So...will humanity get better with time?

[Kyriakos]

Considering that civilization has been around for a few millenia now, what do you think of how humans go by in the year 2014?


In my view it is not looking good, at all. I still think that humans can be something extremely impressive and pleasant, positive etc. I want to have an optimistic view of this, but it looks more as if our species is being led to a nice field to run to a better place, and maybe was already told by the laughing guard about the field being infested with mines. But chose to repress the memory. Out of even more despair.

(oh, and happy new year ).

 

[Smellincoffee]

We'll have more knowledge, but less wisdom; more stuff, but less purpose. The world is increasingly dominated by ever-larger, ever-powerful states and corporations, but eventually they'll become so complex they'll fall apart. That gives me hope, because even now people who are concerned about the status of human society, about the destruction of its fabric of families and communities, are attempting to restore it through everything from locavorism to subsidarity politics.

 

[Azale]

Despite capitalism, the 20th-21st centuries bodycount and your threads, it is difficult to deny that humanity has already become better with time.

 

[Kyriakos]

^This is RD, so be gone

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

I keep positive. My life is improving so I keep hope for humanity as well. I think in the future we will be laughing on the problems we are facing now. Yet again we will see this period as something amazing and unrepeatable. I think those are wise who can keep detached and in spite problems stay calm and cheerful. Of course thats easier said then done....

 

[Zack]

^This is RD, so be gone

I don't understand, are people not allowed to disagree with you in RD threads? Azale makes a good point, humanity has already gotten better with time. Why wouldn't it continue to do so? Just because it's cool and popular to be a pessimist in regards to the future doesn't mean it's an accurate prediction.

 

[Tahuti]

I don't understand, are people not allowed to disagree with you in RD threads? Azale makes a good point, humanity has already gotten better with time. Why wouldn't it continue to do so? Just because it's cool and popular to be a pessimist in regards to the future doesn't mean it's an accurate prediction.

I agree with Kyriakos here, IMO Azale is being horribly arrogant by stating his opinions as somehow undeniable facts in a particularly overbearing way. He is not alone though.

And to get to the OP, humans still seem very certain of their own cognitive abilities, even if it is arguably not justified. Here is a hand works best with hands.

 

[Zelig]

Humanity is by far and away better than it's been at almost any point in history, using almost any metric. I expect the trend to continue.

 

[Eukaryote]

I think that all objective evidence is showing that humanity's lot is improving and the idea that things are getting worse is nothing more than our Darwinian-pessimistic-amygdala-driven-brains doing what they do best. If you don't believe me, check out the following five resources:

1. The Better Angels of Our Nature by Steven Pinker. This book, written by a cognitive scientist, is an explanation of the evidence supporting the idea that we are living in the most peaceful and tolerant point in history thus far. It also explains the causes of this age of peace.

http://www.amazon.com/Steven-Pinker...=1-2&keywords=the+better+angels+of+our+nature

2. The Skeptical Environmentalist by Bjorn Lomborg. This book argues against the idea that all aspects of the environment are getting worse and against the idea that civilization is about to suffer an environmentally induced collapse. The Population Bomb by Paul Ehrlich is heavily criticized. The book does NOT make any unscientific claims like denying global warming. It's peer reviewed and published by Cambridge University Press. It was published in 2000, so it may be somewhat out of date, but it's still good.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Skeptical-Environmentalist-Measuring-State/dp/0521010683

3. The Fastest Billion by Charles Robertson. This book explains how many African countries are experiencing rapid economic growth and how the region is currently on a trajectory to become as hopeful as China or India.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Fastest-B...9&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=the+fastest+billion

4. Abundance by Peter H. Diamandis and Steven Kotler. This book explains how rapid technological advancements are going to make the next few decades filled with increases in standard of living for both rich and poor.

http://www.amazon.com/Abundance-Future-Better-Than-Think/dp/1451614217

5. Gapminder. This resource is probably the most ingenious way to analyze statistics ever created. In two minutes, you can learn more about the progress of humanity than you could from most university courses. The website has data from 1800 to now, and you can even choose what data it shows you.

http://www.gapminder.org

 

[Winner]

If it is to survive, it will by definition need to get better. Otherwise it will go extinct and the question will be mooted.

 

[Zack]

I agree with Kyriakos here, IMO Azale is being horribly arrogant by stating his opinions as somehow undeniable facts in a particularly overbearing way.

How is he being arrogant and overbearing? How could you possibly believe humanity was "better" in the past?

 

[timtofly]

despite: Contempt, disdain

 

[Tahuti]

The problem is that pointing out to technological advances is somewhat akin to Whiggery, automatically implying that more time has passed, the better we will become. I can't think of a worse circular reasoning than this.

We are also more capable of creating more carnage then ever. Technology is not inherently bad, but it grants us more power that can be used for good or ill. And humanity possesses the kind of technology that can unleash unprecedented manmade destruction. Conversely, plenty of useful technologies that existed in the past do not exist anymore: We do not know how Stonehenge was put into place, for instance.

We do have significantly higher life expentencies than in the past. It is not all bad. Yet the main problem persists: If you have the technology to destroy your own species, it will matter not how many technology you have to restore it, because no one will be able to operate it.

 

[Zack]

The problem is that pointing out to technological advances is somewhat akin to Whiggery, automatically implying that more time has passed, the better we will become. I can't think of a worse circular reasoning than this.

We are also more capable of creating more carnage then ever. Technology is not inherently bad, but it grants us more power that can be used for good or ill. And humanity possesses the kind of technology that can unleash unprecedented manmade destruction. Conversely, plenty of useful technologies that existed in the past do not exist anymore: We do not know how Stonehenge was put into place, for instance.

We do have significantly higher life expentencies than in the past. It is not all bad. Yet the main problem persists: If you have the technology to destroy your own species, it will matter not how many technology you have to restore it, because no one will be able to operate it.

OP talks mainly about morality, which is objectively better today than in the past. Unless you hate gays, blacks, Jews, women, etc. Then I guess it's worse.

How is it circular reasoning? Besides, if there has been an obvious trend for millenia, how is it "circular reasoning" to assume this trend continues?

Should I get out of the thread too, now, because I said something different?

 

[Tahuti]

OP talks mainly about morality, which is objectively better today than in the past. Unless you hate gays, blacks, Jews, women, etc. Then I guess it's worse.

How is it circular reasoning? Besides, if there has been an obvious trend for millenia, how is it "circular reasoning" to assume this trend continues?

I don't see any specific about morality in the OP. It seems to be about humanity in general. Due to "technological progress" (if that even is a valid concept), we have been forced to alter our sense of ethics. Usually, but not universally - I'm NOT a historical materialist - this is done in a hot-potato fashion in which we pick the alteration that is most quickly realisable. We might have improved ethically, but only after those with vested interests were ruined by technological changes.

Should I get out of the thread too, now, because I said something different?

No, because you make good points.

 

[Kyriakos]

Should I get out of the thread too, now, because I said something different?

^Not for that,
but:

How is he being arrogant and overbearing? How could you possibly believe humanity was "better" in the past?

for failing to even read the OP, that makes it rather clear to anyone wishing to actually discuss this that the question is whether humanity will get better in the future, and not how better it was - or if it was at all - in the past, you are asked to carry on by adapting to the actual thread's OP, unless that too is too much to ask..

 

[Eukaryote]

How is he being arrogant and overbearing? How could you possibly believe humanity was "better" in the past?

A lot of people have romanticized views of hunter-gatherer societies.

If any of those people are reading this, I strongly suggest they read War Before Civilization: The Myth of The Peaceful Savage.

http://www.amazon.com/War-Before-Civilization-Peaceful-Savage/dp/0195119126

Also, IMHO, people who think the recent past was better than today are often people who watch/read a lot of news, and are therefore basing their views of recent historical trends on purely anecdotal evidence.

 

[Tahuti]

A lot of people have romanticized views of hunter-gatherer societies.

I for one certainly don't. However, I can understand where it is coming from. Hunter-Gatherer societies are essentially Anarcho-Communist and with a high degree of egalitarianism. They don't know anything akin to property rights, though for the simple reason they do not consume that much resources as to render it a necessity.

However, the concept of "technological progress" must be scrutinised, as must any form of Luddism as well. Both Luddites and techno-utopians have in common they wish to change the state of technology. However, every technological state comes with its own pro's and con's.

We are certainly much better off than hunter-gatherers, but in certain aspects - such as the existence of atomic weapons - we might have been better off in the 19th century than in the 20th century. Women rights didn't improve that much worldwide, since the strides in Women's rights were primarily made in the West and East-Asia. In fact, with the increased birthrates of socially conservative families, women's rights may be rolled back within a couple of centuries, unless societal attitudes or technologies change. Likewise, Zack mentioned Jews. But the last hundred years were certainly not better for Jews than the 19th century, given the violent and endemic anti-semitism of the Arab world and the Holocaust.

Also, IMHO, people who think the recent past was better than today are often people who watch/read a lot of news, and are therefore basing their views of recent historical trends on purely anecdotal evidence.

I don't mean to bully anyone, but I have to think about Cutlass when I read this!

 

[Zack]

Likewise, Zack mentioned Jews. But the last hundred years were certainly not better for Jews than the 19th century, given the violent and endemic anti-semitism of the Arab world and the Holocaust.

The Holocaust was seventy years ago. I would say things have gotten better since then.

 

[peter grimes]

Despite capitalism, the 20th-21st centuries bodycount and your threads, it is difficult to deny that humanity has already become better with time.

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^This is RD, so be gone

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