Zardnaar
Deity
I wonder if you also think parents should be able to deny their child say, cancer treatment, or if you're just being a raging transphobe.
See previous comment. Cancer treatment is different.
I wonder if you also think parents should be able to deny their child say, cancer treatment, or if you're just being a raging transphobe.
They're not going to die if they don't take it that's weaksauce arguement.
I don't think this is a sound analogy.I wonder if you also think parents should be able to deny their child say, cancer treatment, or if you're just being a raging transphobe.
I don't think this is a sound analogy.
Cancer can be diagnosed in a pretty objective way, and the treatments are well-established. We can talk about "denying cancer treatment" because we can confidently state that the patient has cancer, and how that cancer can be treated.
This isn't true of gender dysphoria. Diagnosing it is difficult and unreliable, and we do not have well-established process for treating it. This is all new and contested ground; you could ask five psychiatrists and get six opinions. This means that we can't readily talk about "denying gender dysphoria treatment" because every word of that sentence implies a host of further questions, so it's unhelpful to draw analogies to what would be a straightforward example of parental negligence.
Are you for real? Suicide can mean death!
I love when the 'we need numbers' crew ignores the only person bringing numbers to the table.
True but here if you're not going to get fair arguing that.
As I said there's waits for all types of medicine threatening suicide doesn't speed that up otherwise everyone would do it.
Not sure how the case went down sounds stupid but to me it's fundamentally about consent and parents have the right to refuse. The state can intervene in some cases but then you would have to make the arguement that any parent saying no to puberty blockers should have their kid removed from them.
True but here if you're not going to get far arguing that.
As I said there's waits for all types of medicine threatening suicide doesn't speed that up otherwise everyone would do it.
Not sure how the case went down sounds stupid but to me it's fundamentally about consent and parents have the right to refuse. The state can intervene in some cases but then you would have to make the arguement that any parent saying no to puberty blockers should have their kid removed from them.
I am also intrigued when El_Mac says we don't have data on puberty blocker long-term effects on people who don't go on to HRT.
No, it isn't.@Traitorfish To use a crass analogy, this is like saying that we need to be sure that immunisations don’t cause autism before we inject them into children.
What a long winded post to say that you know better about people's bodies than they do.
It can be, easily so, because 'making sure' is a dial that's affected by both actual underlying concern AND transphobia. Medicine is always a best-efforts real-time process. Someone can have a concern, and want more study before a treatment is recommended. But someone can actually resent the intervention and disguise it as 'wanting more study'.Being in favour of making sure that medical stuff dealing with such an issue know exactly what they are doing is in no way, shape or form "anti-trans".
I agree with this. I think TraitorFish worked very hard to express a coherent position, and pointing out where some of the failures in measuring could occur. The main contention I would have with it is a reminder that failing to intervene is the same as choosing an outcome. We don't psychologically weight the concept of 'intervention' equally, you can see this with the divide people express when it comes to something as simple as the Trolley Problem.These sort of attacks are doing a disservice to the whole debate.