ALC Game #22 Take 2: Arabs/Saladin

[Sisiutil]

how come there is a barbarian city on one of the pictures which subsequently disappeared?

Mea culpa! Someone else spotted that too and PM'd me.

I recall missing an opportunity to whip at one point, so I went back a couple of auto-saves so I could. I believe the barb city appeared in the first run-through, from which I kept the screenshot, and not the second. Embarrassing, to say the least, but to be honest, I do reloads sometimes when I make a silly mistake like that. I'll do the calculation, plan on whipping in a turn or two, then something happens to distract me and I forget. So I sometimes reload, and usually it doesn't come back to bite me on the butt. This time it did!

 

[DanF5771]

Mea culpa!
I went back a couple of auto-saves

no worries - we only want to learn from mistakes that have some sort of educational value.

but what split the river? any message that a GP named "Moses" had been born yet?

 

[Froggie818]

no worries - we only want to learn from mistakes that have some sort of educational value.

but what split the river? any message that a GP named "Moses" had been born yet?

Perhaps (and I say perhaps because, as is my usual disclaimer, I'm only playing at warlord level) when the barb city was there (in the original time line), the placement of the city "connected" the two rivers...? Maybe it always was two rivers until the barb city was placed there. Since there was no barb city in the new, alternative timeline, the rivers remained separated???

 

[Jet]

That's not it, OTAKU "Oliver Stone" jbski's screenshot collage shows the river connected in 3750 BC.

But since you mention alternative timelines, I do like the theory of some kind of time travel paradox.

 

[DanF5771]

original time line // alternative timeline

the future barb city should not be able to alter the terrain features of the past

also: when abusively going back to autosaves (without having a CONSTANT) one should periodically check his nose (it might start to bleed)

btw: my name is Daniel Faraday - I'm here to rescue you.

 

[Sisiutil]

Perhaps (and I say perhaps because, as is my usual disclaimer, I'm only playing at warlord level) when the barb city was there (in the original time line), the placement of the city "connected" the two rivers...? Maybe it always was two rivers until the barb city was placed there. Since there was no barb city in the new, alternative timeline, the rivers remained separated???

Well, crud. Mea culpa, mea culpa.

Okay, this is embarrassing, but I went back and looked at my saves and autosaves, and figured out what what I did.

I was tired last night and a bit frustrated by Zara's cultural pressure, so in a moment of weakness, I did go in to WB and erase that barb city.

Then a couple of turns later I thought, "you can't do that, this is an ALC!" So I went back to an earlier save where the city was there.

Then the missed opportunity to whip happened, and I went back to a save...where I had erased the city, and played from there. Bad Sisiutil, Bad boy!

My apologies to everyone. I thought I had corrected my moment of weakness, but only made it worse!

What I'm going to do is go back and replay the round as honestly as I can, post it again, and we'll play from there.

To prevent a similar moment of weakness in the future, as EEE_BOY suggested, I'll play the ALCs with "lock modified assets" on from now on.

 

[Bandobras Took]

I'm shocked!

And vastly amused.

 

[Fetch]

Perhaps (and I say perhaps because, as is my usual disclaimer, I'm only playing at warlord level) when the barb city was there (in the original time line), the placement of the city "connected" the two rivers...? Maybe it always was two rivers until the barb city was placed there. Since there was no barb city in the new, alternative timeline, the rivers remained separated???

Yes, I think Sisiutil created a whole new 1985. Where there were 2 rivers and Biff was rich.

 

[Froggie818]

That's not it, OTAKU "Oliver Stone" jbski's screenshot collage shows the river connected in 3750 BC.

But since you mention alternative timelines, I do like the theory of some kind of time travel paradox.

Something freaky with the save, then, maybe? When he reloaded the autosave, his computer (which, unbeknownst to him, is beginning to develop self-awareness) couldn't find it. Fortunately, it had a rough idea what everything looked like in the save, so it just recreated it with WB. One of the corrections it made was to remove the barb city and, by extension, disconnected the river.....

Hmmm...look slike it's after lunchtime and I haven't eaten yet...that would explain the lightheadedness and the delusions.....


On a slightly more serious note, it's not possible that a random event did this, is it? Obviously, we know that forests, for example, grow sometimes within cultural borders, or that sometimes a weird resource (jade or, I think, turtle eggs) gets discovered in a random event, which changes the output of a tile in your borders. Do these events take place outside of cultural borders as well and we just never see them because, well, they're outside the borders? Say and event like, "A family of beavers has built a dam across the nearby river. Gain access to fur, but lose your trade connection with all cities downstream." or some such....

\Insert usual disclaimer here.

 

[whakamole]

If you keep messing with the space-time continuum, you might have to deal with anachronisms... like fighting French crossbows with a sword army.

Wait, that was last game.

 

[Quotey]

but what split the river? any message that a GP named "Moses" had been born yet?

So it wasn't the messiah, it was a very naughty boy! Don't worry, Sisiutil, we'll still read your posts.

Thinking about it, the wall trick does seem exploity (placing bets on Sisiutil not doing it in the replay) but I'm just gonna cite it as a Protective trait use to feel better about cheating in my games. Take that, morality.

 

[Fetch]

Well, crud. Mea culpa, mea culpa.

Okay, this is embarrassing, but I went back and looked at my saves and autosaves, and figured out what what I did.

I was tired last night and a bit frustrated by Zara's cultural pressure, so in a moment of weakness, I did go in to WB and erase that barb city.

Then a couple of turns later I thought, "you can't do that, this is an ALC!" So I went back to an earlier save where the city was there.

Then the missed opportunity to whip happened, and I went back to a save...where I had erased the city, and played from there. Bad Sisiutil, Bad boy!

My apologies to everyone. I thought I had corrected my moment of weakness, but only made it worse!

What I'm going to do is go back and replay the round as honestly as I can, post it again, and we'll play from there.

To prevent a similar moment of weakness in the future, as EEE_BOY suggested, I'll play the ALCs with "lock modified assets" on from now on.

That would make it more difficult to check for certain strategic resources/not isolated. But I understand why you do. IIRC we had a problem with this in one of the 1st ALC games-- someone went into WB and posted some spoilers.

Edit: but seriously, it kinda make me feel good that Sis (who's waaaay better at Civ than I'll ever be) will use the ol' Ctrl + W to take care of business too. I use it when I'm frustrated. I'll admit it.

Oh, and how did you generate the 1.21 jigawatts? You haven't researched (Mr.) Fusion yet, have you?

 

[Froggie818]

Well, crud. Mea culpa, mea culpa.

Okay, this is embarrassing, but I went back and looked at my saves and autosaves, and figured out what what I did.

I was tired last night and a bit frustrated by Zara's cultural pressure, so in a moment of weakness, I did go in to WB and erase that barb city.

Then a couple of turns later I thought, "you can't do that, this is an ALC!" So I went back to an earlier save where the city was there.

Then the missed opportunity to whip happened, and I went back to a save...where I had erased the city, and played from there. Bad Sisiutil, Bad boy!

My apologies to everyone. I thought I had corrected my moment of weakness, but only made it worse!

What I'm going to do is go back and replay the round as honestly as I can, post it again, and we'll play from there.

To prevent a similar moment of weakness in the future, as EEE_BOY suggested, I'll play the ALCs with "lock modified assets" on from now on.

Yup, sounds like a time travel paradox to me...

 

[Lord Chambers]

OVERFLOW EXPLOITATION!

But worldbuilder it up baby.

 

[Winston Hughes]

Leaving the river broken and posting screenies with the barb city clearly visible? You wouldn't make much of a criminal mastermind, Sis. Best to stay on the right side of the law, methinks.

ps. If you're going to replay the round, will you settle Baghdad in the same spot?

 

[OTAKUjbski]

@ Sisiutil: Next time do it manually by removing the city, ruins and road individually so nobody can tell, lol.

... I'll play the ALCs with "lock modified assets" on from now on.

That would make it more difficult to check for certain strategic resources/not isolated.

I always figured "lock modified assets" was turned off so we (the general public) could load the saves.

I have hella problems loading locked games because of the various patches and mods I've applied (I think the BUG mod does that).

That's kinda disappointing to hear ...

 

[WTBCzero]

Surely, if you went into worldbuilder, you would have a general idea of the layout of the map? You might not know the civs you're playing against, but you might know (for example) there's a Island in the north and another the East, or that you're in the north or south part of the map. Then when you get optics, you're send your ships in the vague direction of other landmasses.


And you'll be able to see if you starting position has vital resources, like oil or uranium.


Edit, to poster below: But did he do that, and doesn't worldbuilder zoom out when you go into it? (a bit a least)



And I haven't gone into worldbuilder, by the way, so i don't know the layout of the map. My examples are just that, examples.

 

[OTAKUjbski]

Surely, if you went into worldbuilder, you would have a general idea of the layout of the map? ...

If that information is accurate, you might want to delete it ...

There is such a thing as zooming in to the target location before opening WB.

It's a habit I have when playing god, so I think it's safe to assume the S man probably does it too during his moments of weakness.

I.e., there's no guarantee he knows anything about anything!

Then the missed opportunity to whip happened, and I went back to a save ...

You need the BUG mod.

Alt + M =

 

[Kev]

If nothing else - it does not seem as if that barb city is in all that bad of a place. It does get the copper after a border pop - also has more food then the city settled to take it in the original effort.... Just a thought - and perhaps you could place the Jumbo city one to the NW to get the corn in that case...

 

[Sisiutil]

Edit: but seriously, it kinda make me feel good that Sis (who's waaaay better at Civ than I'll ever be) will use the ol' Ctrl + W to take care of business too. I use it when I'm frustrated. I'll admit it.

Oh, and how did you generate the 1.21 jigawatts? You haven't researched (Mr.) Fusion yet, have you?

I rarely go into Worldbuilder, but sometimes, yeah. Usually it's to fix a "mouseographical error"--such as giving a Chariot the Combat II rather than the Medic I promotion so he can become a MASH unit later on.

It's rare for me to get frustrated and to use WB to modify the map, but I'm human.

@ Sisiutil: Next time do it manually by removing the city, ruins and road individually so nobody can tell, lol.

This is how you can tell I don't usually do this: I suck at it!

I always figured "lock modified assets" was turned off so we (the general public) could load the saves.

Thanks for refreshing my memory, I seem to recall this being discussed in a previous ALC game or in the bullpen and this was the issue. Seems I'll have to be stronger and resist temptation on my own. Better get out the ol' hairshirt and the whips...

Surely, if you went into worldbuilder, you would have a general idea of the layout of the map? You might not know the civs you're playing against, but you might know (for example) there's a Island in the north and another the East, or that you're in the north or south part of the map. Then when you get optics, you're send your ships in the vague direction of other landmasses.

On the few occassions I go into WB to fix those "mouseographical errors" I mentioned above, I do this contortionist thing where I zoom in as tight as I can on the unit/tile in question to avoid seeing things I don't know yet, then cross my left hand over to cover the minimap, do the correction, and get the heck outta Dodge. So no, I didn't see anything revealing this time. And I'll be founding Baghdad in the same spot, to try to play honestly, as I said.