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Have you ever converted anybody yourself?
We believe this (we believe that they are brothers in the same sense that we are all brothers and sisters of both of them) but again, don't see the need to bring it up. if people ask, we tell them.
Why? Does the Bible ANYWHERE support this?
Also, why do you believe in multiple Gods (Even if they aren't important) when the Bible says there is only one?
Also, do you consider God the Father omnipotent?
Are you saved? In my talks with a Mormon, he mentioned salvation as an event that hasn't happened yet. (He might have misspoke.) Can you detail a bit your beliefs concerning justification (who does it apply to), salvation (what exactly it is), and glorification? Which are events and which are processes? When do they occur? Thanks.
My personal belief is that Mormonism is fabricated
and that part of its appeal is that difficult questions are answered.
But the answers only lead to more questions.
How do you reconcile all children going to heaven with the effect that most children would then be better off dead?
Well, within Mormonism salvation can actually refer to lots of things, but in this case he was presumably referring to "salvation from the effects of death and sin", ie final resurrection and judgment, which of course hasn't happened yet. And no one's position, while on earth, is so secure that they can say they are guaranteed salvation, regardless of any future actions.
If I may ask a question: I'm interested in what Mormons basically believe about God, what it means to say that God is divine, and where they think God came from. I didn't realise until recently that they have such a distinctive version of theism. As I understand it, Mormons believe that God is not fundamentally different from human beings, and is basically the same kind of thing, albeit on a larger scale. Is this correct? If so, what in your view are the basic similarities and differences between the Mormon understanding of God and traditional theism, and where did the differences come from?
(Apologies if this has already been discussed - feel free to give me a link.)
Hmm... During my discussions with the Elders, my biggest question was, "Where is the good news?" For salvation, you have to believe, "do the best you can do" here on Earth, perform ordinances, marry (even for all eternity!), etc... - you've traded the freedom of the gospel for false assurances and a life of slavery to law. (The assurances are false not (necessarily) by accuracy but by the nature of not knowing future events, thus your salvation is unknown, subject in part to your conditions at your death.) A more accurate, in my estimation, view of salvation would be that of a lost sheep, where you are the lost sheep and the Shepherd is Jesus. When you are reconciled to God (justified through faith), you have been found by the Shepherd. You haven't made it back to the pasture yet, but in the prescense of the Good Shepherd there is no doubt you will.Well, within Mormonism salvation can actually refer to lots of things, but in this case he was presumably referring to "salvation from the effects of death and sin", ie final resurrection and judgment, which of course hasn't happened yet. And no one's position, while on earth, is so secure that they can say they are guaranteed salvation, regardless of any future actions.
18 And now, behold, I speak unto the church. Thou shalt not kill; and he that kills shall not have forgiveness in this world, nor in the world to come. D&C 42:18
Hmm... During my discussions with the Elders, my biggest question was, "Where is the good news?" For salvation, you have to believe, "do the best you can do" here on Earth, perform ordinances, marry (even for all eternity!), etc... - you've traded the freedom of the gospel for false assurances and a life of slavery to law.
(The assurances are false not (necessarily) by accuracy but by the nature of not knowing future events, thus your salvation is unknown, subject in part to your conditions at your death.)
A more accurate, in my estimation, view of salvation would be that of a lost sheep, where you are the lost sheep and the Shepherd is Jesus. When you are reconciled to God (justified through faith), you have been found by the Shepherd. You haven't made it back to the pasture yet, but in the prescense of the Good Shepherd there is no doubt you will.
Consider this:
What should happen to a Mormon who kills one self?
Also, why does Jesus use KJV english in revelations to John Smith? Does he switch to more modern english for revelations today?
Doing the best you can is good; having your salvation depend on it is bad. Faith (perhaps evidenced by works) required for salvation is good; faith, works, ordinances, and law required for salvation is no salvation at all. I showed one example of law given in your scripture. There are others. Later, Jesus says adultery will actually result in destruction. That is what I mean.I don't see how it is a bad thing to do the best one can while on earth, and am unaware of any Christian religion that says that neither faith nor works are part of salvation. As for that last sentence, I have no idea how that is supposed to apply to Mormonism.
I was trying to differentiate false assurance (assurance for receiving x, when you are not actually assured of receiving x, even though x is presumed to be real) from what might be described fake assurance (assurance for receiving x, when you are not assured because x is a fiction).Huh?
I didn't think circumstances would be that crucial. Let's say he fell off a roof, broke his back, and didn't want to live if he couldn't walk. He used a bullet. What kind of circumstances do you think would affect the judgement?That depends on the circumstances under which he does it.
I didn't mean Bible quotes, I meant original prophecy full of "verily" and "ye". I would expect conversational language to be the base for that, not the Bible choice. I just found it odd.The Lord used the KJV because that was what Joseph Smith was most familiar with. We continue to use the KJV mostly because of tradition - we recognize that no translation is going to be perfect - and thus if God is going to quote the Bible to a prophet, He will use the version the prophet uses.
Doing the best you can is good; having your salvation depend on it is bad. Faith (perhaps evidenced by works) required for salvation is good; faith, works, ordinances, and law required for salvation is no salvation at all. I showed one example of law given in your scripture. There are others. Later, Jesus says adultery will actually result in destruction. That is what I mean.
I was trying to differentiate false assurance (assurance for receiving x, when you are not actually assured of receiving x, even though x is presumed to be real) from what might be described fake assurance (assurance for receiving x, when you are not assured because x is a fiction).
I didn't think circumstances would be that crucial. Let's say he fell off a roof, broke his back, and didn't want to live if he couldn't walk. He used a bullet. What kind of circumstances do you think would affect the judgement?
I didn't mean Bible quotes, I meant original prophecy full of "verily" and "ye". I would expect conversational language to be the base for that, not the Bible choice. I just found it odd.
Salvation comes because of the Atonement of Christ; I am unaware of any Christian religion that doesn't consider it to be conditional on faith and/or works. So it is with us, we don't earn salvation, but considering that salvation consists partially of "growing and progressing and reaching one's divine potential", I don't see how "doing good things" is in any way unnecessary.
I am not sure that all Protestants say that . . . at any rate we don't believe in "salvation by works" as such.
Is joining the church a good way to meet women? Sounds silly but it's a serious question..
If I remember right, Catholics say "Salvation by faith with works added," while most protestants say "Salvation by faith alone." I don't know what the Mormons think.
Is joining the church a good way to meet women? Sounds silly but it's a serious question..
Well, pain and despair tend to affect people's judgments.
Are we still talking about the same salvation? If murder and adultery according to your scripture results in destruction you are living under law, and to quote Paul if you live under law then Jesus died for nothing! I know murder sounds like an extreme example, but according to the rest of Christianity, God doesn't view sin on a sliding scale. All sins are equal (except for one).I am not sure that all Protestants say that . . . at any rate we don't believe in "salvation by works" as such.