to Communism is one thing, but there is no "set" rule book about fascism, and the way alot of people are reacting is very....frustrating
 
OOC: SK, please do send me China's first turn orders. I will respond to Japan shortly
 
Don't forget to check China's public diplo. :)
 
To: Poland
From: Germany


The lands you speak of, while they may hold people of Polish origin within, are not populated by them, but by Germans, true and pure, who enjoy the freedoms provided to them by the German government and its Emperor, regardless of their origin. We fail to see what would such a referendum bring, but useless consumption of money.

We can, however, agree with the idea of allowing Polish merchants to use the ports of Elbing and Danzig at reduced costs, as long as this trade is not of weapons and other military things, and to allowing Germans of Polish origin to leave for Poland if that is their wish. About the only thing we disagree with is the idea that they would live freely, for they would not enjoy the freedoms a democracy gives them if they chose to exchange them for a fascist government.

If only you chose to cast away the trappings of fascism to accept democracy! Then we would truly consider you brothers in the struggle against tyranny, whichever side it came from, whether it is from the East or the West, from the right or the left. Then, Poles and Germans, along with British, Confederates, Scandinavians and all the other free nations in the world would breathe better at the idea that we would have more friends than before.

Hopefully, your allies in Austria will be able to see you as a role and stop making demands that are wholly unreasonable.

To: Germany
From: Poland


For now we will put old grudges aside for the sake of the Polish nation. We accept your offers of economic rights in Elblag and Gdansk, and your offer to allow increased Polish emigration. We do not share your opinion that the Poles in Poland will be less free though, for Free Poland is the one safe haven in the world for our people where they may freely follow Polish national traditions and values. The Poles experimented with democracy centuries ago, and it led a once great Commonwealth to collapse and partition; surely our people have no desire for such suffering again. The Free Polish government does not discriminate against non-Communist nations based on their methods of governance however, for the Free Polish Party can see that the one true threat to Poles, and to all of humanity, is the axis that runs between Moscow and Chicago; we would advise you to not to discriminate either, for when the Bear and Eagle strike, you will need any friends you can get.
 
OOC: Megapost time.

In July of 1937, the Glorious Warlord Chang Kai-Shek died of malaria. Upon hearing this tragic news, the nation went into a period of mourning, as the warlord's government scrambled to choose a successor. Eventually, Weng Wenhao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wong_Wen-hao), a young, energetic educator, geologist and inventor was chosen to lead the nation. He came with a new technocratic and scientific modernizing agenda, and new foreign and economic policies and plans. This agenda was further embraced when a leading medic announced that the old leader's life could have been saved if China had obtained the latest European technology (the truth of this statement was never confirmed). Wenhao wrote a new ideological basis for the Chinese state and political system, and with the support of the army and many of the people began a serious reorganization. This new platform was known as Progressism, and emphasized technological supremacy above all else. In order to achieve this, it believed in an authoritarian, meritocratic and highly bureaucratic system. Progressism considers itself to be an independent ideology, on par with Communism, Capitalism and Fascism, and superior to the later three, which it views as either too idealistic (communism), disorganized (capitalism), or militant (fascism) to progress into the future. It is less obsessed with spreading itself than the other three, since it believes that its nations will one day be so far technologically superior, that spreading will cost almost no resources. In many ways it is an extreme trend of what China, Corea and Japan have already been experiencing.


________________________________________________________________
The Progressist Manifesto of Weng Wenhao
It is not the strongest of the nations that survive, but the ones most responsive to change

The Chinese people have learned this resounding lesson of history well and truly. Once our people were great, we ruled from Mongolia to Vietnam, from Corea to Tibet and were revered across the world. Our emperors built a fleet which would sail to India and beyond, while the Europeans still wallowed in feudalism and dirt houses. This fleet reached Indonesia, Arabia and the Americas (OOC: blatant historical revisionism. There is no evidence that Zheng He’s fleet ever reached the Americas, but that doesn’t stop the manifesto from claiming it did to bolster its case for progressive greatness).

But then, our fleet was destroyed and our progress shattered, not by external foes, but by superstitions, fears and government conflicts here at home. In Europe, the idea of progress and Enlightenment was embraced, and they came, on black ships to our country. Our nation had abandoned the way of progress and taken on spirituality, which fell to Europe’s guns in the Boxer Rebellion, a glorious but fatally misguided attempts at liberation. For generations we were slaves to Europe’s squabbling oversees masters, before militarism did to them what government division did to us, crippling the progress of their people, allowing us to be free.

Now, we stand at the brink of a new opportunity, the likes of which have never been presented to us. The old is swept aside, as our new order rises. In our universities and factories, we construct new inventions that bring a hope of scientific innovation and progress to the world. We must not squander this opportunity, we must see clearly the failures of the old before we can hope to break our chains and reinstate the new. First, we see from our own history that a disunited government destroys progress by petty infighting. Yet such foolish government, masquerading as the democratic will of the people has deluded much of the Earth with its whims, and further corrupted the Europeans, turning them from progress to decadence. We however are wiser than that, and shall not be tempted and deluded. Second, the fall of Europe shows that militarism, far from spurring technological rise is in fact its undoing. Yet on that continent, a new and more radical militarism has risen. And the last of the old I wish to lay bare before you, people of China, is Communism, which is a system and view that is merely another seductive mask for division. It is based on setting the worker against the ruler, while true progress must free both the worker and the ruler from their mutual shackles of ignorance.

The failures of these old systems show that the government of true and pure progress must be united, competent and see its people as equals upon the same path to liberation, science and Enlightenment. We shall achieve this by making a layered system of administration, from the leader, to regional masters, to provincial masters, to county governors, to city governors. Whenever a ruler dies or leaves, the most competent of his subordinates (i.e. the one who did the most to improve the lives of his people via infrastructure and the security of his nation via military modernization) shall be chosen to replace the deceased. There will be no division, since in their sphere of jurisdiction a ruler’s word is absolute. There will be no tyranny since every ruler’s advancement depends on the advancement toward the future of his people. Meritocracy will be the supreme law of this glorious technocratic land. Scientific research will be our main focus, and we seek also to spread our enlightenment to the other peoples of this world who yet live in superstitious ignorance, while cooperating with those who have broken the shackles of the past and like us, have seen this new light in its true splendor.
___________________________________________________________________
To China
From Japan


Your instigation of dissent in our colonies is a serious matter. We have offered the prosperity that comes with friendly relations and that leads to a bright future. Your actions in Formosa and Hainan to disrupt our benevolent leadership can only been seen as the first steps on a path to war between our two nations. If that is your desire, we will march down that road with you to the detriment of both our nations. Such a path is not one we would choose or encourage others to take, but understand us well, Japan will not stand by and permit China to meddle in our domestic affairs.

So once again, we offer you friendly relations and peaceful endeavors between Japan and China. What say you?

As per out new government policy which is averse to conflict and the threats to progress that it poses, we would like to offer you several agreements, one of which will hopefully be amicable to both sides. If these offers are declined, then we will have to act in support of the will of the people of these islands. However, you seem like a reasonable nation, and we both realize that war is a major barrier to progress. Hence I hope to settle this diplomatically:

Offer 1: We are willing to buy the two islands for 40ep

Offer 2:
Referendums will be held in both regions to decide which side they want to join. We will pay you 20ep before the referendums begin. If you lose the referendums, your merchants will receive special economic rights and free trade in the now Chinese regions, so that commerce between us may continue. If we lose, similar rights will be extended to our merchants, in the now Japanese islands.

Offer 3:
You give us your secrets in aircraft technology (OOC: so we also have 70 RP in air) and improved trade and commercial conditions for our merchants on these islands, and the islands remain yours.
Offer 4:
You pay us 40 ep and the islands remain yours.
Choose, or make a counter-offer.
 
France echoes calls for the Sudeten High Germans to join Austria. Austria has been pushing for their freedom for years. Austria has been at the forefront in the liberation of its people from Slavic tyranny.

Germany is merely an opportunist vulture seeking to steal the fruits of the labour from the High German. Such attempts at splitting the vote and dividing the voices of the Sudeten people is the lowest form of brigandry.

In other news, France and Italy, along with the other members of the Rome-Berlin Axis, would like to formally welcome Croatia to the Rome-Berlin Axis. We hope our cooperation will be fruitful.

Berlin is in Germany, right? :p
 
America wonders why it's called the Rome-Berlin Axis :<

Berlin is in Germany, right? :p

Because I'm a derp. Please mentally replace any instance of Rome-Berlin to Paris-Rome (or Rome-Paris if you are so inclined) and for the Milarqui please don't make an alliance with Italy otherwise my continual typos will make everybody cry :p

Also its the Paris-Rome Axis because France and Italy were the founding members and the other countries (such as Poland and Austria and now Croatia and Belgium (even though its not a formal member of the Axis its affiliated through its alliance with France)) kind of joined afterwards.
 
Could I join as Bulgaria?
 
Germany is merely an opportunist vulture seeking to steal the fruits of the labour from the High German. Such attempts at splitting the vote and dividing the voices of the Sudeten people is the lowest form of brigandry.

Our only concern is the territorial integrity of our ally, Bohemia-Moravia. We do not know why the free people of the Sudeten should be subjected to the tyranny of the Hitler regime, but apparently you think that it must happen, regardless of the opinion of the people.

There are two words that define you and your allies quite well: psychological projection.
 
In July of 1937, the Glorious Warlord Chang Kai-Shek died of malaria. Upon hearing this tragic news, the nation went into a period of mourning, as the warlord's government scrambled to choose a successor. Eventually, Weng Wenhao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wong_Wen-hao), a young, energetic educator, geologist and inventor was chosen to lead the nation. He came with a new technocratic and scientific modernizing agenda, and new foreign and economic policies and plans. This agenda was further embraced when a leading medic announced that the old leader's life could have been saved if China had obtained the latest European technology (the truth of this statement was never confirmed). Wenhao wrote a new ideological basis for the Chinese state and political system, and with the support of the army and many of the people began a serious reorganization. This new platform was known as Progressism, and emphasized technological supremacy above all else. In order to achieve this, it believed in an authoritarian, meritocratic and highly bureaucratic system. Progressism considers itself to be an independent ideology, on par with Communism, Capitalism and Fascism, and superior to the later three, which it views as either too idealistic (communism), disorganized (capitalism), or militant (fascism) to progress into the future. It is less obsessed with spreading itself than the other three, since it believes that its nations will one day be so far technologically superior, that spreading will cost almost no resources. In many ways it is an extreme trend of what China, Corea and Japan have already been experiencing.


________________________________________________________________
The Progressist Manifesto of Weng Wenhao
It is not the strongest of the nations that survive, but the ones most responsive to change

The Chinese people have learned this resounding lesson of history well and truly. Once our people were great, we ruled from Mongolia to Vietnam, from Corea to Tibet and were revered across the world. Our emperors built a fleet which would sail to India and beyond, while the Europeans still wallowed in feudalism and dirt houses. This fleet reached Indonesia, Arabia and the Americas (OOC: blatant historical revisionism. There is no evidence that Zheng He’s fleet ever reached the Americas, but that doesn’t stop the manifesto from claiming it did to bolster its case for progressive greatness).

But then, our fleet was destroyed and our progress shattered, not by external foes, but by superstitions, fears and government conflicts here at home. In Europe, the idea of progress and Enlightenment was embraced, and they came, on black ships to our country. Our nation had abandoned the way of progress and taken on spirituality, which fell to Europe’s guns in the Boxer Rebellion, a glorious but fatally misguided attempts at liberation. For generations we were slaves to Europe’s squabbling oversees masters, before militarism did to them what government division did to us, crippling the progress of their people, allowing us to be free.

Now, we stand at the brink of a new opportunity, the likes of which have never been presented to us. The old is swept aside, as our new order rises. In our universities and factories, we construct new inventions that bring a hope of scientific innovation and progress to the world. We must not squander this opportunity, we must see clearly the failures of the old before we can hope to break our chains and reinstate the new. First, we see from our own history that a disunited government destroys progress by petty infighting. Yet such foolish government, masquerading as the democratic will of the people has deluded much of the Earth with its whims, and further corrupted the Europeans, turning them from progress to decadence. We however are wiser than that, and shall not be tempted and deluded. Second, the fall of Europe shows that militarism, far from spurring technological rise is in fact its undoing. Yet on that continent, a new and more radical militarism has risen. And the last of the old I wish to lay bare before you, people of China, is Communism, which is a system and view that is merely another seductive mask for division. It is based on setting the worker against the ruler, while true progress must free both the worker and the ruler from their mutual shackles of ignorance.

The failures of these old systems show that the government of true and pure progress must be united, competent and see its people as equals upon the same path to liberation, science and Enlightenment. We shall achieve this by making a layered system of administration, from the leader, to regional masters, to provincial masters, to county governors, to city governors. Whenever a ruler dies or leaves, the most competent of his subordinates (i.e. the one who did the most to improve the lives of his people via infrastructure and the security of his nation via military modernization) shall be chosen to replace the deceased. There will be no division, since in their sphere of jurisdiction a ruler’s word is absolute. There will be no tyranny since every ruler’s advancement depends on the advancement toward the future of his people. Meritocracy will be the supreme law of this glorious technocratic land. Scientific research will be our main focus, and we seek also to spread our enlightenment to the other peoples of this world who yet live in superstitious ignorance, while cooperating with those who have broken the shackles of the past and like us, have seen this new light in its true splendor.

OOC: This reminds me of the old Confucian system of ancient China. Especially the bureaucracy.
 
In other news, can people stop freaking out about "OH NOES ANOTHER COUNTRY FALL TO TEH FASCISTS". Seriously. Fascism is not a global spanning ideology, it's a nationalistic, militaristic, anti communist ideology specifically tailored to your nation. Two fascist nations could very easily fight one another. Freaking out about a nation falling to Communism is one thing, but there is no "set" rule book about fascism, and the way alot of people are reacting is very....frustrating

Nuke raises a really good point (wait- did i just type that?)

To be honest, i can understand the 'latin pact'; Grandkhan and others have used shared racial ancestry for a basis of their union but when nations start to "uncover new evidence of their latin ancestry" so they can fit into the strategic union, it doesn't make much sense. Furthermore, if race is to be used to unify the European and European colonized American nations with a latin past, one must expect that those races not of Latin descent within the borders of these nations will be suitably upset.

Fascism requires a unifying ideology- often nationalism- sometimes nationalism and race- but if that doesn't exist, if the ideology isn't there, then its just totalitarian dictatorship.

Totalitarianism =/= Fascism.

The second point that Nuke raises, regarding our 'Freaking Out' to the fall of another naton to fascism is also true. In this timeline fascism doesn't really have the negative connotations it does in our timeline (yet). Aspects of it (especially the authoritarianism, and anti-democratic ones) are definitely cause for concern, but thats not something unique to fascism. Also, race is obviously thought of in very different way in this period then it is in ours. People still believe in racial superiority (well, they do in our timeline too) but its just the norm in 1930s, not the exception. So to have a race-based ideology is not nearly as offensive to 1930s populations as it is to us. Effectively... nuke is right.

Being scared of communism is another thing all together because communism creates, historically in most cases in this time-line, at its inception, civil war within the nation where it takes route. It also creates a class war- effectively tearing a unified (or nearly unified- depending on the nation) society into armed divisions. It causes massive seizure of private property, the treasures people have spent their entire lives accumulating, and in 90% of cases, requires massive loss of life. It is also just incredibly destabilizing as the entire government and financial life of the nation is rewritten. Imagine losing everything you own and being happy with it. If there is a well-enfranchised middle class, communism just isn't appealing at all. Only when poverty is extremely widespread does there seem to be a wide-scale appeal. (i'm open to refutation on that point)

Electing a socialist government with leftist leanings is not nearly the same thing. And obviously not as scary. None-the-less, it may be of concern to its neighbors who fear the 'spread of communism'.

So yeah, it makes sense that the nations of the world react strongly to the spread of communism and its little sister, socialism.
 
To be honest, i can understand the 'latin pact'; Grandkhan and others have used shared racial ancestry for a basis of their union but when nations start to "uncover new evidence of their latin ancestry" so they can fit into the strategic union, it doesn't make much sense. Furthermore, if race is to be used to unify the European and European colonized American nations with a latin past, one must expect that those races not of Latin descent within the borders of these nations will be suitably upset.

Fascism requires a unifying ideology- often nationalism- sometimes nationalism and race- but if that doesn't exist, if the ideology isn't there, then its just totalitarian dictatorship.

Totalitarianism =/= Fascism.

Some comments on the Latin Pact, and Deloncle's Latin obsession.

The obsession with Latins and the different species thing is really just a fiction that is only maybe believed by Deloncle himself. I mean, its an inherently ridiculous concept - not even the Nazis walked around pretending Jews were an entirely different species, and the race-hatred they had wasn't as pervasive as people think - and the only person who really does believe is Deloncle himself. Its very loosely based on a sort of 'scientific racism' that was popular around this period (leading to the Eugenics movement) but most people in France believe in a much less extreme version. In that, they're not hugely different from many other societies in 1937.

The Fascists and the right in France are greatly supportive of Deloncle, they think he's a good leader who has brought France back to greatness, etc. etc., so they let him persist in his 'eccentricities'. And after all, if he forces a law through forbidding a Berber and a white person to marry, well, thats okay, because as Immaculate said, its 1930 and as far as anyone who matters is concerned that shouldn't happen in a proper society anyway. Deloncle's 'Latin Pact' is a justification for an alliance that exists really only in France - I seriously doubt Adolph Hitler is making speeches in Vienna about the superiority of the Latin Race. No, he's all about liberating the High Germans, and the Austrian nazis have their own justification for the Paris-Rome Axis. As do the Italians, and the Poles, and now the Croatians. Maybe its not even race based - Mussolini spent a long time trying to convince Hitler that racism was unproductive, before going "screw it" and passing race laws, and the Estado Novo (which is arguably fascist) wasn't really concerned with race. It doesn't really matter, because Deloncle and his compatriots aren't hugely concerned with your rhetoric when it comes to fascism.

So when Deloncle goes out and says that the Poles are suddenly Latins, literally nobody believes it - least of all Deloncle. As far as he's concerned, Slavs are Slavs. But Fascist slavs are fascists, and thats good politics and he's not stupid - nobody is going to pass up potential allies because they're Slavs. So he comes up with a vague excuse that Poles are actually Latins because he needs to justify it against his previous rhetoric, people kind of roll their eyes and go "Oh Deloncle," and smile as he gets back to what they consider useful and beneficial work, and Poland is in an alliance with France. Simple.

People paying too much attention to the Latin thing in Deloncle's foreign policy should remember that 'Latinism', just like Hitlers 'Aryanism', is a flimsy ideological basis for a casus belli which doesn't really come up outside of domestic policy and that both literally changed at the drop of a hat - see Hitler's positions on the Japanese 'Aryans'.
 
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