YOU'RE FIRED!

[metalhead]

Even those methods are under severe scrutiny. Not long ago in Philly, it took several cops to physically subdue a very large, uncooperative man. In the process, the very large man was brought to ground so he could be cuffed, but one cop used an apparently unauthorized choke hold in doing so and the man died. It was on video and there was nothing particularly brutal in evidence.

That was in NYC, and the key is "unauthorized" choke hold. It's unauthorized for a reason. He shouldn't have used the choke hold, full stop. He belongs in prison, not the unemployment line. That's the solution - put him in jail for homicide to deter cops from using unauthorized choke holds.

Very unfair, unless you are trained in threat assessment. Unarmed people can kill. Can you be quite certain the unarmed does not intend to harm you, or kill you. Do you think it is better to 'take the chance'? Suppose you are much smaller than the assailant? Suppose you're not sure if there is a concealed weapon? If you are willing to set the standard that cops should never meet a threat with a greater force, then so be it. Not sure how many people are willing to do that.

That's why nonlethal methods of incapacitation are the best option. If you assess a threat and cannot be sure, then you use means to incapacitate the suspect without killing him or her. If Darren Wilson legitimately feared for his life, then he should have other means besides killing Michael Brown with which to protect himself. It's a huge part of the problem that cops aren't trained to use other means of defending themselves.

There are few instances where you can be certain about anything. But that is exactly why there have to be more options for a fearful officer than pulling out their gun and shooting at the perceived threat. You'll never eliminate every instance of this happening, but that's why accountability is so important.

It's also worth noting, this is to protect the cops too. I doubt many of them do very well handling killings like this. I would imagine many of them would welcome tools to better de-escalate situations, use non-lethal force, and ultimately save lives.

 

[Lexicus]

I would imagine many of them would welcome tools to better de-escalate situations, use non-lethal force, and ultimately save lives.

You have to hope so, right? Since the alternative would be that we've entrusted a bunch of psychopaths with guns to protect us?

 

[Zkribbler]

You didn't even know the name of your source...

You were the one who claimed I am relying on a source you didn't bother to name. Admittedly my mind reading skills are weak, so how am I supposed to know who you're talking about? I have never said Wilson tried to choke Brown.

 

[Berzerker]

You were the one who claimed I am relying on a source you didn't bother to name. Admittedly my mind reading skills are weak, so how am I supposed to know who you're talking about? I have never said Wilson tried to choke Brown.

Which are you count as No 1? When Wilson slammed his door open into Brown and Jackson, and Brown push it back into Wilson, or when Wilson pulled his gun and Brown grabbed it to try to keep from being shot?

You named the source... Jackson? His name is Johnson, no biggie, but the guy's unreliable and I explained why. He said the door bounced off them and back into the cop. Then he said the cop grabbed Brown around the neck pulling him into the car resulting in the struggle for the gun. How does a 6'5" man standing outside a cop car get grabbed around the neck and pulled into it? Because he wasn't standing outside the car, he was reaching into the car after the cop got shoved back inside. He reached in and punched the cop and a struggle for the gun ensued.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Read an article today that states the real reason the Ravens didn't sign Kaepernick (they blamed it on his girlfriend making inflammatory remarks) was because some high ranking US Military officer advised them against it.

Seems like government suppression of his protest...

 

[Berzerker]

link doesn't work for me, but yes it would

I dont know the context, it could be considered advice as opposed to a warning or threat. Its one thing to tell someone they're about to make a mistake and another you will retaliate against them for the mistake.

 

[Commodore]

Yeah, link's not working for me either.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Sorry about that buddies. I re-posted the link but here it is again courtesy of the NY Daily News.

The Ravens did not sign Colin Kaepernick last year because a high-ranking member of the military raised concerns about bringing the polarizing QB to Baltimore, according to a report.

I actually saw this on another site (MSN) but I usually try to track down the actual source rather than taking just their word for it.

 

[Commodore]

Seems like a sticky situation at best. It seems like Harbaugh was just seeking the advice of his friends, one of which happened to be a high-ranking officer in the military. However, even though that officer may have only been giving that advice as a friend the fact that he is in the military, and thus considered a representative of the government, means he really can't give such advice without it potentially causing...issues.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Trump says policy allowing NFL players to wait in the locker room for the anthem is worse than not standing for the anthem

Bwahahahaha

Silly NFL owners... caved to appease Trump and the political correctness sensibilities of the special-snowflake Trump supporters... Only to find out that Trump's not satisfied, and he's telling his supporters not to be satisfied.

Almost like nothing will "satisfy" Trump... It won't. He doesn't actually want any resolution, since he thinks this is a great issue to rile up the resentments and animosities in his base.

 

[warpus]

What would the owners do if all black players always kneeled for the anthem? It's not like the league will shut down, they want their $$

It's just a silly anthem, nobody gives a crap. Stand, sit, lie down, who cares

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

What would the owners do if all black players always kneeled for the anthem? It's not like the league will shut down, they want their $$

It's just a silly anthem, nobody gives a crap. Stand, sit, lie down, who cares

No itsnt just a silly anthem. Songs and music inspire people. Inspiration can be often difference between succes and failure, progress and retirement or even life and death. To give a special significance to a particular piece of music and to hold it sacred helps to create proper attitude and environment for certain important advancement of society and improve its function.

 

[Zkribbler]

Unlike many nations, the U.S. Constitution does not state, protect, honour, or even acknowledge a flag, national anthem, motto, national animal or other such symbols, or state or imply that such symbolry are Constitutionally needed or desired.

The US does have a Flag Code. Much of it has been declared to be unconstitutional.
http://www.usflag.org/uscode36.html

 

[Zkribbler]

... to hold it sacred ...

Sacred? You're implying an official government religion centered on the flag.

 

[warpus]

No itsnt just a silly anthem.

I admit I was being over the top in order to make a point. It is not a sacred song. Each person can choose to take it in on their own terms.

Since it is an important song to many people, yes, be respectful, don't yell while it is being played. Don't try to turn it off. Don't give the middle finger to the person singing. Don't be disrespectful. Kneeling is not disrespectful.

Songs and music inspire people. Inspiration can be often difference between succes and failure, progress and retirement or even life and death. To give a special significance to a particular piece of music and to hold it sacred helps to create proper attitude and environment for certain important advancement of society and improve its function.

Okay, awesome, you can do so when this song is played and nobody will try to stop you. You can also complain when others are disrupting your enjoyment of these activities, and you would be within your right to do so as well.

The song is a symbol and it means different things to different people. Not everyone has to have the same interpretation and/or attachments to it as you.

 

[Berzerker]

Sacred? You're implying an official government religion centered on the flag.

and children better pledge their allegiance to it each school day or else

 

[JollyRoger]

No itsnt just a silly anthem. Songs and music inspire people. Inspiration can be often difference between succes and failure, progress and retirement or even life and death. To give a special significance to a particular piece of music and to hold it sacred helps to create proper attitude and environment for certain important advancement of society and improve its function.

Why a British pub tune should achieve such a place seems a bit silly to me.

 

[danjuno]

Battle Hymn of the Republic > Team America Theme > Lookin' Out My Backdoor by CCR > Nails Scraping on Chalkboard > Star-Spangled Banner

 

[Sommerswerd]

Battle Hymn of the Republic > Team America Theme > Lookin' Out My Backdoor by CCR > Nails Scraping on Chalkboard > Star-Spangled Banner

This is objectively wrong... For your consideration:

#1- Jimi Hendrix performs the Star Spangled time index 1:00, interspersed with his own guitar-created sounds of war, including warplanes, bombs dropping, machine guns, explosions, screams of the dying, etc, beginning at time index 2:09, then "Taps" as a tribute to the dead soldiers, inserted at time index 3:40... into a seamless transition into "Purple Haze" at time index 4:50... just EPIC beyond words.

Spoiler :

#2 - Whitney Houston, 1991 Superbowl, nuff said (time index 1:10):

Spoiler :

#3 - And finally, I give you, at time index 1:06:20 - 1:07:50 (sorry, I gave up trying to find a clip of just the song), from the movie Undisputed, Master P and the Cash Money Millionaires (of "Back That *Thang* Up" fame) performing their rendition of the United States National Anthem... absolute fi-yah!

Spoiler The movie is NSFW Obviously, but the song itself is fine :

Star Spangled Banner = FTW. Yes, yes it does.... Although I will admit that Whitney Houston's version of "Battle Hymn of the Republic" is pretty spectacular... as is any version of Ray Charles' "America the Beautiful"

 

[Oerdin]

All it is is a marketing tool. That is why the sports leagues have people stand and spend the time on that display. It is a business and it wanted to market itself as more than that pretending to be all American like mom, Apple pie, and the school prom. Well, that appealed to a certain group of people who became bog consumers of their entertainment product.

Now some players decided they wanted to use paid work time to undermine that effort by their employer. This alienated a lot of fans and the market doesn't care about stupid justifications. If employees aren't helping the bottom line then eventually employers are going to toss those nonperforming trouble making employees in the rubbish bin and rightly so. Most of them are poorly educated and unemployable outside the NFL at anything other than a menial job so I know who I think will buckle first.