The Sword of Islam: RFC Medieval Middle East

[Jusos2108]

Does it ever happen in RFC? I might have broke something.

And thanks for other screenshots, I'll be collecting them for a showcase of sorts

IIRC it doesn't, but I am not sure. And you are welcome. I'll post more, if I stumble on some more.

Some other things that I have noticed recently while playing:

1. Are horse archers supposed to have flank attack? Currently they don't.
2. When a civ respawns their previous relationships should be leveled.
3. Mongol barbs are not preferring Muslim nations over PoA and KoJ.

 

[3Miro]

How about assassinate a defending unit (or at least severely damage its health). Assassins worked on a more massive scale against Crusaders in general, not just Crusader leaders.

As tensions in the Middle East grew during the Crusades, the Assassins were also known for taking contracts from outside sources on either side of the war, whether it was from the invading Crusaders or the Saracen forces, so long as the assassination fit in to the Grandmaster's plan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassins

 

[jammerculture]

Ideas for assassins:

remove unit promotions (kill the general)
remove great generals from units
remove fortify bonus (destroy fortifications)
I like the kill the governor idea to create instability/anarchy in the city/or unhappiness

How about "kill the leader" which can only be undertaken in the capital and creates some turns of anarchy?

Or if you want to go balls-to-the-wall-epic: turn them into a "stack killer" by creating a new "leaderless" promotion that is inflicted on the units in the stack on a successful attack. This effect would increase based on the size of the stack so <5 units, leaderless 1, -10% strength, 5-10 units leaderless 2 -10% strength, half movement and inability to fortify, >10 units leaderless 3 -10% strength, half movement, inability to fortify and 5% chance per turn that units flip to independents.

This attack would be obviously extremely powerful so should cost substantial espionage points and only be available with a high level assasin

 

[The Turk]

@Edead

Why haven't you added Super Spies to the SVN yet?

 

[embryodead]

I haven't finished the actual implementation, like assassins & promotions. Tonight I tested my assassination mission, it works, but well, it's not very useful. I might commit it later tonight. About the suggested ideas:

- spies/assassins can't be both spies and combat units
- Assassins fought mainly other Muslims, so Crusaders can hire them as well; I'm just not fond of destroying or damaging whole units as part of the Assassination theme; there were actual battles fought as well, but that's what the old "combat" version of Assassin is for - they roam in Syria and attack everyone.
- city gates thing / reducing fortification - incite revolt does exactly that already
- assassinating the governor - I'll put down my own idea - forment unhappiness does that already (unhappiness + instability since its related), unless governors are implemented (I wanted ones like Mentats in DuneWars - essentially moving National Wonders - they sit in a city and provide some bonus - assassins would be able to kill them)
- killing the leader of a unit - that is nice, though a bit too complicated tbh; it'd be ackward because XP and levels would have to be removed as well.
- I really like Kill the Leader option, I'd just name it differently (Assassinate the Heir - since Leaders in CiV4 are kind of "immortal"); that's the most likely thing I'll go with, sounds easy to implement too

 

[The Turk]

(I wanted ones like Mentats in DuneWars - essentially moving National Wonders - they sit in a city and provide some bonus - assassins would be able to kill them)

YES!

That would be SOO awesome if you could have a "King" or "Emir" unit that would sit in a city and give it bonus, and can ONLY be removed by spy assassination OR by conquering the city and killing him (like a worker); that would be really cool!

 

[jammerculture]

I tend to think big. However don't rule out a simpler implementation of my idea. Any feature which gave the assassin a unique advantage in combat would really enhance your mod imo, as well as add an entirely new layer of strategy for the game which would be both historic and interesting.

 

[The Turk]

Cool! I'm loving your changes, I will test them out now!
But I would suggest you add something about Super spies, and your new spy system in the SoI manual, it'll make it easier for new players and the such. Also you need to change the "history" part for the fida'i and the Assassin now.

PS. I'm trying out the Khan Krum invasion again (813 AD), because I'm seeing too many games with a powerful Byzantine Empire, and especially now with the buffed up spies, I'm on the alert
I would recommend that you too seriously consider adding him in.

PPS. It sucks that you can't use espionage against independent or Barbarian cities
The problem is that, technically Independent cities represent actual kingdoms, so it sucks that you can't perform some sort of espionage against them, like Kill the Heir or whatever.

 

[Bouw]

i'm playing a game as the omans now and I was wondering where i might find a resource of horses to get the Arabian unique unit
Also, does anyone have general hints for getting the UHV?
I figured the only way to spread Islam to foreign coastal cities is to found cities near friendly civs and gift them to them and then spread Islam? Or is it?
It's now 1300 and I only have 300 or something gold. Can i get still get 50000 by 1600 and how should i do that?

This i my spearman getting a lot of experience by defeating the first barbarians i encountered, about 6 Mongol horse archers. nice!

 

[2phunkey4u]

There's a strategy discussion thread for such questions.
Nevertheless now that's posted:

• nearest horse resource is near Salalah, just south-and-a-little-west to your starting location.
• OB and send your missionaries out - if nobody wants to OB, there's also incense near Salalah to get you Sufis. Med and Black Sea coastal cities count, too, in case you're late!
• you can still get the gold if you focus on trade and wealth. But be prepared for the Portugese.

 

[The Turk]

Quick Fix:

Spoiler :

The tech astronomy, centres your world map, but also enables the construction of Ulegh Beg's Observatory which ALSO centres your world map. May I suggest that you remove Ulegh Beg's Observatory from repeating an affect and instead replace it with something else?
Also as the Safavids I conquered an independent Rayy, but its name did not change to Tehran! I'm guessing thats a bug? Because I thought that the city would change names after the Mongol Invasion period

 

[2phunkey4u]

What good does this do anyway btw?

 

[nickoman23]

I think we should add some hindu civs to southern india, I googled a few:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtrakuta_Dynasty
They pretty much made southern india

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Chalukya_Empire
They ruled much of southern india too

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoysala_Empire
And the hill people.

 

[nickoman23]

I know this is going to sound weird, but can we up mongol supremacy, every time I play as timur, there are to many indie cities in persia. To much of the world becomes indie, not mongol. I know the mongols are a death sentance already, but the problem is that they dont win enough battles, I mean I one time saw Kwarezm still alive in 1350!

I thinks there are 2 good solutions to this:
1 is too add the il khanate, even as a non-playable, this would mean persia would either be an over extended il khanate, and the indies would spend all their time fighting the il khanate and not be prepared for an attack from the east.

2 is to make the Mongol Horse archer more powerful, like increasing their chance to inflict collateral damage or add their ability to reduce city fortifications.

Frankly I like making an il khanate because its something Ive wanted for a long time.

 

[The Turk]

I know this is going to sound weird, but can we up mongol supremacy, every time I play as timur, there are to many indie cities in persia. To much of the world becomes indie, not mongol. I know the mongols are a death sentance already, but the problem is that they dont win enough battles, I mean I one time saw Kwarezm still alive in 1350!

Well the Mongols are already very powerful, and on top of that you also have their successors which come and terrorize the Middle East for pretty much the rest of the game. Those Independent cities used to be Seljuk cities which were collapsed and probably taken over by the Mongols who later had them flipped or captured by the independents. Technically those Independent cities represent the Il-Khante faction, due to the fact that the Il-Khanate was extremely decentralized, with the Khan only asking for tribute every so often.

I thinks there are 2 good solutions to this:
1 is too add the il khanate, even as a non-playable, this would mean persia would either be an over extended il khanate, and the indies would spend all their time fighting the il khanate and not be prepared for an attack from the east.

This sounds like a good idea, and I wouldn't mind it being implemented except for two things:
1. What happens if Mongol barbarians attack this civilization, won't that look awkward to say the least?
2. This Il-Khanate would collapse pretty quickly (unless Edead programmed them like the Buyids to keeping them alive and then collapsing them later on, which wouldn't be too bad of an idea).

Overall its not my decision to make, and if Edead wants to take the time to create another civilization like that, I would be for it, but Edead doesn't seem to responsive to wanting to make changes very lately.

2 is to make the Mongol Horse archer more powerful, like increasing their chance to inflict collateral damage or add their ability to reduce city fortifications.

The Mongol Horse Archer is already extremely powerful and has no counter except for thick walls, castle and a few marksmen, other than that no unit (unless heavily promoted) can withstand a Mongol Horse Archer on the open battle field.

I think we should add some hindu civs to southern india, I googled a few:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtrakuta_Dynasty
They pretty much made southern india

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Chalukya_Empire
They ruled much of southern india too

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoysala_Empire
And the hill people.

This has been discussed before, the problem with these dynasties is that, with the exception of the Hoysala Empire (who never expanded into the frame of this game), they all had their bases centered around areas outside of the map. All the Empires in this game, have their capitals and centers of power placed on the map.
But frankly, if Edead were to ever expand the map (which I would love if he did), then I would ask him to first move it to the West (add in more Bulgarians and Byzantine cities, as well as North Africa), and then secondly expand to the East, to open up more of India, which would be interesting as well.


MUSIC UPDATE
Byzantine (Greek) Chanting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfbtJt5y_HE&feature=BF&list=PLC4A085C6169DF2C0&index=28

Also the Meyer Auditorium Concert Series (the series on itunes which I showed earlier in this thread) has a couple new original Northern Indian classical pieces, something I thought you might want to check into, especially for adding in more Indian background music (the most recent one by Shujaat Khan's sitar is AMAZING!)

PS. The lake west of al-Qariah has no name.

 

[The Turk]

Hi Everyone,

I was wondering if you guys would be interested in helping me test out this new Bulgarian barb spawn which I have been working on. It adds another historical invasion (Khan Krum's in 813), and it helps put a bit more pressure on the Byzantine city of Adrianople, which historically was continuously been raided. I myself have tested this out quite a few times, and it generally gives more flavor to the game and makes for a more historical Byzantine Empire, without allowing the Romans to become too weak.

Place the Barb.py file:
Mods/The Sword of Islam/Assets/Python
Place the "Middle East 750 CE" file:
Mods/The Sword of Islam/Private Maps
----- I only removed the spearman, replaced it with an archer and then removed the walls surrounding Adrianople.
And overwrite the old files.

And remember, before you overwrite to create a copy of the original fie!

Hope you guys enjoy! And please remember to comment on it!

PS: For best results play as a faction further away from Byzantium (ie. not Byzantium, Sultanate of Rum or Ottomans), this way you can see how the AI reacts to it in a "normal" situation

PPS. If you have any questions, especially concerning how to add in the files, please ask!


----------------------------------------
On a side note:
I would like to propose a new Dawn of Man text for the Ottomans:

It is the year 1326 AD. Since the collapse of the Seljuk Sultanate in Anatolia at the hands of the Mongol Hordes, there has been no beylik powerful enough to challenge other ghazi emirates, until Osman Bey. With you're newly captured capital at Brusa move to reunite the beylik's, and march on to the rich Roman cities of Bithynia and Thrace, with your ultimate prize of Constantinople.

Also I would recommend moving the Ottoman spawn date to 1326. Because that is historically when Bursa fell to Osman's Turks. And historically a good time to start the game for them.

-------------------------------------------
On another side note:
A another pretty good title woud be Saifullah (Sword of Islam). Basically if a unit (or we could limit this to GG's only), kills 10-15 units then they would get the Saifullah promotion which would give them some sort of bonus. I was thinking some sort of stack bonus, but it could be something else as well. Of course this would be limited to Sunni and Shi'a civilizations, but if this one get implemented I'm sure we could find something for the Christians and even perhaps the Hindus as well.

 

[nickoman23]

Ok, then can edead add some indies to southern india to represent the southern india kingdoms. Even Manbai (spelling) was founded before the starting date of the game, yet it not their when you begin.
But that also goes for pretty much the rest of the map. Like Palestine; gaza and akaba as well as tabuk and kerak are all very old cites (some even mentioned in the bible) yet they are nowhere to be found in the beginning. Punjab and Sindh is very much the same thing; I mean the opening spawn tab says that your from a native sindh family that established a shia sultanate, yet how is a that possible if there are no cities in sindh before you spawn?

 

[Leoreth]

The Middle East basically consists only of cities that are older than 750 AD. But it wouldn't be fun having them all preplaced and nothing to decide on your own.

 

[jammerculture]

I always see the foundation of cities as the setting up of government administration in an area that is already inhabited. The map of civ is very small, there are countless towns and villages "hidden" in the map due to scale.

 

[embryodead]

Hey, just a quick note. Sorry for lack of updates. I've got some trouble atm, if it doesn't get worse I should be able to get back to CIV4 in about 2 weeks.