Why shouldn't the US intervene in Syria?

[Arachnofiend]

Oh, DAG, you meant that? You think our government listens to the people? Okay.

I rest my case. American teens are totally unaware of what is happening. Perhaps their parents will listen?

You seem to be giving the Baby Boomers too much credit. American Exceptionalism was their thing.

 

[ReindeerThistle]

No, parents of today's teens are my generation (generation X): Red State republicans in the 1980s, unabashed Radical Reds in the 21st Century.

Oh, maybe that's just me and my comrades.

 

[Arachnofiend]

Woops, missed the Baby Boomer deadline by five years. I always thought of the Gen Xers as people who were teens in the 90's but I guess not.

I couldn't even convince my parents that the Bomb was unnecessary but that may just be the Deep South upbringing talking. My fellow Millennials generally seem to have a deeper distrust for the current system than our parents, though we tend to distract ourselves from the depression with things, leaving us rather unwilling to turn red. >.>

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

Hahahahahahahaha!

Oh, DAG, you meant that? You think our government listens to the people? Okay.

I rest my case. American teens are totally unaware of what is happening. Perhaps their parents will listen

Again with the continued paternalistic stance. We understand quite well I believe. It doesn't matter though: unless you provide an actual argument your position doesn't change. Well it does, but opposite the direction you want it to go in.

Don't think my father would listen to any of your ramblings anyway. You guys always go on about about how age makes one smarter or something. Well he's older than you are. So does that mean everything he says is right?

As for Syria, there IS intervention. The US has funded and supplied the "opposition" and has openly declared it will continue. So, what was that about our government listening to the people?

According to polls the American public is split pretty evenly on intervention if the definition of intervention is "cruise missiles, nothing greater than that".

Following the line of reasoning that Americans are more supportive of intervention the more limited it is, a majority of Americans surely support supplying the rebels right?

 

[ReindeerThistle]

@DAG: how can you say the government listens to people and then say polls are split on cruise missiles as your counter to my argument that our government intervening without our consent.

Your father is probably right more often than you. However, he is not here to defend himself, so please do not bring him into it.

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

@DAG: how can you say the government listens to people and then say polls are split on cruise missiles as your counter to my argument that our government intervening without our consent.

I don't see any cruise missiles being fired at Syria.

Your father is probably right more often than you. However, he is not here to defend himself, so please do not bring him into it.

Theoretically he is right more often than you are too then. I brought it up to make point about how bringing up age at all is silly. Come on man.

 

[Traitorfish]

Self-interest makes you a bad guy? Woah man. Way to be judgmental.

You understand that condemning me as "judgemental" is itself a form of ethical judgement, don't you?

 

[ReindeerThistle]

@DAG: cruise missiles are not the only form of intervention. Try reading some news. NBC nightly news (you know, the GE network) reported last week that the US has continued assistance to the."opposition." That is intervention. Last week, 50 "CIA trained rebels" crossed from Jordan into Syria.

And your dad did one thing I will never do, and that makes him very brave: Raise a teenager.

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

You understand that condemning me as "judgemental" is itself a form of ethical judgement, don't you?

Unless you ignore the connotations of the word. Literally speaking, it is true and not a judgement.

judgemental-of or concerning the use of judgment.

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

@DAG: cruise missiles are not the only form of intervention. Try reading some news. NBC nightly news (you know, the GE network) reported last week that the US has continued assistance to the."opposition." That is intervention. Last week, 50 "CIA trained rebels" crossed from Jordan into Syria.

Okay, so? The American public is split when the amount of intervention is turned up to cruise missiles. And since the public is so split the government has not used cruise missiles.

So, what are you talking about?

 

[Traitorfish]

Unless you ignore the connotations of the word. Literally speaking, it is true and not a judgement.

I don't know what you're saying here. That ethical judgements can only be stated in non-literal language? That seems absurd on the face of it.

 

[Borachio]

You understand that condemning me as "judgemental" is itself a form of ethical judgement, don't you?

Yes. That occurred to me when I was condemned for being judgemental here, too. (I still don't think I was.)

Unfortunately, it's an infinite regression isn't it? So I didn't point it out.

Pointing out that condemnation for being judgemental is itself a form of ethical judgement, must itself be a form of ethical judgement. And so on.

Still, it's a bit tenuous, I'll admit. Since I don't want to be considered judgemental at all.

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

I don't know what you're saying here. That ethical judgements can only be stated in non-literal language? That seems absurd on the face of it.

No. My use of the word "judgemental" literally means you used judgement in your post.

EDIT: Oh, you're referring to the condemnation of judgement rather than my use of "judegemental"...?

Well, like Borachio said.

 

[ReindeerThistle]

Whereas judgement, I don't think, is something we can accuse DAG of exercising, so we're all good.

If I may defend TF, it is safe to say he comes from a principled, informed position. Again, so DAG is secure from this accusation as well.

Now, if we may get back to Syria...
The US training amd equipping troops IS intervention, that is my point.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

So...paternalism?

I didn't say I was going to do it for them.

I aim to convince them that they can do it for themselves. You asked if I thought I knew what was best for them. And I do. You did not ask if I was going to do what's best for them whether they like it or not.

This is opposed to the present way of things, where the small minority runs things for everyone, in their own interest. It boggles the mind how one could be even against paternalism in the face of such unashamed self-interest as the capitalist class shows for itself, and the utter disdain and disregard it shows for everyone else.

 

[Traitorfish]

Yes. That occurred to me when I was condemned for being judgemental here, too. (I still don't think I was.)

Unfortunately, it's an infinite regression isn't it? So I didn't point it out.

Pointing out that condemnation for being judgemental is itself a form of ethical judgement, must itself be a form of ethical judgement. And so on.

Still, it's a bit tenuous, I'll admit. Since I don't want to be considered judgemental at all.

You're right, sure enough. But what I think that tells us that ethical judgement is not, in itself, a bad thing. What we really object to is judgements made without considering things from other people's perspective, so when we say that somebody is "judgemental", what we mean is that they are "unfairly judgemental" or "unsympathetically judgemental".

Or, sometimes, we just mean "pointing out all the heinous stuff I do and/or say", but that doesn't really count as proper usage.