[RD] Ask a trans person II: 2 trans 2 sexual
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sylvanllewelyn
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Trump said it. "As of today, it will henceforth be the official policy of the United States government that there are only two genders, male and female."
What happens when people try to renew their documents? Forced to add one of the two genders?
What happens when people try to renew their documents? Forced to add one of the two genders?
caketastydelish
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Source ?
Broken_Erika
Play with me.
Presumably, yes.
Certainly the nonbinary folks amount to low-hanging fruit for all this. I expect their tactics with respect to renewals to be something like requiring the renewer to cite their 'gender assigned at birth' on the form under penalty of perjury, to force transgender folks who have previously gotten gender markers changed on federal ID docs to either rat on themselves or make themselves vulnerable to future criminal prosecution. And who is willing to risk that? Sure birth certificate changes in some states are difficult to trace, but looking up the prior history of a given social security number (names change at the state level, SSNs typically don't change during legal transitioning) for passport or Social Security gendermarker change can be made practically automatic.
Hell, they can very likely just run a report from a State or Treasury database and by next week have a list of individuals to revert. No required armbands for us, nosirree.
Anyone in the US from other countries which still have trans rights, and who have identity documents like passports and birth certificates to that effect, are also going to potentially face problems.Presumably, yes.
Certainly the nonbinary folks amount to low-hanging fruit for all this. I expect their tactics with respect to renewals to be something like requiring the renewer to cite their 'gender assigned at birth' on the form under penalty of perjury, to force transgender folks who have previously gotten gender markers changed on federal ID docs to either rat on themselves or make themselves vulnerable to future criminal prosecution. And who is willing to risk that? Sure birth certificate changes in some states are difficult to trace, but looking up the prior history of a given social security number (names change at the state level, SSNs typically don't change during legal transitioning) for passport or Social Security gendermarker change can be made practically automatic.
Hell, they can very likely just run a report from a State or Treasury database and by next week have a list of individuals to revert. No required armbands for us, nosirree.
I don't know how they plan to deal with people with, say, foreign passports with an X gender marker, but I doubt it'll be pleasant. Likewise for anyone with foreign birth certificates and passports updated with their correct gender, but who don't sufficiently pass according to American officials.
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Perfection
The Great Head.
caketastydelish
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Perfection please stop the jokes/memes, this is actually a serious topic and not somewhere to spam.
Perfection
The Great Head.
the songs are listed in order of anger to heartfulness, none of em are jokes. Well the first one may be a half joke but it's a cathartic one for me.
I'm not posting in this thread on this day of all days to spam.
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caketastydelish
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I want to discuss actual issues, not post music videos.
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sylvanllewelyn
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Foreigners? Many countries just don't let them in, not even for transit inside the restricted zone.
But that's a "small" problem.
Do non-binary Americans now have to find their birth certificates, prove their birth gender, and have all their documents changed? Otherwise they can't even take a flight, get a job, receive food stamps, visit a hospital... etc?
What if you can't find your birth certificate?
I'd presume it'll be the same for a non-US citizen going through US customs as US citizens with X gender markers (or M/F markers that don't match their presentation) face when visiting, say, Saudi Arabia, Russia, or similar socially conservative or just LGBTQ-unfriendly country.
I mean, when I started transitioning (and especially, legally transitioning) I understood it meant that there were countries that became off-limits to me.
Many Americans are from states that don't allow birth certificate changes - the Feds have (over the past few years) allowed gender marker changes to passports and Social Security as 'attestation-only'. Ironically, pushes for Real-ID standards on state drivers' licenses means for the most part the states that allow X gendermarkers on those drivers' licenses have provided their license-holders federally accepted identification outside of the executive order's reach. The only problem I can see is domestic air travel, where a deliberate incompatibility with federal databases will probably block acceptance of any ID that has an X gendermarker. And any international travel, which requires the Dept of State issued passport.
Social Security tracks gender markers, but as far as I know doesn't key on it in any way for verification including employment eligibility.
Pretty much, aside from it being unexpected and being sprung on, no doubt, thousands of people who are variously linked to the US through family, work etc. Just the difference between long established known quantity and rapid reversal. I'll be surprised if there aren't stories about people being stranded or forcibly separated by the US rapidly turning into the Russian etc type state it looks set to become.
Hardly the primary way the brewing atrocities of anti trans policy and border policy will hurt people, but another one in the mix.
(I am replying to this part here, as <puts on former-mod hat> topically it's really way outside the current Trump thread and extremely appropriate for this one.)
Absolutely not rude, honestly I appreciate your interest.
And... I didn't know I was trans back then. I grew up in a middle-class socially moderate home, there was no internet in the 1980s, and all I knew about transgender folks or the concept was that there were Christine Jorgensen and a couple other "transsexuals". I couldn't possibly be like them, I just had weird thoughts about women's clothes (and had/have a few other kinks) and assumed I was the only one on the planet that felt that way so I absolutely needed to keep it all secret or my life would be ruined forever. I couldn't even show any curiosity about it to anyone because then they'd know. I was definitely certain that I wasn't homosexual, I didn't like boys at all. (Still don't.) So when I got to USNA in 1987, I just kinda buried the weirdness in my brain and left it buried. Graduated and went to my first ship, eventually got an apartment near Pearl Harbor, which was my first time living in a place alone, and started privately exploring crossdressing. Don't Ask Don't Tell came out in 1993, and I felt like it didn't apply to me - I wasn't gay, I didn't know anybody who was gay. It was later in the 1990s that I even learned that crossdressing was something other people liked too. Somewhere along the way I learned that in order to 'transition to the other sex' one needed to start living as the other sex 24/7 - i.e. tell one's family/friends/colleagues/everyone that one is a sexual deviant - for two years and then a doctor would decide if one could continue with that and get surgery, a legal name change, etc. Destroy one's life, and then potentially get told no you have to go back to living as a man anyway? Are you kidding me??? So my brain apparently decided I couldn't possibly be trans and it was only in 2017ish when I started meeting and being able to socialize (online) with a high percentage of trans folk that I started to gradually realize that yeah I really might be trans after all and that transitioning may be something I could do.
Ordnael
Emperor
Thank you for your honest and interesting life story and here's another probably coming across as a rude question, and the formulation of said question may also come across as plain weird or too puritan idk...I literally don't know any better(different) as I am a run of the mill guy and I like women (my wife preferably
):
You feel you are a woman, you make the, I honestly believe, gruelling effort of going through all those surgeries but in the end you still are attracted to women... why not use the body nature gave u? I mean it really looks as being lesbian with way too many extra steps, you couldn't love a woman (and I mean love not just sex) as your nature given sex? why not just cross-dress and be and effeminate man?...
My whys are probably sounding judgy, again not my intention!...now you are picturing me like the old lady with the bible knocking at your door
):You feel you are a woman, you make the, I honestly believe, gruelling effort of going through all those surgeries but in the end you still are attracted to women... why not use the body nature gave u? I mean it really looks as being lesbian with way too many extra steps, you couldn't love a woman (and I mean love not just sex) as your nature given sex? why not just cross-dress and be and effeminate man?...
My whys are probably sounding judgy, again not my intention!...now you are picturing me like the old lady with the bible knocking at your door
Thank you for your honest and interesting life story and here's another probably coming across as a rude question, and the formulation of said question may also come across as plain weird or too puritan idk...I literally don't know any better(different) as I am a run of the mill guy and I like women (my wife preferably
You feel you are a woman, you make the, I honestly believe, gruelling effort of going through all those surgeries but in the end you still are attracted to women... why not use the body nature gave u? I mean it really looks as being lesbian with way too many extra steps, you couldn't love a woman (and I mean love not just sex) as your nature given sex? why not just cross-dress and be and effeminate man?...
My whys are probably sounding judgy, again not my intention!...now you are picturing me like the old lady with the bible knocking at your door
To me you don't sound judgy or like a bible-toting missionary, you sound like an average cisgender hetero guy.
If you'll allow me to rephrase your question a bit, as "why not just keep pretending to be a guy?"
I'm about to type a lot, but no amount of typing, sharing, talking, whatever is likely to help you viscerally understand how it feels to be transgender. I've read a few analogies, I've thought out a couple, but explaining to a fish that despite having a fish body you're really a bird (or vice versa), well it just doesn't carry. Few people have any sense of having their identity involuntarily not match how everyone perceives and treats them on 24/7/365, and cishet white men in particular don't typically have reasons to think about how others perceive identity or to care about how others perceive their own.
So with that disclaimer out of the way, and also noting that this is just my experience and I'm not speaking for anyone else here but I think most trans folk are generally in the same ballpark...
I stopped crossdressing over a decade ago. My second wife knew about my crossdressing from the start - we met online, and my profile there was clear about it, she actually liked my doing it. But I remember at one point looking in the mirror while dressed, and being not disgusted, not ashamed, just incredibly depressed and feeling wrong. The person in the mirror looked like a guy wearing women's clothes, and in my head I was a woman no matter what clothes I was wearing. I didn't crossdress again after that. Not a 'purge', just... it wasn't me. I've since come to the realization that I thought I was a crossdresser because wearing women's clothes turned me on, but it was actually that I couldn't get into a sexytimes headspace without perceiving myself as a woman. Crossdressing didn't turn me on, but rather it enabled me to get turned on because my brain would briefly stop gnawing at me.
So why can't I continue with that, you've asked. It's because I've figured out that it's not really about the clothes, they're just one facet (albeit a significant one) of my gender identity. It's about all the gendered feedback my brain gets, not necessarily continuously, but certainly dozens and dozens of times per day. There are a LOT of gendered signals one experiences and the more mine align with my identity the more at peace my brain is, the less it gnaws at me continuously. I didn't realize until I started transitioning and it stopped gnawing at me for sustained amounts of time that it had been gnawing at me all the damned time, day after day, since when I first started being treated as a boy.
The silencing of that gnawing was incredible, euphoric. And as I started transitioning, it went from brief respites from the gnawing, to stretches of peace sometimes interrupted by gnawing (like when someone would misgender me, or I'd hear my voice sounding masc, or using a men's restroom, or getting out of the shower and looking down). Using the male features of 'the body nature gave me' makes the gnawing resume. Some bits of my body, thanks to male puberty, are always going to have that gnawing - wide shoulders, large feet, no hips - but my crotch equipment does not have to be one of them, and given how much gnawing it was causing, it was worth having the surgery to correct it. And by the way, that gnawing is what I think of as 'gender dysphoria'.
dusters
Emperor
Are there any "popular' co-morbid conditions with trans found via research in past 10 years?
I mean, just like autism rather often goes together with hyperactivity and AuDHD is rather popular combination nowadays.
I stopped going through the data when my transition failed in late 2010s. Yet I'm very curious of science.
I mean, just like autism rather often goes together with hyperactivity and AuDHD is rather popular combination nowadays.
I stopped going through the data when my transition failed in late 2010s. Yet I'm very curious of science.
I was looking for some stuff a couple weeks ago and found this gem.
CW: suicide, so I'm going to spoilertag everything.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38699117/ is the study, and it resulted in news articles claiming "study finds that people that undergo gender affirming surgeries have a much higher suicide rate"
Some of the articles very strongly implied that the surgeries were the cause of the higher suicide risk. But if you read the study, the control groups were adults with emergency visits but no gender-affirming surgery;
adults with emergency visits, tubal ligation or vasectomy, but no gender-affirming surgery; and adults with pharyngitis. Which is to say, the control groups were not composed of transgender folks. So like every other study done in recent memory, they found that being transgender results in much higher risk of suicide, and news orgs then either intentionally or unintentionally implied that surgery was the reason, not that being trans was the reason, and meanwhile any data on whether surgery lowers suicide rates among trans folk - an actually useful result - didn't happen.
It seems like most transgender folks are neurospicy, but I don't think I've seen any studies or research on much of that or any other co-morbid conditions.
Would you mind talking about this a bit more? How and why did it fail?
