the viability of depleted uranium bullets

[philippe]

I was wondering if it would ever be possible to make uranium depleted bullets for handguns.

Imagine, you can pierce anything with that kind of bullet and leave a gaping hole into your victim, who will be incinerated becuase of the uranium contact with oxygen triggers a complete and total incineration.

The massive weight of the bullet also makes for an giant impact entry hole, you'll be blasting off the entire body. it could be an type of bullet for a handgun in which you are absolutely sure 1 shot= kill.

Now the cons are obvious:

enormous weight of the bullets, enviromental issues, ethical issues, higher costs i think and what if this kind of bullet falls in the wrong hands? Terrorists with guns with bullets as these could easily penetrate pantzer and kevlar.
Also, you can't exactly use it in close quarters, for which handguns actually serve.

and is it even possible to make such bullets? I'm thinking of the trigger mechanism to trigger the bullet forward, i'm not an expert but I can guess it can backfire of course.

and of course, do you think such bullet is unethical?

 

[nivi]

Before you even start thinking about ethical issues, the practical issues destroys it completely.

 

[Ecofarm]

Too heavy. You'd need 2 hands for 3 rounds of a decent caliber + propellant. Even then, the recoil would be nasty.

You want to try to move like a pound and half to 1k ft. per second with your body as foundation?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium

That's 20mm. You want to try 9mm, or .45 from hand?


Laser FTW.

 

[Impaler[WrG]]

Hand guns do not impart enough kinetic energy for the density of DU to be a factor in the penetration of the bullet.

 

[philippe]

So, there is no option to forge smaller bullets then? It would lose some of it's unique features due to lack of kinetic energy and smaller framework?

 

[Impaler[WrG]]

Smaller bullet with a mass equal to that of a normal bullet would still have the same Kinetic energy because that a product of the gun-powder in the shell which in a hand gun is very small.

Also whats this about incineration? DU bullets would not incinerate a person in any way, nor would their density cause more damage to flesh as the density difference between flesh and a lead bullet is already very high the extra density of DU doesn't significantly change the collision.

Analogy, firing steel bullets at steel armor is equivalent to firing a wooden bullet at a wooden target, upgrading the steel bullet to DU is equivalent to upgrading the wooden bullet to a steel bullet. Flesh though is roughly the equivalent of Jello and will get penetrated by anything significantly harder and denser.

 

[philippe]

Smaller bullet with a mass equal to that of a normal bullet would still have the same Kinetic energy because that a product of the gun-powder in the shell which in a hand gun is very small.

Also whats this about incineration? DU bullets would not incinerate a person in any way, nor would their density cause more damage to flesh as the density difference between flesh and a lead bullet is already very high the extra density of DU doesn't significantly change the collision.

Analogy, firing steel bullets at steel armor is equivalent to firing a wooden bullet at a wooden target, upgrading the steel bullet to DU is equivalent to upgrading the wooden bullet to a steel bullet. Flesh though is roughly the equivalent of Jello and will get penetrated by anything significantly harder and denser.

great response, thank you for the explanation, although one remark:
the inceneration comes from the fact that DU is pyrophoric:

On more properly military grounds, depleted uranium is favored for the penetrator because it is self-sharpening and pyrophoric.[18] On impact with a hard target, such as an armoured vehicle, the nose of the rod fractures in such a way that it remains sharp. The impact and subsequent release of heat energy causes it to disintegrate to dust and burn when it reaches air because of its pyrophoric properties

but this effect wouldn't be triggered with contact with any human material?

 

[Adamb0mb]

but this effect wouldn't be triggered with contact with any human material?

Well your quote is in regards to hard targets and humans are soft targets so probably not.

 

[Fëanor]

Perhaps DU bullets could be used for Anti-Materiel Rifles, though i seriously doubt that anything lower is realistic.

As Eco pointed out the recoil would be nasty, practically useless for automatic fire and the wear and tear of the barrels would be pretty absurd, you'd probably have to change it several times a week on assault rifles and possibly even several times a day on machineguns during operations and the prospect of having your gun break down if the firefight takes to long is probably very unappealing. Also carrying all that extra weight would be extremely uncomfortable.

 

[BasketCase]

DU rounds are effective against tank armor for a few specific reasons, and kinetic energy transfer isn't the only one. Uranium metal will shatter or spall on impact. Also, small fragments of uranium metal burst into flame in open air. So when one of these things hits a tank, the interior of the tank gets filled with hundreds of tiny little shards of metal that are all on fire.

I don't think you'll get these effects if a DU bullet hits a bulletproof vest. Some vests are metal or ceramic (similar to tank armor), but a lot of them are fiber or layered cloth.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Perhaps DU bullets could be used for Anti-Materiel Rifles, though i seriously doubt that anything lower is realistic.

As Eco pointed out the recoil would be nasty, practically useless for automatic fire and the wear and tear of the barrels would be pretty absurd, you'd probably have to change it several times a week on assault rifles and possibly even several times a day on machineguns during operations and the prospect of having your gun break down if the firefight takes to long is probably very unappealing. Also carrying all that extra weight would be extremely uncomfortable.

Based on the descriptions by Ecofarm about the nasty recoil of such a weapon, probably the only viable "hand-carried" weapons that could use DU bullets would be a tripod-type weapon, or an anti-tank rifle; the latter of which is about seventy years out of date.

 

[bhsup]

And if you are going with a tripod, there is no need since the tripod mounted Mk.19 is already the perfect home defense weapon.

 

[Cutlass]

Current handguns are quite powerful enough. Even too much so in many cases. If you need more power than that, use a rifle or shotgun.

 

[Ecofarm]

And if you are going with a tripod, there is no need since the tripod mounted Mk.19 is already the perfect home defense weapon.

Just make sure you get 40mm grenades that do no require revolutions to arm, otherwise you might as well throw rocks

--

DU would overpenetrate humans and that's not good.

 

[GenMarshall]

The only thing depleted uranium bullets are useful fore are artillery shells, tank shells, or possibly placed into a breader reactor.

 

[Irish Caesar]

I would think they'd be fairly expensive bullets...

Perhaps if you wanted to send someone a message?

...breader reactor.

 

[Fugitive Sisyphus]

The only thing depleted uranium bullets are useful fore are artillery shells, tank shells, or possibly placed into a breader reactor.

Nah, uranium bullets taste better deep-fried than breaded.

 

[Rhotel1]

There is some excellent commentary about the practicality of DU - it is quite impractical.

The original poster, though, appears quite unconvinced and maintains that the pyrophoric property will still incinerate the human target. It is true that uranium is pyrophoric, but that applies only to the dust and there would be no dust as the DU bullet passed completely through the human target. DU is only useful to destroy armor. There would be no advantage (as other posters have said) in using DU as a small arms bullet to counter bullet proof vest.

Another poster mentioned that DU is used for artillery rounds. That is not correct. No DU artillery rounds have been produced. Artillery does not face armored targets; it is not like in the Civil War where the guns were mounted on the ridge and had to withstand an infantry charge.

To learn more about DU, go to www.depletedcranium.com or to the links in this DUStory message - http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/DUStory/message/55

Write me as the owner of this Yahoo Group -

Roger

 

[Fëanor]

Another poster mentioned that DU is used for artillery rounds. That is not correct. No DU artillery rounds have been produced. Artillery does not face armored targets; it is not like in the Civil War where the guns were mounted on the ridge and had to withstand an infantry charge.

Though theoretically DU could be used in Artillery to give it an extra bunker busting ability right? But i guess that Bunker Busting Bombs are more effective at that.

 

[Rhotel1]

The bunker buster bomb does not contain DU. That is a common oft repeated internet myth. That myth is the heart of the claims that Afghanistan is heavily polluted with DU. Those claims are totally false.

Direct fire tank and artillery would gain no advantage by using DU munitions to fire at a bunker unless the bunker was armored. DU is no more effective at piercing concrete than an explosive round. DU rounds DO NOT explode!

Roger

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