YnAMP sub-project: True location corresponding city names

[God of Kings]

Spoiler Espagne :

View attachment 462602

If England were to establish a city where Saint-Yves is, would it be named "Saint Ubes" or "Setúbal"?

 

[brick623]

If England were to establish a city where Saint-Yves is, would it be named "Saint Ubes" or "Setúbal"?

Saint Ubes.

Next GEM update will be to Germany, Alps, and Italy.

 

[FlashXAron]

Hi great Mod and enjoying it with "Play Europe Again"
Have seen now, you are starting with the Giant World Map also, which is my second prefered map I play ...
after playing it, most of the time I rename the cities to Countries and not city names, because it fits better to that map size, maybe that would be some possibility for your project also, as it feels more natural, as to have eg. "Paris" all over whole "France" or "London" over whole "England" ... as France, England, Scotland, Irland would fit better to the map size !

Thanks for your hard work ...

PS: Even think it is fewer work that way

 

[brick623]

Hi great Mod and enjoying it with "Play Europe Again"
Have seen now, you are starting with the Giant World Map also, which is my second prefered map I play ...
after playing it, most of the time I rename the cities to Countries and not city names, because it fits better to that map size, maybe that would be some possibility for your project also, as it feels more natural, as to have eg. "Paris" all over whole "France" or "London" over whole "England" ... as France, England, Scotland, Irland would fit better to the map size !

Thanks for your hard work ...

PS: Even think it is fewer work that way

Thanks @FlashXAron! However, I don't understand: on the G.E.M., England is big enough for around 2-4 cities and France 4-6 depending on the ruleset - do you mean you rename the cities on the smaller maps? You're right, it would be much less work!

Next update to GEM - Germany and Italy pull request submitted, screenshots:

Spoiler Neither Holy, nor Roman, nor an Empire :) :

Spoiler Northern Italia :

Spoiler Italia :

 

[tomaltachpaulson]

Pull request sent for Australia, New Zealand, and Papua city names for GEM:

Spoiler Australia :

Spoiler New Zealand :

Spoiler Papua :

In addition I have gone through the GamePlayText.xml and CityMap.xml (GEM) files and edited them so that the indents are consistent all the way through.

Next I will probably work on finishing the Roman names for Play Europe Again. This brings me to a point which I have been considering for a while, which is that because the GamePlayText.xml file is combined the translations for the last map on the list will overwrite the translations for all the maps prior. Theoretically this should be fine, as theoretically each city's translation should be identical on each map, but still it is something to keep in mind as we move forward.

 

[Gedemon]

Merged, and yes theoretically we only need one list in gameplay text, duplicates wont prevent the mod to work, it may just take a bit longer to initialize and yes, only the last entry will be used.

 

[tomaltachpaulson]

Merged, and yes theoretically we only need one list in gameplay text, duplicates wont prevent the mod to work, it may just take a bit longer to initialize and yes, only the last entry will be used.

Yes, I just though I ought to mention it. Also, I meant to say that I have some proposed changes to the three maps in the Australia/New Zealand area. The names I have coded in so far for the GEM will be fine with the changes (I included extra names for the affected tiles when I did it, so no alterations to the names will be required):

Spoiler GreatestEarth :

Propose to remove a few fictional mountains, and change the rivers to more closely resemble reality. Also propose to shift Piopiotahi south to a more accurate position which additionally makes space for Christchurch. Some changes to coastlines.

Spoiler GiantEarth :

Propose only minor changes; in Australia addition of Murray River and movement of two mountains closer to the coast where the main Great Dividing Range is. In New Zealand propose to add a little extra coastline, and shift one mountain south to make space for Westport.

Spoiler LargestEarth :

Propose to shift Lake Eyre a tile to the west, remove excess land on the Great Australian Bight and at Kangaroo Island, which would become the Yorke Peninsula by addition of one tile; shift outlet of the Murray-Darling River to the south slightly to make space for Adelaide; add two extra tiles to Tasmania; and add some extra land and mountains to New Zealand.

I'm not exactly sure of the process for carrying the changes out though. Will you do them yourself or is there some way for me to do them?

 

[Gedemon]

Thanks, I'll do it as I have other modifications to the maps waiting in the to do list.

I may wait a bit more for the Largest Earth, I'd like to know before if @Hormigas managed to edit it.

 

[brick623]

Just a heads up I'll be working on Eastern Europe for GEM map

 

[tomaltachpaulson]

I've just submitted a pull request for the Roman (and some Greek) city names in North Africa:

Spoiler Mauretania :

Spoiler Cyrenaica :

Spoiler Ægyptus :

I've also submitted a pull request for a typo that FlashXAron found in the Map.xml file for GiantEarth.

 

[brick623]

Pull request submitted for Eastern Europe, includes TSL fixes for Poland, Vilnius, Armagh, Preslav and the typos.

Spoiler Balkans :

Spoiler East Europe :

Spoiler Poland :

 

[Gedemon]

While testing the option to use only generic names (and wondering why it wasn't working), I've found out that some entries were replacing the Civ6 generic name by a specific name, for example:

<Replace Tag="LOC_CITY_NAME_ATHENS" Text="Athína" Language="en_US" />

I don't know how to correct that in a simple way, but it may raise again the discussion about using <Replace> instead of <Row>

 

[Gedemon]

ok, I think it's my own fault for a lack of precision here:

And yes, I'm curious about special characters, does the US version of the game handle it ? We started a French then a German table for names with those special characters and kept only normal characters in the <en_US> table. If there are no display problem, this may not be needed.

What I meant there was we wouldn't have to do this

<Replace Tag="LOC_CITY_NAME_ATHENS_GREECE" Text="Athina" Language="en_US" />
<Replace Tag="LOC_CITY_NAME_ATHENS_GREECE" Text="Athína" Language="fr_FR" />
<Replace Tag="LOC_CITY_NAME_ATHENS_GREECE" Text="Athína" Language="de_DE" />

for each language but could simply use directly this

<Replace Tag="LOC_CITY_NAME_ATHENS_GREECE" Text="Athína" Language="en_US" />

which would be used to all language

but all LOC_CITY_NAME_ without a specific civ extension (ie "generic" name like LOC_CITY_NAME_ATHENS) should be modern English (ie Athens), else I can't set an option to use generic name as there are no longer generic names, not even those set in the civ6 original files

 

[Gedemon]

I'm going to do a pass on GamePlayText.xml this WE, I'll try to reorganize name by regions, we don't need different entries for different map, as the last entry overwrites all the previous entries with the same name tag.

I'll keep <Replace> because this way we don't have to check in Civ6 files if a name already exists, but I'll try to remove duplicates and restore generic names (while adding the entry for the civ specific name that was used)

sorry for the misunderstanding...

 

[tomaltachpaulson]

@Gedemon, just recently I noticed a problem with the civ-specific naming, which is that generic names with Area="0" don't take precedence over specific names with the default Area="1", as they should do. For example the city shown below at 37, 47 should be Lausanne, the generic Area="0" name for that tile (as Lausanne is also the French name, there is no specific name for it). However, YnAMP has named it Bâle, the French civ-specific name for Basel, an Area="1" city centred on 38, 48 (see tooltip). As you can see, this problem undermines the whole basis of the system @rock_and_ride developed when we started with this project.

Spoiler The Problem :

As it so happens I first noticed this in a ongoing YouTube play-through on the Play Europe Again map, which is here. It is nice to see our progress has made it onto YouTube!

Finally, another thought. The main balance problem with YnAMP is obvious: the civilizations aren’t spaced evenly, and coupled with the size of the maps this leaves large empty areas. What if to solve this @Gedemon codes a feature that allows us to specify secondary starting locations for each civ, so that in remote areas there can be multiples of the one civ filling up the space. Take China, for example. If Beijing is the default starting location, then Guangzhou can be the secondary one, and maybe even Xi’an as a tertiary one. For Brazil, you have Brasília & Rio de Janeiro; for Russia, Moscow and St. Petersburg; for America, Washington and San Francisco, perhaps. I’ve no idea if this is possible, but if it is I think it could go a long way towards rebalancing.

 

[Gedemon]

@Gedemon, just recently I noticed a problem with the civ-specific naming, which is that generic names with Area="0" don't take precedence over specific names with the default Area="1", as they should do.

I'd like everyone input here, it's indeed actually coded so that specific names are prioritized over generic name, and I thought I had added this part of the code by request.

 

[tomaltachpaulson]

I'd like everyone input here, it's indeed actually coded so that specific names are prioritized over generic name, and I thought I had added this part of the code by request.

Hm, well I was under the impression that a specific name would only cover the same area as the generic name it replaced—certainly otherwise it makes for an awkward situation in my example, where to avoid Bâle being settled on Lake Geneva you would have to add an otherwise unnecessary French civ-specific name for Lausanne.

 

[Gedemon]

I'm not sure I understand, for me this

Hm, well I was under the impression that a specific name would only cover the same area as the generic name it replaced

is exactly what happens here:

However, YnAMP has named it Bâle, the French civ-specific name for Basel, an Area="1" city centred on 38, 48 (see tooltip)

as the code has used the same area as the generic name it replaced (Basel), with the difference that being specific it take priority in its area over generic names.

I can remove the priority for those specific names (I mean those set using the suffix method, those using the civilization tag in the city map would still give priority), but I'd like to know first if any of you can see issues with that method (as the next YnAMP update may be the last until the SDK is out)

 

[Gedemon]

Thebes in Greece can't be referenced by LOC_CITY_NAME_THEBES as it's already used for the Egyptian city.

We can't use _GREECE suffix.

So I've used a continental suffix: LOC_CITY_NAME_THEBES_EURO

Let me know if you come up with something better.

 

[Gedemon]

I've uploaded a new version on GitHub, with a reorganization of GamePlayText.xml (now sorted by area, no need to differentiate city names by map in that file), and fixed some (very few in fact, it was just bad luck that my example to test the "no civ-specific city name" option was Athens...) generic names that were replaced by a specific name.

edit:

and I got this in the lua.log, maybe some typos ?

YnAMP_Script: WARNING : no translation for LOC_CITY_NAME_WAKAYAMA
YnAMP_Script: WARNING : no translation for LOC_CITY_NAME_YOKOTE
YnAMP_Script: WARNING : no translation for LOC_CITY_NAME_DAXINGANLING