Altered Maps V: The Molotov-Threadentropp Pact

[gangleri2001]

Try and stop us

As you wish:

Spoiler :

 

[Kyriakos]

If they want to be part of the EU and thus a part of the Western civilization they should try to remove the most obvious cultural obstacles. Cyrillic is definitely an obstacle to communication and free flow of ideas.

Plus, it's already ridiculous that Greek alphabet is used on Euro bills, although it's used just by two small EU member states.

Really, and i guess you will get to decide what is used
The greek alphabet is the alphabet of the only nation that created the culture that later on became pan-european. Of course it is an honour for the EU to have greek letters in its coins.
Today Greece may not be the strongest country in the EU, but the greek language still is by far superior to any other

 

[RedRalph]

Why not? They did it in Romania and Turkey. The only countries I would expect to not completely adopt it would be Russia and Ukraine.

I think my way is the best way, teach both alphabets in school, so if they want, they can continue using their primitive alphabet in everyday life, but when it comes to Business and dealing with the West/Westerners, they have the ability to use Latin Alphabet.

Primative? actually its newer than the Latin one, and with a shorter alphabet to boot.

 

[Winner]

Really, and i guess you will get to decide what is used
The greek alphabet is the alphabet of the only nation that created the culture that later on became pan-european. Of course it is an honour for the EU to have greek letters in its coins.
Today Greece may not be the strongest country in the EU, but the greek language still is by far superior to any other

If you wish to believe that, it's your problem AFAIK most Europeans see today's Greece as something very different from the Ancient Greece which laid the foundations of the Roman and later Western civilizations (and rightly so).

But that's besides the point here - I see no reason to overly accommodate every national peculiarity - crushing majority of EU citizens/inhabitants of the Eurozone use Latin script. Greek already is one of the official languages in the EU, so why the heck should there be Greek written also on the Euro bills? Should we also use bilingual signs all over Europe so that every tiny minority is fully satisfied?

It makes no sense to me, it's just an unnecessary complication and a bad precedent - as if the insane number of languages in the EU wasn't enough of a problem already, now we'll make our currency look like a dictionary.

 

[RedRalph]

Winner, I'm all for cultural homogenity but what serious objection can you possibly have to having a few letters in Greek on a banknote? what practical problem does this present to anyone? who cares?

 

[Godwynn]

We should just compromise and use Runes.

 

[Winner]

Winner, I'm all for cultural homogenity but what serious objection can you possibly have to having a few letters in Greek on a banknote? what practical problem does this present to anyone? who cares?

Bad precedent/unnecessary complication. Bulgarians will surely demand to include Cyrillic when they adopt the Euro, and if at some point in the future Georgia or Armenia join, will we include their alphabets too?

I will not riot over this It's just a bad idea, imo.

 

[Heretic_Cata]

Bad precedent/unnecessary complication. Bulgarians will surely demand to include Cyrillic when they adopt the Euro, and if at some point in the future Georgia or Armenia join, will we include their alphabets too?

I will not riot over this It's just a bad idea, imo.

lol bulgarians. Who listenes to them anyway ? At least greek letters are used in math and stuff.

 

[Kyriakos]

If you wish to believe that, it's your problem AFAIK most Europeans see today's Greece as something very different from the Ancient Greece which laid the foundations of the Roman and later Western civilizations (and rightly so).

But that's besides the point here - I see no reason to overly accommodate every national peculiarity - crushing majority of EU citizens/inhabitants of the Eurozone use Latin script. Greek already is one of the official languages in the EU, so why the heck should there be Greek written also on the Euro bills? Should we also use bilingual signs all over Europe so that every tiny minority is fully satisfied?

It makes no sense to me, it's just an unnecessary complication and a bad precedent - as if the insane number of languages in the EU wasn't enough of a problem already, now we'll make our currency look like a dictionary.

Dont really see your argument there. Obviously ancient greeks used the same alphabet as well, so even if you see it your little way the point still stands.

And to answer your later post: what would be so bad if cyrillic also was included? Do you see it as an inferior alphabet? At least the slavs got an alphabet made for them, by st Cyril and Methodius, which is more than one can say about the western slav latin alphabet which was adopted like your favourite Turkey also did

 

[Lone Wolf]

The inconvenience involved in changing the script for natives > the inconvenience for those who want to learn the language. If the natives desire to change the language themselves - let them do it.

If Russian tomorrow becomes Latinized, reading anything Russian written in the new script will be real torture for me personally.

 

[Winner]

Dont really see your argument there. Obviously ancient greeks used the same alphabet as well, so even if you see it your little way the point still stands.

And to answer your later post: what would be so bad if cyrillic also was included? Do you see it as an inferior alphabet? At least the slavs got an alphabet made for them, by st Cyril and Methodius, which is more than one can say about the western slav latin alphabet which was adopted like your favourite Turkey also did

I really don't see why you're bringing petty nationalism into this Just FYI, Cyril and Methodius created this alphabet (not really Cyrillic, but it's precursor) while on mission in Great Moravia - present day Czech Rep. and Slovakia. It tells a lot that we later decided that the script was unsuitable and unnecessarily distant from the script used by neighboring countries.

It's not about some "superiority", it's simply about practicality. In some things, variety is good (food, art), in others variety is a complication and impediment. We already have tons of different languages, so at least we should use a single alphabet, just as we use single system of measurement (the metric system).

The inconvenience involved in changing the script for natives > the inconvenience for those who want to learn the language. If the natives desire to change the language themselves - let them do it.

If Russian tomorrow becomes Latinized, reading anything Russian written in the new script will be real torture for me personally.

That's why a transitional period should be used.

 

[Kyriakos]

Wait, i thought this was just about the euro coins. Are you suggesting that all european countries adopt the latin alphabet?

Not that it is at all likely that it will happen (i mean adopting it) but do you realise that such a move would effectively ruin the literature of those countries? Not all alphabets have even the same number of letters...
Also it would simply be unthinkable for Greece to use the latin alphabet, of course not out of some "nationalism" (sic) as you put it (after all according to Wiki the latin alphabet was brought to Italy by greek colonists) but because it would ruin a very serious connection to the ancient Greece. Same goes, i expect, for other countries, such as Russia.

 

[Lone Wolf]

That's why a transitional period should be used.

That would still be an unconvenience for the native country which isn't worth a slightly easier time for learning the native language.

 

[RedAlert]

Altered Threads V: The Molotov-Scriptentropp Jack

Looks like Mexican Louisiana is a replacement for Texas and California in your time line.

Call it New England or something. I live in the CSA according to your map and that's horrible.

I thought I'd turn the tables there.
Ok, truth is I couldn't think of a better name.... yes, there's New England, but that seems a little too...
pro-England.

 

[Kyriakos]

Greek and Phoenician colonization

 

[gangleri2001]

We should just compromise and use Runes.

Agree. I think that germanic languages should use their own alphabet and not ours. Latinitas per semper!!

 

[Winner]

Wait, i thought this was just about the euro coins. Are you suggesting that all european countries adopt the latin alphabet?

Not that it is at all likely that it will happen (i mean adopting it) but do you realise that such a move would effectively ruin the literature of those countries? Not all alphabets have even the same number of letters...
Also it would simply be unthinkable for Greece to use the latin alphabet, of course not out of some "nationalism" (sic) as you put it (after all according to Wiki the latin alphabet was brought to Italy by greek colonists) but because it would ruin a very serious connection to the ancient Greece. Same goes, i expect, for other countries, such as Russia.

Very serious connection, right

It doesn't have to abandoned completely, but both should be used in public places, administration, media etc.

 

[Chieftess]

Moderator Action: More pictures, less talk please.

 

[Kyriakos]

Very serious connection, right

Is not having the same language a very serious connection in your view?
Try reading, for example, a byzantine text. Oh that's right, you can't. Well i can
Even homeric epics have many identical words with greek used today.

 

[Winner]

Is not having the same language a very serious connection in your view?
Try reading a byzantine text. Oh that's right, you can't. Well i can

So what?

Ancient Greece is about as close to modern-day Greece as Achaemenid Persia is to modern-day Iran. It was a different civilization on which modern Greece is loosely based, just like the rest of Europe. You seem to be claiming some sort of exceptional connection with it, which is ridiculous.

--- Anyway, this is a wrong thread for such discussion.