Alternative Map during 1.18

[BaneFire]

Where do these units come from? Roman invasion event? Or just their regular army?

I think because Rome has a land border to the rest of their empire, they are culminated units from all of their conquest events across the Med.

The Egypt only units, which was 3x stacks of 4 legions and 4 ballistas, was just manageable with unit spam to counter them.

 

[Orbii]

I think because Rome has a land border to the rest of their empire, they are culminated units from all of their conquest events across the Med.

The Egypt only units, which was 3x stacks of 4 legions and 4 ballistas, was just manageable with unit spam to counter them.

In my Byzantine game, I had the same experience with the Seljuq and Mongol conquerors. They each get stacks against you, which are manageable, then a few turns later their accumulated death stacks from their conqueror spawns against Mesopotamia/Persia/Central Asia roll up and you're looking at absolutely massive numbers.

 

[BaneFire]

I don't think Yunnan should be in the China flip zone, it was never a core part of Chinese dynasties and had to be conquered by the Ming, Qing.

 

[SOVNARKOM]

I think that after becoming Austria-Hungary, the Holy Roman should still be able to remain the historical area of Mozambique, which is belongs to Austria's own colonial attempt and took place in the 18th century.
Furthermore, can Prussia acquire its former colonies during the Brandenburg-Prussian period (Brandenburg Gold Coast, St. Thomas Islands, and Arguin) as its history areas? Perhaps if these colonies were under the control of Holy Rome at the birth of Prussia, they should also have been included in Prussia flipped area(Obviously, Prussia had no reason to leave its colonies to Austria)

 

[DragonWings]

I would suggest adding the Canary islands to the roman historical area, because they had presence there for the extraction of purple dye.
They built purple factories there that were found in archeological diggings, and its even possible that they had full settlements there.
The islands were known to mediterranean civs for a very long time, the phoenicians and greeks knew of them, and that knowledge was later used by the romans.
Also, the islands were strategically important to the empire as they were near important trade routes.

 

[DragonWings]

Hi, i wanted to point out that recent studies reveal that the norse were the first to reach and settle the Azoras.
Maybe they could be part of the Norse historical area, just how Vinland is.

 

[TsimTsigal]

How about we don't include every area that was inhabitated at some point by respective civilizations as historical?

It's completely unimportant for gameplay if, say, Poland has a historical tile in Africa, because AI will never settle here and a human will do it only for meme roleplay for which historical area doesn't really matter. Neither do historical areas cover all historical lands of civilizations.

Gonna be blunt but it's a bit tiresome to see all these posts about changing 1-2 tiles on stability map for sake of it.

 

[Gen1_]

If, say, Poland has a historical tile in Africa, because AI will never settle here and a human will do it only for meme roleplay for which historical area doesn't really matter. Neither do historical areas cover all historical lands of civilizations.

Poland has Gambia as historical area, but it is also on their Settler Map. So AI will settle here, except if Mali does before (which happens often, at least in 1.17)/

 

[trevor]

Hi, i wanted to point out that recent studies reveal that the norse were the first to reach and settle the Azoras.
Maybe they could be part of the Norse historical area, just how Vinland is.

Seems to me that an area that was briefly occupied by a group of people then abandoned is pretty well represented by "foreign area" tiles.

 

[AOS9001]

For me, historical area seems to mean that this civ occupied this land for long period of time. China and the Tarim Basin for example (Han and Tang), or Russia and Central Asia (Imperial period and USSR). Conquest area means a place where the civ had presence from time to time but never held for great lengths, like the Romans in Mesopotamia, or Brazil in Guyana (they actually did occupy French Guyana for a period during the Napoleonic war). So an ephemeral Austrian presence in Mozambique might be best as a conquest zone, but I wouldn't call it a priority fix.

 

[DragonWings]

How about we don't include every area that was inhabitated at some point by respective civilizations as historical?

It's completely unimportant for gameplay if, say, Poland has a historical tile in Africa, because AI will never settle here and a human will do it only for meme roleplay for which historical area doesn't really matter. Neither do historical areas cover all historical lands of civilizations.

Gonna be blunt but it's a bit tiresome to see all these posts about changing 1-2 tiles on stability map for sake of it.

Seems to me that an area that was briefly occupied by a group of people then abandoned is pretty well represented by "foreign area" tiles.

But such bold expeditions are what sets the boundaries for humanity.
Look at Vinland: Inhabited by the Norse for only 30 years, and yet it has a large historical area.
It could have been considered foreign too, since the native americans drove them out.
But its justified because history in general isnt just about the magnitude of the event, but rather the precedent it sets.
So if you settle even briefly, a territory that was previously unknown to humanity, i think that it does deserve recognition.
Besides, many such cases are already represented in the mod in various ways, so it should'nt be much different.
Of course, its not a priority anyways, and i just brought up an idea i thought was cool...

 

[trexeric]

Look at Vinland: Inhabited by the Norse for only 30 years, and yet it has a large historical area.
It could have been considered foreign too, since the native americans drove them out.

I don't really have a take on how briefly settled areas should be counted in the stability maps, but on this note, maybe there should be more barbarian/native pressure on Vinland when it's settled in time for the UHV.

 

[TsimTsigal]

I don't really have a take on how briefly settled areas should be counted in the stability maps, but on this note, maybe there should be more barbarian/native pressure on Vinland when it's settled in time for the UHV.

I settled on Cuba in my Viking UHV run, exactly to not care about barbs.

 

[trexeric]

I settled on Cuba in my Viking UHV run, exactly to not care about barbs.

If only Karlsefni would have had such foresight!

But yeah if it's already a thing then that's good, I just remember not worrying about barbs much last time I played the Vikings in 1.17.

 

[Genghis Khaiser]

Isn't the Principality of Antioch established by the Normans? They mainly come from the Kingdom of Norman Sicily, and the Vikings are clearly the best representative of them

Kinda makes sense. Sicily was an Italian kingdom established by the descendants of Vikings so I'd make Antioch also an Italy and/or HRE thing.

 

[SOVNARKOM]

Kinda makes sense. Sicily was an Italian kingdom established by the descendants of Vikings so I'd make Antioch also an Italy and/or HRE thing.

The Near East is currently conquest areas of HRE and Italy (I speculate this may indicate the Maritime Republic and the German Crusaders)

 

[banzay13]

But yeah if it's already a thing then that's good, I just remember not worrying about barbs much last time I played the Vikings in 1.17.

As I remember, Vinland separate with impossible tile in 1.17 so barbs not a problem.

 

[SOVNARKOM]

Can we add the Oman region to Iran as their conquest areas? The Afsharid dynasty of Nader Shah briefly controlled there.

The territory of the Afshar dynasty:

 

[lethrgy]

Can we add the Oman region to Iran as their conquest areas? The Afsharid dynasty of Nader Shah briefly controlled there.

The territory of the Afshar dynasty:
View attachment 695125

tbh im not too sure what good that is gonna do since its almost impossible to send a settler there because of all the desert/other civs in the way and no port cities to send boats

its a shame cuz muscat is one of my favorite cities to found these days

 

[SOVNARKOM]

tbh im not too sure what good that is gonna do since its almost impossible to send a settler there because of all the desert/other civs in the way and no port cities to send boats

its a shame cuz muscat is one of my favorite cities to found these days

You can try building a navy like Nader Shah in history to conquer Oman.
Perhaps Oman could be one of the conquest targets for Iran's second UHV.(For example, controlling a city in Arabia or controlling the Persian Gulf)