ALC Game 22: Arabs/Saladin

[fjordan]

Definitly Archery before BW. Copper is very rare since the latest patch and barbs will be coming very soon. You just cannot risk it. Maybe a fortified warrior will win a battle or two but that is too big a gamble. Protective archers will take care of any job as well as an axeman except city raiding.

 

[ese-aSH]

Louis is one of the AI that gets the higher scores on my games. He builds many cities and grab a lot of land.
If you box him (with the magenta city esat of him) he may dow you very soon.

But this is no pb, as said in the 'leverage protective' thread thats one of the way to use your super-archer.
I would not try do put him down if I were you, just block him as far as you can and let him loose energy in military.
Your protective archers are unkillable before construction and cats, and the magenta & blue cities with 2 food ressources will be able to whip archer very often and defend themselve alone. You could build your empire beyond those cities and not fearing Louis' wrath.
And then once your done with early wonders / settling cities then build an offensive army and take him.

plus notice theres some land north west from the red city, if it happens to be an island get it first.

(letting Louis build wonders is not necesarly a problem, when the trebuchet/camel times comes they all will be yours)

 

[Daedal]

I vote for archery now while grabbing the marble city NW of the capitol. Are we still going to run an SE of some kind? We might want to risk going for the 'mids at some point soon then. Otherwise just tech toward the GL, expand westward, and take out Louis with swords/cats when those come around.

 

[Der Graf]

Louis has marble, and that could be a problem since he's Industrious. As I mentioned, he's also likely to snag the only nearby source of horses. I'm beginning to think he has to die. JIHAD!! As for Suleiman, I suspect he's off to the northwest somewhere--I mean, there aren't to many other possibilities.

Not "could", it will be a problem. Everytime this guy shows up in my games, I'm edging the blades asap because he is trouble. So Jihad sounds like a good plan to me
I'd say research bronze working to reveal the copper for this will surely affect the dotmaps. If Louis builds some wonders - well, fine. More to conquer for the Arab Empire

 

[Artichoker]

This is looking like a resource-poor map, at least on your side of it.


I highly suspect that the Western side of the continent will contain a greater quantity and variety of resources.

In that case, you would want to settle to the West to gain quick access to whatever resources lie in the western side of the continent.

 

[Froggie818]

Louis must die!

But not yet.

I agree - let him build his wonders while you build you army to take them. Go Hunting-->Archery to defend Mecca. Then BW (I'm willing to bet there's copper in them thar hills). Get a temple in the city for a little extra happiness. Then work towards Writing for the UB. From there, beeline to your UU and explain the way of the world to Louis.

As for settling, get the marble city and, maybe, the food city to the SE of Mecca. if Louis expands towards you, that's fine. Hopefully he'll be smart about placing the cities and, after you capture them, there'll be no need to rebuild them.

Just my two cents...which, adjusted for my own chieftain experience is really worth about half a cent.

 

[Chrispy]

Agree that Hunting would have been a preferable tech to Ag leading to AH, especially once you popped fishing. I agree with teching to Archery before BW. Do you want metal? Obviously, but you need guaranteed defense and protective archers fit perfectly.

Getting too close to Louis before you have writing will be a concern because Creative will crowd you out, and Industrious will only make subsequent pops worse. I'd also say that with Louis as Industrious with marble right there, the corn/marble site becomes a lower priority. You're not going to use the marble to build Oracle or ToA, so it can be settled later. Then again, it is the best production city available.

I think the city with the crab, pigs, and wheat should be a higher priority. I like settling N of the crab more than NW on the plains hill. With that much food available, you can afford to mine that hill and work it for production. I also think moving a little west and settling light blue makes sense. That's a good production site and isn't too close to Louis.

 

[Gooblah]

New resolution? Hell, I can't even see the screenshots!

Anyways, I'll agree with the majority about city placement.

 

[Artichoker]

The mountains and hills in the center of the map look pretty good to use as a chokepoint area, once you start building Archery units.

 

[King_of_Clubs]

Long time lurker here.

I believe going after Archery would be the best plan - after all, attacking a Creative Louis with Axes sounds like suicide; the main goal should be to defend the Arabian Empire from Barbarian Hordes.

As VoiceOfUnreason stated earlier, we should have gone for Hunting instead of Agriculture as our second technology, opening the path to both Animal Husbandry and Archery.... Oh, well.

Another high priority technology should be Writing for Madrassa (requires Pottery).

As for our next city, I would go for Validator's red city (OTAKUjbski's yellow), NW of Mecca. It looks like a good naval/production site, that also set's us up for a not-to-distant-future use of Marble.

 

[Morgawr]

Louis is not the friendliest AI, he's kind of bossy and demanding but it's actually not impossible to get on his good side. You can get
+5 from sharing religion
+4 from civics because his favorite civic is Hereditary Rule

That combined with open borders and prolonged peace will put him to friendly after you both have Monarcy and switch to HR. But until you get to that point, watch out because he's a big backstabber. Also don't piss him off by rejecting his demands because unlike most other AI's he gives a -2 instead of just -1 for refusing help.

 

[madscientist]

Congrats on founding the holy religion of Islam. I hope this motivates you for some nice Jihad work later on.

I would push to settle your western 2 cities on the dotmaps to block off Louis.

Tech order my vote is for hunting/archery/BW. Might as well leverage you protective trait for early defense. Then hit pottery/writing and get a Madrassa and some priests for a Prophet and shrine, uless there is no copper then go after IW. IF louis does what you think and founds a religion himself, I think Suliman will get that religion before Islam. So do not convert yet.

The land stinks, I would be preparing for an eventually conquest of French lands, post Guilds.

 

[madscientist]

Oh, one more thing. Forget early wonders. Save forrest chopping for the AP, and be prepared to bulb theology with the second Prophet, maybe even the first for the theocracy civic.

 

[Roxlimn]

Great map! Very, very food rich. Just the kind of map for leveraging a Spec-rich Madrassa.

OTAKU's red and yellow cities would be my choice for primary expansion sites. Red will be a military city, uniquely positioned and suited to keeping Louis at bay. Yellow city will be a production city for Worker sourcing, some military production, and Coastal Trade Route city. Cyan seems best suited for wonder hunting, with good productivity and lots of Forests.

There's a site on Mecca's SE that's got me rather giddy. You can snag Pigs, Clams, Crabs, and 2 Silk in the same city! Early on, the Silks can justify the cost of settling, then use the 3 food sites and Farms to grow it as far as possible. Overlapping some city sites is doable on a map with food this rich.

 

[Tyrant Roger]

Decisions, decisions. The choice between archery and BW is a big one. If you find bronze - and there is lots of space for it to pop - then you are safe from barbs and can ignore hunting and archery until much later. But those same open spaces make it likely that the barbs will be out if force very soon.

I think Louis must go, but I think you should wait for cats. Taking down creative civs without cats can be very expensive and painful. But with cats you can borrow the wonders he will sure build for you.

Meanwhile Islam needs to spread to Louis and the Turks. Then we might have a happy world until we DOW Louis of course.

 

[TM Moot]

I'd go for Hunting > Archery > Bronze Working.

Long(er) term aims - try to spread Islam and sod colonising the duff part of the continent, just found enough cities to produce a sufficient army so we can steamroll the Frenchie.

 

[Artichoker]

BW first, to see whether there is Copper...don't forget, Hammers are important as well.

With Copper, then Pottery, Writing...

Without Copper, then Hunting, Archery, Pottery, Writing...

 

[Kev]

I would go with hunting/archery first off. Getting protective archers up and running for escorts and defense will be well worth it, and it seems that most agree that taking on the creative Louis early will be difficult - especially if he comes through with a few wonders to further increase the cultural defense figure. So given no super-pressing need for early city raiders, chopping (assuming we're not out to get early wonders), or whipping, BW could easily wait until hunting/archery are done.

Keep in mind that in order to make use of the copper (if not in the capital BFC), you'd need a settler and then have to mine it and road it and then protect it as well.

With some protective archers, I'd be tempted to set up a few near Louie's land in an effort to snag some workers. I think a lot depends on whether you are on a continent of three or if there might be more out there. If it's only the three of you, it might make more sense to spread the common religion to be able to utilize your neighbors for tech trades.

 

[Artichoker]

I would go with hunting/archery first off. Getting protective archers up and running for escorts and defense will be well worth it, and it seems that most agree that taking on the creative Louis early will be difficult - especially if he comes through with a few wonders to further increase the cultural defense figure. So given no super-pressing need for early city raiders, chopping (assuming we're not out to get early wonders), or whipping, BW could easily wait until hunting/archery are done.

With some protective archers, I'd be tempted to set up a few near Louie's land in an effort to snag some workers. I think a lot depends on whether you are on a continent of three or if there might be more out there. If it's only the three of you, it might make more sense to spread the common religion to be able to utilize your neighbors for tech trades.

But I'd get BW for the prospect of some high-production tiles.

This map is high-food, no question, but a bit lacking on production tiles...unless BW reveals that there are some that are available.

The next Settler will come out soon, no question, so we need to find some good production city sites.

 

[Kev]

But I'd get BW for the prospect of some high-production tiles.

This map is high-food, no question, but a bit lacking on production tiles...unless BW reveals that there are some that are available.

The next Settler will come out soon, no question, so we need to find some good production city sites.

Copper is still pretty rare, and if not in the capital's BFC you would still need a settler and the time to mine the tile (not to mention if that city needs to be placed in a spot where a culture-bump is necessary) in order to benefit from copper's increased production.

We can probably get hunting/archery then to BW while building a worker/archer - or two - and settler, and by the time the settler pops we would know the copper situation. We can still mine unforested hills for extra production right now.

Not saying delay BW any longer than hunt/arch - just good to be able to build resource-less units with great free promotions early to hedge against barbs and to be key city/improvement defenders and settler escorts.