The Capo's Units Thread

[cool3a2]

Thanks, guys. I'll take a look at the files later as now I am not at home.

EDIT: I've downloaded your file. Feel free to remove your attachment. Thanks again!

 

[The Capo]

Time for a new set of units...

ANCIENT PHOENICIAN UNITS

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Here are some Phoenicians I made for a module that will be part of my upcoming mod "Diplomacy II - the History of the World." Since there isn't very much visual evidence of how the Phoenicians looked these units were based on the scant evidence that was available (pottery, descriptions and depictions by contemporaries of the Phoenicians, etc.) as well as the Canaanites and Semites of the surrounding region. So they may not be historically accurate, but there is no real way of knowing. Anyway I hope you like them, and I am sure they could be used for any anceint scenario or mod.

Animations:
- The Swordsman (and Swordsman Officer) use vanilla swordsman animations
- The Axeman uses vanilla axeman animations
- The Horseman uses Mongol Keshik animations
- The Spearman (and Spearman Officer) use Charlemagne Papal Spearman animations
- The Chariot uses vanilla Chariot animations
- The Archer uses vanilla Archer animations

Thanks:
- Thanks to Bakuel for making the helmets and heads used
- Thanks to achilleszero for the original Sacred Band model that was used for the Swordsman and Spearmen
- Thanks to mechaerik for polishing these units for me

>>DOWNLOAD<<​

Remember to let me know what you think, and don't forget to rate them!

 

[riddleofsteel]

Looks dandy! You're right about there not being many contemporary depictions of Phoenicians, but I think these look just about the same as how I imagine them.

 

[NikNaks]

They look great to me. A clever blend of hellenistic and mesopotamian.

 

[The Capo]

Thanks a lot you guys!

I did more reading than looking at images to get an idea as to how they may have looked. They weren't much of a military power (mostly because they acted as the Greek city-states did rather than one large Kingdom, with varying degrees of unity) and adopted a lot of what they learned overseas into their military style and dress, a lot of their military was adopted from Greek/Hellenic styles (most likely adopted from the Philistines who were supposedly from the Agean), the one image I did find of people dressed like Phoenician soldiers was this image:

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Which you can see in the Swordsman, Spearman, and helmet on the Horseman Officer (the one in the middle). In fact that helmet seems to also have been used by the Carthaginians which was another group I used as a basis for this. That helmet style is further evidenced by these figurines:

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There are a lot of other figurines too, but I couldn't find them again. Anyway it was a lot of guesswork and I have actually been working on these for a very long time. The "Medieval" set is better in my opinion, but is a bit more what-if. I should have that ready soon, I just need to iron out a couple of issues with it.

 

[riddleofsteel]

Yeah, I was under the impression that the Phoenicians were mostly a navy/trade power and not a land-military so much.

 

[ambrox62]

Very interesting units!
Because Phoenicians mainly were sailors and traders, they haven't had a powerful army, thus your historical reproduction may be correct. Each pool of units with a mid-eastern look is plausible for Phoenicians, and you made a very interesting set.

 

[ripple01]

Anyone have an opinion if these could plausiby pass for Hittite units?

They look incredible, The Capo. You consistently amaze me with the amount of high quality work you are able to pump out.

Cheers,
ripple01

 

[riddleofsteel]

I'd say yes, but that might just be me. I've seen depictions of aegean hittites that look pretty similar.

 

[The Capo]

Anyone have an opinion if these could plausiby pass for Hittite units?

They look incredible, The Capo. You consistently amaze me with the amount of high quality work you are able to pump out.

Cheers,
ripple01

Firstly, thank you very much for the compliment. I don't really consider myself the best unit maker out there, but I have noticed the quality of the units has been getting better.

Its a lot of work for me, so I really appreciate it when somebody pays me a compliment.

As far as the Hitties question goes; I'd say no. These are really more semitic/canaanite than they are Hittite. And the Agean Hittites that riddleofsteel refers to are probably the Neo-Hittites, which would appear more like Ancient Scythians than they would like Phoenicians. The original Hittites were more "Asiatic," if that term can be used properly in this context, and the later Hitties were a bit more Indo-European, the former being conquered and assimiliting with the later.

BUT, I am eventually going to work on a set of Hittite units, but it may not be for a while (at LEAST a month), and of course I don't mind what my units are used for so by all means, make them Hittites.

(although I wouldn't)

 

[ambrox62]

Anyone have an opinion if these could plausiby pass for Hittite units?

From a historical point of view I answer "no" for all of the armored units above. In fact they have greaves (the pieces of armour that protect the legs) and greaves were iron age stuff, while Hittite civ has started and ended during the late bronze age (1800-1200).

From a Civ4 point of view I say "yes", of course, because you will conduct hittite civ toward modern eras

 

[riddleofsteel]

The Capo is correct, I checked and the Aegean variety was more recent than the Asiatic (Asia Minor?) Hittites. I found an interesting site on Hittites and read for over an hour on the history.

 

[The Capo]

The Capo is correct, I checked and the Aegean variety was more recent than the Asiatic (Asia Minor?) Hittites. I found an interesting site on Hittites and read for over an hour on the history.

Could you post the URL so I could check it out for my Hittite units.

 

[riddleofsteel]

http://hittites.info/

There is precious little there in the way of depictions except for relief carvings, at least that I have seen.

 

[The Capo]

Some good stuff there, I'll have to take a deeper look when I get some time. But from the little I read there it seems quite apparent to me that the Neo-Hittites (or the Agean influenced Hittites) were probably the same as the Trojans from the Iliad. In fact I believe that the naem Troy comes from a Hittite word "Truiska."

Anyway here are a bunch of units I am going to be using for inspiration:

Spoiler :

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But as I've said before, I am not sure when I will begin on this or how long it will take. I'm having enough trouble getting the Medieval Phoenicians to show up in-game without problems (well, only the Maceman isn't working. It causes a CTD for some reason so its hard to figure out what is wrong).

 

[riddleofsteel]

Yeah, I got lost in reading for a while today. In any case, I think the images you've chosen are excellent for inspiration. I recognize the art style. If you did make more Hittite content, I'm sure others as well as myself would wait as long as it took. I've long wondered if anybody would take on the task of a Hyksos civilization. I would imagine that they would take even more work to make, as the records of them are more fragmentary. I wish I could make my own textures and units. Is it fairly easy to learn?

 

[The Capo]

There is a lot of debate over who the Hyksos actually were (the name I don't think is their own name, but the name given to them by the Egyptians which means foreigner or something to that effect). In fact I have even seen some contend that the Hyksos and the Hebrews of the exodus are one in the same. There are also people who claim they aren't even a united group of people or of the same ethnicity at all. It is pretty similiar to the situation of the Habiru, which was really a name for nomads (possibly the ancient equivalent of our term for Gypsies) and the similarity to the word Hebrew is probably where the whole Hyksos/Habiru/Hebrew thing comes from in the first place.

So basically, I'd say that creating the Hyksos with any semblence of accuracy, or even a necessity (since they probably weren't really a united group, or even of similar ancestry) is just as pointless as making a "Sea Peoples" civ. The Sea Peoples were probably Philistines or even the precursor to the Phoenicians by the way.

 

[riddleofsteel]

Agreed, the records I've read that describes the several incursions of Sea People seem to indicate that they came from different places nearly every time. Yes, probably pointless. I was just trying to think of a civ I could hope to make that hadn't been made some day.

 

[achilleszero]

Some good stuff there, I'll have to take a deeper look when I get some time. But from the little I read there it seems quite apparent to me that the Neo-Hittites (or the Agean influenced Hittites) were probably the same as the Trojans from the Iliad. In fact I believe that the naem Troy comes from a Hittite word "Truiska."

Anyway here are a bunch of units I am going to be using for inspiration:

Spoiler :

​

But as I've said before, I am not sure when I will begin on this or how long it will take. I'm having enough trouble getting the Medieval Phoenicians to show up in-game without problems (well, only the Maceman isn't working. It causes a CTD for some reason so its hard to figure out what is wrong).

Just so you know, I have made the 3 man chariot and the Royal Guard from those source pics. Theyre not done, but theyre fairly far along. Theyre jsut on the back burner till I actually get some time to finish them.

 

[The Capo]

I gotta go hit the local pub right now, but I would be extremely grateful if you could send me those files. It would probably be very helpful to me in creating a full set. As you are probably aware more than mosts, my strength isn't the actual creation of models, but in putting them together creatively so that they look unique or well-polished (at least I like to think so).

So anyway, I'd like to see what you have done so far so I can start planning out an ancient and "medieval" set for the Hittites. As soon as I figure out what is going wrong wit the Phoenician "medieval" set I can get that posted too.