useless
Social Justice Rogue
Offensive as: "You will go to hell if you don't believe in my religion"?
Atheist subway ads in NYC
- Thread starter Eran of Arcadia
- Start date
Offensive as: "You will go to hell if you don't believe in my religion"?
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
You don't have to be religious to believe in God. Just because you think that a God dude exist doesn't mean you're going to worship him in any way. There are people who believe that God exists but don't follow any sort of religion - not even a personal one.
On the other hand, there are plenty of religious atheists - the buddhists for example.
But if you're areligious, you can say that you're going about your life 'without God', right? Areligous is not atheist, but their poster is only saying that people are good without God.
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
There is so much confusion, misunderstanding, and outright idiocy regarding the terms atheism and agnosticism, that you can't really expect anyone to produce a logically sound phrase that's also clever.
People don't understand what atheist means anyway - so you might as well not even try to make logical sense - it's getting your message across that's important.
People don't understand what atheist means anyway - so you might as well not even try to make logical sense - it's getting your message across that's important.
Winner
Diverse in Unity
The problem is that atheism is now generally understood as a lack of religious belief in general, and I use it in that sense. And I do think that anybody who believes in some sort of supernatural beings is religious - it doesn't matter it doesn't fall under any of the established religions.
Lord Gay
Emperor
Still another reason to stay firmly in the atheist closet.
I wonder when there will be a movement against discrimination that is as powerful as the Gay right's movement.
Shhh!! Being atheist is my dirty little secret!
I think it will be harder for atheists than gays, since atheists suffer less persecution. While there were laws barring As from public office, and several states still have them in their Cons, they're powerless to enforce.
There is the occasional insult from xian officials, such as Elizabeth Dole during her campaign, or the congresswoman in Illinois, but these are few and far between. A person on YouTube told me recently a judge excused her from jury duty because she was an atheist.
I recall seeing a website not too long ago claiming to list all the areas in law where As were still discriminated against, but I never got around to looking too deeply into the site.
EDIT
Do we have to pay for the food?
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
That doesn't really make sense to me, especially your second point.
Are people who believe in ghosts religious for that reason alone?
Makes perfect sense to me, and yes, a person who believes in ghosts/spirits/astrology whatever can be religious even if it's not a recognized religion like Christianity. Perhaps the viewpoint in parts of Europe viewing non-mainstream religions as "cults" is carrying over a little much?
GenMarshall
High Elven ISB Capt & Ghost Agent
If you have an issue on the fate of sinners and umbelievers. Take it up with Jesus.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
- John 14:6
If you don't like the rules, don't enter the club. It's not offensive to tell an unbeliver (provided they ask first) of what happens to nonbelievers who don't believe in God. Christians politely state that you'll more than likely end up on hell. Ultamately, it is not up to any mortal man to determine the fate of an individual's afterlife.
If you don't believe in God, heaven and he'll. Why on earth does it bother you when it is a non issue? Something tells me that you've encountered a bunch of buttheaded Christians who do nothing but pester other people and decided to paint ALL Christians in saying "You will go to hell if you don't believe in my religion". Most Christians do not say that kind of thing to nonbelievers. When asked, the answer is normally "nonbelievers end up in hell if they don't believe in God/Jesus". If a theological answer offends you, then you need a thicker skin.
Again, if you don't believe in God, heaven and hell. You should not be bothered because you don't believe in a god, heaven and hell.
Are you just being obtruse, or just acting foolish?What? You mean like this?
Lord Gay
Emperor
I read the UK ads and they don't seem offensive to me (admittedly being an atheist). What was it that offended you?
Huayna Capac357
Deity
As warpus pointed out, there are non-religious theists ("spiritual" people) and religion atheists (Buddhists)
RedRalph
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2007
- Messages
- 20,708
I'd have to disagree on that one - I consider anyone who follows a relision religious, and thats the criteria. If you just happily believe to yourself in magic or some form of deity or whatever, you aren't religious. Wrong, but not religious.
Ziggy Stardust
Absolutely Sane
If you believe in a God whose intentions and purposed are unknown to you, you would have no way to act on your believes. In this case you are not an atheist, and not religious. There are quite a few people who believe there's more in the world than we perceive in the form of a God, or at least a powerful entity, but are unsure of it's nature.
Winner
Diverse in Unity
That's not the issue - of course hell doesn't exist, but it's about your attitude towards us atheists. I could translate it as follows:
"We deeply believe (and agree) that when you die, your soul will go to a place where you are going to be tortured in unimaginably brutal ways FOR EVER. We think that this is what you deserve."
HOW ON EARTH IS THAT NOT OFFENSIVE?
If I told you "I believe that you should be moved to secret CIA prison in Amazon and tortured forever, because you don't agree with my views", you'd certainly not take it as a sign of friendliness, even though no such prison exists (probably).
I don't think the offensiveness of a view has anything at all to do with whether it is based in reality.
I dunno, if you believe bad things about me, and are wrong- I'd think that more offensive than if you believed bad things about me that are true.
Winner
Diverse in Unity
Which is what I said right there in my previous post.
If someone believes that I should go to hell and suffer horribly forever just because I don't believe in his/her God, it doesn't matter that hell doesn't exist. What matters is the attitude itself, that the person in fact agrees that I deserve to be tortured because of my lack of faith.
How is that NOT a hostile attitude? How is that NOT offensive?
It is especially hypocritical given all the criticism I received for calling religious people mentally ill. Yeah, I did that, but I didn't say they deserve to be tortured for it forever. I didn't even say they deserve any kind of punishment, in fact I implied they need help. I guess it makes my attitude infinitely more moral than most religions are...
You felt the need to point out that the Amazon prison doesn't exist. I say, if it does, so what? I still don't deserve to go there.
I don't think so - obviously I will think I am right, and you will think I am wrong. You may find views of mine that you think are wrong, to be more offensive than views of mine that you think are right, but that is different.
I don't think so - obviously I will think I am right, and you will think I am wrong. You may find views of mine that you think are wrong, to be more offensive than views of mine that you think are right, but that is different.
To play devil's advocate for a second, the belief that you WILL go to hell is distinct from the belief that you SHOULD.
