The Thread Where We Discuss Guns and Gun Control

[El_Machinae]

Do you have any idea how hard it is to forgive people who not only dislike you, but are very much insistant that YOU are the cause of deeper societal problems?

...
This has nothing to do with my statement. I never said anything about forgiving.
Sympathy and empathy are different things.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

By "these people" you mean... everyone?

Humanity

 

[amadeus]

How many people have been hurt by this administration alone?

How do you define hurt?

 

[Cloud_Strife]

How do you define hurt?

What is your point?

 

[amadeus]

What is your point?

To clearly define the terms that you are using.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

To clearly define the terms that you are using.

Being materially worse off, being intentionally targetted.

I'm not just talking financially, but holistically; Trump's continued gutting of environmental regulations is harmful to us all for example and ties into the continued slashing of welfare and other programs designed to help those already struggling.

 

[El_Machinae]

Holy crap, Sharpe is back.
[looks frantically for IglooDude and Agentman ....]

 

[amadeus]

I'm just quite frankly amazed that I exist in anyone's memory.

 

[cardgame]

Then Virginia Democrats should abandon their plans on gun control to keep it from happening. Especially since 90% of the counties in Virginia have enacted 2nd Amendment sanctuary policies since the Democrats took over the state legislature in November. That's basically a declaration that it doesn't matter what laws Democrats pass, because the people aren't going to follow them and law enforcement won't enforce them.

How well has that gone, historically speaking?

 

[Commodore]

So .... essentially making a government list of everyone who wants to own a firearm, and then holding them accountable to a higher standard

Not necessarily. The sheriff could just make a blanket "every adult who is a resident of this county is a deputy" without actually keeping track of who does or doesn't live in the county or who owns a firearm.

Another implication though is this action, if taken, could be construed as these sheriffs attempting to raise their own militias to engage in anti-government activity (since they are doing it to defy state law). However, this particular type of rebellion would be one that would likely receive support from the federal government. That could create a very...bad situation where a state government is trying to suppress a rebellion while the federal government actively works against that state government.

 

[El_Machinae]

It strikes me as a clever workaround. Not perfect, obviously, we can all see flaws. I've no idea of the long-term ramifications of deputizing everyone. As I said, liability insurance springs to mind.

Additionally, every crime committed by or against someone will become a crime committed involving a law enforcement officer.

So many strange implications!

 

[Commodore]

It strikes me as a clever workaround. Not perfect, obviously, we can all see flaws. I've no idea of the long-term ramifications of deputizing everyone. As I said, liability insurance springs to mind.

Additionally, every crime committed by or against someone will become a crime committed involving a law enforcement officer.

So many strange implications!

Not to mention they would all have the power of arrest. You would have neighbors arresting each other because one person's dog crapped on someone else's lawn.

 

[El_Machinae]

And then we have more reason to militarize the police! APCs for all citizens of Virginia!

 

[Commodore]

And then we have more reason to militarize the police! APCs for all citizens of Virginia!

Well as far as I'm aware there isn't anything technically illegal about modifying your car/truck/SUV/minivan with armor to make it look like something out of Death Race or Twisted Metal. Mounting weapons on your car though...

 

[Estebonrober]

So speaking of insurance. Since you do not have a right to a drivers license and I'm going to bet that most firearm owners have driver's licenses could you not hold them up there legally? I mean so you are renewing your license and you have to declare if you own firearms or something and if you do you have to show a license for it as well to get a driver's license? I mean I know it won't fly in some states but it might very well in many especially if we get into particular firearms.

 

[Commodore]

So speaking of insurance. Since you do not have a right to a drivers license and I'm going to bet that most firearm owners have driver's licenses could you not hold them up there legally? I mean so you are renewing your license and you have to declare if you own firearms or something and if you do you have to show a license for it as well to get a driver's license? I mean I know it won't fly in some states but it might very well in many especially if we get into particular firearms.

Nope that wouldn't work legally because that would be the government attaching conditions onto the exercising of a right, which the courts decided a long time ago was a big no-no.

Also, all that would do is encourage people to lie about firearm ownership just like they lie about having car insurance.

 

[Estebonrober]

Nope that wouldn't work legally because that would be the government attaching conditions onto the exercising of a right, which the courts decided a long time ago was a big no-no.

Also, all that would do is encourage people to lie about firearm ownership just like they lie about having car insurance.

It would the latter but conditions for your drivers license is totally legit. Lying about it would result in a fine theoretically and possible loss of driver's license. I bet this passes constitutional muster. I wonder what an con/lib constitutional lawyer take on the idea would be. I'm not sure I support the idea I just came up with it when the insurance liability thing came up.

 

[Commodore]

It would the latter but conditions for your drivers license is totally legit. Lying about it would result in a fine theoretically and possible loss of driver's license. I bet this passes constitutional muster. I wonder what an con/lib constitutional lawyer take on the idea would be. I'm not sure I support the idea I just came up with it when the insurance liability thing came up.

My guess is that it doesn't pass Constitutional muster because this policy is essentially saying that if you exercise your 2nd Amendment right, then the government will deny you access to a government service. The Supreme Court, especially with its current makeup, is going to shake their heads at that.

 

[zxcvbob]

So speaking of insurance. Since you do not have a right to a drivers license and I'm going to bet that most firearm owners have driver's licenses could you not hold them up there legally? I mean so you are renewing your license and you have to declare if you own firearms or something and if you do you have to show a license for it as well to get a driver's license? I mean I know it won't fly in some states but it might very well in many especially if we get into particular firearms.

Others have pointed out the problems with this. I'm wondering why you'd want to do it in the first place? Is the point just to screw gun owners? What happens when religious zealots get in charge and do the same thing about declaring your religion to obtain essential services? (ostensibly to deny service to anyone not on the approved religion list) Don't say that could never happen; you just invented the precedent for it.
BTW, Merry Christmas, y'all!

 

[El_Machinae]

I think the main goal is to slow the drip of illegal weapons into criminal organizations. If it's easy to buy guns in one place, it's easy to sell them in another.