US Capitol Breached

[Seon]

Like, you are making an error in judgment in that you are not linking Parler and other platforms which tolerate these extreme right-wing views and the upsurge in right wing stochastic terrorism across America. You are not seeing that *people talking about it* actually makes what these people are talking about more likely to happen.

In an age of mass but individualized media we find ourselves in, right wing extremists openly discuss important dates, enemies they want to kill, methodologies they want to employ, etc etc etc. Most of these people might be joking, but some of them are not. A certain percentage of people viewing and internalizing these viewpoints and information will actually carry out the plans on the important dates they all talk about.

Which is exactly what happened on January Sixth.

The simplest solution is to limit the amount of people who can view and discuss these viewpoints and information as much as possible.


You might say that it's better to let them talk so that its easier to arrest them afterwards, but it's not really true. It's better to stop them from talking so openly, so that it doesn't happen as often.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Like, you are making an error in judgment in that you are not linking Parler and other platforms which tolerate these extreme right-wing views and the upsurge in right wing stochastic terrorism across America. You are not seeing that *people talking about it* actually makes what these people are talking about more likely to happen.

I agree with this. But I don't see how this followed from what I said either.

I don't disagree that right wing media ecospheres drums this discontent up.

I was saying that I doubt that half the GOP thinks what happened (the coup) was wrong.

________

An ABC poll says 56% of all Americans ant Trump removed immediately.

 

[caketastydelish]

I mean sure, we might need Republican defections to find Trump guilty in the upcoming senate trial, but what does that have to do with Parler?

Even half of the Republican party base thinks these guys are nuts.

Those as separate things, sorry if I made it sound like I was trying to equate them.

 

[Seon]

I agree with this. But I don't see how this followed from what I said either.

I don't disagree that right wing media ecospheres drums this discontent up.

I was saying that I doubt that half the GOP thinks what happened (the coup) was wrong.

________

An ABC poll says 56% of all Americans ant Trump removed immediately.

Not you. Cake. It was apparently a misunderstanding.

 

[caketastydelish]

Anyway, as for my opinion that Parler should be allowed to maintain functionality: my argument is these things will happen whether those platforms exist or not.

There was not really anything like Parler (or even the internet at all to the best of my knowledge) during much of the time that the IRA committed countless terrorist acts in Ireland, so these online platforms are hardly prerequisites for the attacks to occur. But they can make it exponentially easier for justice to be served.

 

[Arwon]

Like, you are making an error in judgment in that you are not linking Parler and other platforms which tolerate these extreme right-wing views and the upsurge in right wing stochastic terrorism across America. You are not seeing that *people talking about it* actually makes what these people are talking about more likely to happen.

In an age of mass but individualized media we find ourselves in, right wing extremists openly discuss important dates, enemies they want to kill, methodologies they want to employ, etc etc etc. Most of these people might be joking, but some of them are not. A certain percentage of people viewing and internalizing these viewpoints and information will actually carry out the plans on the important dates they all talk about.

Which is exactly what happened on January Sixth.

The simplest solution is to limit the amount of people who can view and discuss these viewpoints and information as much as possible.


You might say that it's better to let them talk so that its easier to arrest them afterwards, but it's not really true. It's better to stop them from talking so openly, so that it doesn't happen as often.

The New Zealand Royal Commission into the massacre in Christchurch explored the perpetrator's life, radicalisation, and online presence and behaviour in some detail. Definitely worth a read on the stochastic violence point.

 

[stinkubus]

Well the loons on YouTube are telling each other that Trump has signed some sort of Insurrection Act into law so I'm guessing we are going to see a repeat on inauguration day if not before.

 

[Seon]

Anyway, as for my opinion that Parler should be allowed to maintain functionality: my argument is these things will happen whether those platforms exist or not.

There was not really anything like Parler (or even the internet at all to the best of my knowledge) during much of the time that the IRA committed countless terrorist acts in Ireland, so these online platforms are hardly prerequisites for the attacks to occur. But they can make it exponentially easier for justice to be served.

my point is that these platforms actively increase the intensity and likelihood for these kind of terroristic attacks against our rights and democracy to occur.

Unlike stochastic terrorism, IRA were *organized.* These are lone wolves who give the *impression* they are organized because they happened to choose the same day to turn out en masse. The same day they knew was the day to act, because the date and the plans were being transmitted between each other through these platforms.

denying them access or making it difficult to reach people actively decreases intensity and likelihood of attacks in such a case, in a way it wouldn’t affect organized attackers like the IRA.

 

[caketastydelish]

They don't have an equavilent to the IRA right now because there's no necessity for it (from their point of view). Take away things like Parler and they will be inevitable. I'm only going off of what history actually tells us.

edit: but the IRA is barely a drop in the bucket next to everything else anyway. My larger point is there have been countless terrorist attacks committed for all kinds of causes all over the world before the internet.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I'm glad to hear you whole-heartedly support the removal of the GOP from office!

Make no mistake, I have no love for the GOP. Several of the abuses used by liberals in modern times have their origin in powers seized by alleged conservatives in the past.

One is an outcome of top-down oppression that was literally disregarded by the racist troll at the very top of the executive.
One is due to manufactured discontent by the same executive literally spreading falsehoods about the legitimacy of the process.

"People who agree with me are good and people who don't are bad".

If your standards don't apply to behaviors consistently, you don't have standards. These rioters walk, the summer rioters don't walk, or you toss aside coherent application of law. When you advocate against civil discourse, don't be surprised when those who disagree adopt the same approach.

The effect of the BLM protests, with regards to the degradation of a civil and liberal society, will be significantly less than this attempted usurpation by the Trump-wing of the political right. So, whataboutism might say more about what you're noticing than what the two events deserve in the course of comparing them.

Fake garbage. The only genuine attempts at degradation of liberty in this event by actual government officials are the clowns who have unironically suggested 25th amendment or 2nd impeachment. Claiming this meets the standards of "incitement" is...pathetic. The correct prosecution here is on the people who committed the violent crime, just like in summer (though they were released because reasons).

"BLM" are closer to the "terrorist" allegations than what happened in this incident. Some elements of "antifa" are actual terrorists.

 

[Paul in Saudi]

"BLM" are closer to the "terrorist" allegations than what happened in this incident. Some elements of "antifa" are actual terrorists.

Nonsense. The coup people are a much greater threat. But in the long run I do not care who they are. As long as they never set foot on a blade of grass or hear a bird sing every again I am happy.

 

[Kyriakos]

"cuz" is also slang for "cousin" or "friend"... its used kind of like saying "buddy"... and it actually works better that way in @Kyriakos' post.

I think Kyriakos used "cuz" to address Takhisis, exactly due to some knowledge of ebonics.

 

[Cutlass]

"BLM" are closer to the "terrorist" allegations than what happened in this incident. Some elements of "antifa" are actual terrorists.

Yeah, that's just lies.

 

[Takhisis]

I think Kyriakos used "cuz" to address Takhisis, exactly due to some knowledge of ebonics.

Don't go there.

 

[Estebonrober]

Make no mistake, I have no love for the GOP. Several of the abuses used by liberals in modern times have their origin in powers seized by alleged conservatives in the past.



"People who agree with me are good and people who don't are bad".

If your standards don't apply to behaviors consistently, you don't have standards. These rioters walk, the summer rioters don't walk, or you toss aside coherent application of law. When you advocate against civil discourse, don't be surprised when those who disagree adopt the same approach.



Fake garbage. The only genuine attempts at degradation of liberty in this event by actual government officials are the clowns who have unironically suggested 25th amendment or 2nd impeachment. Claiming this meets the standards of "incitement" is...pathetic. The correct prosecution here is on the people who committed the violent crime, just like in summer (though they were released because reasons).

"BLM" are closer to the "terrorist" allegations than what happened in this incident. Some elements of "antifa" are actual terrorists.

This post is indicative of why war is becoming unavoidable. I literally do not know how to reply to the level of aggrieved sentiment is in this post. BLM is fighting for justice, I still do not condone the criminal property damage. The capitol riot was trying to overthrow a fair election.

 

[caketastydelish]

Fake garbage. The only genuine attempts at degradation of liberty in this event by actual government officials are the clowns who have unironically suggested 25th amendment or 2nd impeachment. Claiming this meets the standards of "incitement" is...pathetic. The correct prosecution here is on the people who committed the violent crime, just like in summer (though they were released because reasons).

"BLM" are closer to the "terrorist" allegations than what happened in this incident. Some elements of "antifa" are actual terrorists.

I can't speak for others, but I have personally made it abundantly clear that I am consistent in this regard. But this particular event was absolutely terrorism. If you disagree with this, then your interpretation of the term is different than that of how it is defined by US law.

 

[Seon]

I don’t remember the BLM attempting to conduct an armed overthrow of the federal government, execute the Vice President and the House Speaker, and take members of congress and senate hostage but I guess to a fascist like TMIT a largely peaceful protest for racial equality is the equivalent to these things.

 

[IglooDame]

Well the loons on YouTube are telling each other that Trump has signed some sort of Insurrection Act into law so I'm guessing we are going to see a repeat on inauguration day if not before.

I think there's going to be a bit of "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" going on. I don't expect Inauguration Day to look like a Soviet military parade (or the equivalent that Trump so dearly wanted), but you can bet there won't be any selfies between rioters and police. That said, this time it won't be from Trump's winding people up and pointing them anywhere, both because he doesn't want to make impeachment more likely, and because he'll be in Scotland or someplace similarly out of angry trudging distance.

 

[Takhisis]

I don’t remember the BLM attempting to conduct an armed overthrow of the federal government, execute the Vice President and the House Speaker, and take members of congress and senate hostage but I guess to a fascist like TMIT a largely peaceful protest for racial equality is the equivalent to these things.

Please stop unwarrantedly calling people fascists just because they support the guys who complain about a Jewish international conspiracy and wear T-shirts with ‘Camp Auschwitz’ printed on them to public meetings. It devalues the word.

 

[Estebonrober]

Please stop unwarrantedly calling people fascists just because they support the guys who complain about a Jewish international conspiracy and wear T-shirts with ‘Camp Auschwitz’ printed on them to public meetings. It devalues the word.

We are all commies now! Biden4Life!