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AVATAR Mod Development (Main Thread)

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Creation & Customization' started by Psychic_Llamas, Dec 22, 2009.

  1. The Capo

    The Capo godless Heathen

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    It just makes a bit more sense for it to be a colonization mod overall.
     
  2. blade117

    blade117 The Unburnt

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    Well, since I have no prior experience with colonization, I'll go along with it. But Cin IV just seems...more. It has a certain je ne sais quoi.
     
  3. TC01

    TC01 Deity

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    I like this idea too. I think Planetfall would be a good choice as the "engine" as well, though.

    Someone in the Colonization modding forums suggested the same thing and wondered if anyone was going to make a Col version of this mod.
     
  4. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    Actually, Colonization WOULD make more sense. A mod like this, there's no real need for techs... And it lets the humans get recruits from Earth, and the natives start all over the map... ;)
     
  5. CivLucas

    CivLucas Governor-General

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    I did some modding on colonization and the xml is not very different from BtS, so there shouldn't be many problems there.
     
  6. ilduce349

    ilduce349 (Financial, Philo)

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    I would only agree to using col instead of bts if u could play the natives as well as the humans also
    if using col we need more resources
     
  7. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    Well, that's what I would assume; The natives would be the Na'vi, so you'd have to be able to play them.

    Also, Col and Civ4 use pretty nearly the same art files, so any resource in Civ4 can work in Col.
     
  8. CivLucas

    CivLucas Governor-General

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    That is not entirely true, the natives aren't playable so you'd have to make them playable (which is possible I guess) and as far as the art goes all .dds files and the LH's work fine in col2. There are some problems with importing units, they're usually easy to solve though: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=317419
     
  9. Psychic_Llamas

    Psychic_Llamas Wizard in the Making

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    wow, i hadn't even considered colonization as a base for the mod! mind you i don't own it and had totally forgotten about its existence...

    does anyone know if its easily moddable if i buy it over Steam, or if it will have problems like other civ games?
     
  10. orlanth

    orlanth Storm God. Yarr!

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    Heya P_L ;)

    If you're interested in doing this in Colonization, you're more than welcome to do a modmod using Colonization 2071 to save time. I'm currently working on enabling the Col natives (now aliens) as playable races; I've been able to give them access to the Europe (Earth) screen for trading as well as the Founding Fathers mechanic using just XML. Civ4Col seems fairly easy to mod with. in fact less time-consuming than Civ4 mods, just be aware of the different mechanics than base Civ, so don't make any long elaborate plans involving religion and tech trees (good riddance I say! :p)

    I bought my copy of Col via download and it seems to work fine for modding (after all Col itself is basically a mod of Civ4).
     
  11. Onionsoilder

    Onionsoilder Reaver

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    Also keep in mind that you don't need to strictly follow the plot. Some creative liberties are a good thing... for instance, you could add in a rebel Na'Vi civilization that sided with the humans after seeing their power, or have a human civilization that doesn't care as much about unobtainium but is interested in shipping the flora/fauna back to earth as exotic treats for the upper class.
     
  12. Psychic_Llamas

    Psychic_Llamas Wizard in the Making

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    i went out and bought a hard copy of colonization today, didn't want to risk a steam bought version not working with modding :p

    [Incoherent thinking out loud]

    i have to say its extremely different to regular civ O_o more than i was anticipating. my first couple of games (at easy difficulties) made it appear that there is very little tactical warfare and conflict (how does one build a military?), if i use Col or any of its mod mods as a base i think i will expand the combat to be more akin to that of civ 4 (ie wider scope and easier to actually build troops as opposed to relying on shipping them from the motherland)

    i do like the many many different tile yields, these can be converted to the various exotic flora and fauna of Pandora quite easily i should think, (as well as incorporating Eywa Spirits and Unobtanium as such yields)

    The Europe screen would easily make an Earth screen (as Orlanth Suggested), although this would not be usable by the Na'Vi... i think something else should be considered for them though im unsure what

    there are certainly a lot of possibilities with Col to make an Avatar mod.

    [/Incoherent thinking out loud]

    im gonna edit the first posts with new ideas
     
  13. blade117

    blade117 The Unburnt

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    So this won't be for Civ 4? :(
     
  14. orlanth

    orlanth Storm God. Yarr!

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    It should be possible to do a lot with making new military units and promotions etc if you want, by working with unitinfos as in regular civ. Perhaps you could have different native military units that require native resources as an input.

    In my 2071 mod, to represent the native economy I'm now using an alien building that sells excess resources for a fraction of the price on Earth (same mechanic of the basic Col Warehouse Expansion building). It's also possible to have them travel to Earth directly and even to have them attract some human emigrants, though I'm making that much more difficult for them than the humans.

    The Missionary mechanism would seem a great fit for a human Avatar unit meant to communicate with the Na'vi aliens. Another obvious difference from Civ is the Rebel Sentiment and Revolution mechanics, as well as Liberty / Founding Fathers which you could potentially rename as Technologies as in the Mare Nostrum mod. I'm not sure if the Avatar humans or aliens would be trying to achieve some form of revolution/independence as an aim or not.
     
  15. Psychic_Llamas

    Psychic_Llamas Wizard in the Making

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    looks like it for the time being im afraid, though i might change my mind again (its not unheard of haha) (colonization is fairly cheap on steam anywho)

    yeh i was considering this as well.
    im unsure how the Na'Vi economy would opperate... i suspect they would attract more migrants from the wilderness... perhaps the Na'Vi could have a Wilderness Screen instead of an Earth Screen where they send out search parties to find other lone Na'Vi and animals.

    thats a good idea with the Avatars. have the RDA and other humans able to send them to non-player Na'Vi settlements to gain support like the missionaries. Would the Na'Vi get an alternative as well? perhaps if i make some other non-playble 'native' civs which consist only of Pandoran animals, the Na'Vi could send 'missionaries' there to bond with animals instead of humans or other navi.

    Regarding Liberty Bells, i think the Na'Vi could Use 'Ceremonial Drums' and the Humans could use something like 'Earth Propaganda'

    Regarding the revolution victory, i think ill disable that and come up with some other victory conditions, like 'Cure Earth' and/or 'Eliminate Savages' for human civs. 'Expel Invasion' and/or 'Unify the Clans' etc for Na'Vi Civs,
     
  16. Psychic_Llamas

    Psychic_Llamas Wizard in the Making

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    check out post three. i did a big update for tile yields based off of the Colonization yields and goods manufacturing.

    EDIT: i also updated post 4 with a few ideas about how i could use some of the colonization mechanics.
     
  17. ilduce349

    ilduce349 (Financial, Philo)

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    well in avatar the entire military was shipped in from earth, so in some senses it makes it more like the movie, and building a military isn't that hard late game, by late game i generally have 2 gunsmiths working in my 2 best cities, which means producing 12 weapons/turn/city, in just 5 tuns (13 in marathon) enough weapons for 2 armies are built, use one of the 50 or so converted natives i have. at the beginning my main focus is to perform missions (unless i am the Spanish), easiest way to gain free population. also i generally have 5 phases in a game.
    stage 1: 1500-1560, converting (massing missionaries and getting natives)
    stage 2: 1530-1640, economics (put 6 units/city on every good city spot on my map) then built 1 galley and privater/city and trade with france, i generally get 8000 gold/16 tuns
    stage 3:1610-1700, military, buy as many units, weapons and build, train ur units, by attacking every native who doesn't have ur mission in their villages, and at the end raze enemy settlements, (make sure u have more power then them)
    stage 4:1540-1550 and whenever stage 3 ends, build rebel sentiment until u have enough, done correctly this should take 20 turns, and the king would have only expanded his army by 9 or 10 units
    stage 5: rebellion, kick his ass, get every person out of every city, and rebel, each unit has a strengh of 2 so by now i generally have: 80 colonists, 40 veteran soldiers, 30 cannons and 20 dragoons and they normally have 60 units, in short, i win

    anyway, for avatar colonization i think:
    Spoiler :
    1) no monopoly, not have it exactly like the movie. make it so that there are 2-4 companies competing
    2) natives playable
    3) resources should be:
    food (of course)
    lumber (for production for the humans)
    unoctinium (replaces silver)
    Eywa (only visible to natives)
    need 2 come up with more resources as is 4 is not enough
    some ideas:
    animals (replaces fur)
    trained animals (replaces coat) what i mean by these 2 is maybe, the humans capture the more basic wild life and sell them as pets or something
    pandorium (replaces tobacco) some sort of drug found in the soil of pandora
    wrapped pandorium (cigars)
    then of course:
    parts (replaces tools)
    weapons
    fuel (replaces horses)
     
  18. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    Actually, you could leave the monopoly for the COMPANY, but have different VP's competing with different Base locations. Sure, the movie never said there were other bases... But they never really said there WEREN"T. ;)
     
  19. Psychic_Llamas

    Psychic_Llamas Wizard in the Making

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    clearly i need to figure out Colonizations gameplay propperly still... ive lost 3 consecutive games on the easyest difficulty because my king won a 'europe' victory... whateverthat means. thanks for the tips ;)

    i agree with having a couple of human civs (so far i have the RDA, ICA and Rebel Alliance, though i dont liek the name for the Rebels)

    Natives will definately be playable

    if you check out my third post you will see a large list of resources and my ideas of how to use the yields and manufacturing mechanic.

    this is another good potential. Alowing the RDA to appear twice on a map, each led by a different leader would be easy enough for this.
     
  20. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    Honestly, don't even need to be the same 'civ'. RDA-1 and RDA-2 (or whatever) could 'compete' so as to create the illusion of competition in a monopolized environment, as well as making sure the management is good at what it does. :lol:

    I think it would work to have them as different as any european power in Colonization, my idea was more explanation as to why there are multiple human factions. :goodjob:
     

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