Best Dwarf Origin Myth Ever

[MayNilad Man]

Yes but the mass of tentacle goodness all just writhing around trying to stab one through all of one's bodily orifices (shame on you!) is very much similar to the mass of tentacles with a tip in every person's dream.

 

[wilboman]

Oi, don't start drawing parallels between Lord of the Rings and Japanese cartoons catering to particular... tastes.

It kind of hurts my mind to think of the watcher in that way. Eeeew.

 

[MayNilad Man]

Was I drawing parallels or was I just vividly describing the fight scene

 

[BeefontheBone]

Yes but the mass of tentacle goodness all just writhing around trying to stab one through all of one's bodily orifices (shame on you!) is very much similar to the mass of tentacles with a tip in every person's dream.

I have one last thought...

 

[MayNilad Man]

Shame on you!

 

[Love]

Shame on you for saying shame on you

 

[MayNilad Man]

I am shamed

 

[Corm]

Im a bit late to this thread I guess but I have to concur with the thoughts on Tolkien being a bit boring. Sign of the times when he wrote them though and the reason he wrote them. Still enjoyable reads I just feel a lot better writers and novels have picked up his legacy and bettered it. A bit like modern PC's being much better than the early punch card cryptography devices. Bottom line all modern fantasy owes Tolkien a debt.

Either way im very surprised no one has mentioned Warhammer. Especially when someone asked for recommendations on books to read. The Gotrek and Felix novels by William King are classic low brow pulp fantasy by a decent writer. You also dont need to know anything about Warhammer to enjoy them. David Gemmel (RIP) is also conspicuous by his absence. Just about any Gemmel novel is classic fantasy at its best. You also have Rober E Howard (Conan), Feist, Eddings, Pratchett, McCaffery etc there are hundreds of good fantasy writers.

Back on topic though, the majority of the completed fluff for FFH is good IMHO.

 

[wig]

Im a bit late to this thread I guess but I have to concur with the thoughts on Tolkien being a bit boring. Sign of the times when he wrote them though and the reason he wrote them. Still enjoyable reads I just feel a lot better writers and novels have picked up his legacy and bettered it. A bit like modern PC's being much better than the early punch card cryptography devices. Bottom line all modern fantasy owes Tolkien a debt.

[gets out soapbox]

I think you need to be careful when throwing around terms like 'better writer', Corm. I also take issue with the punch card versus modern PC analogy (as Tolkein himself would, no doubt )

A lot of writers have taken Tolkien's ideas and repackaged them for a modern audience. David Eddings is a great example; he's taken the fantasy travel narrative and made is more accessible to modern reading tastes; adding more dialog and humor, removing the 'boring' elements like Tolkien's poetry. And he's sold a ton of books doing it.

Do that make him a better writer? Hardly. But he understands his audience, and gives them what they want. Again. And again. And again.

It's true that Tolkien's work is less accessible today than modern fantasy, but that's true of just about any historical work. Considering that he wrote in a style that was anitquated at the time, it's no wonder that a lot of people can't make it through the LotR trilogy, even though the all three books are shorter than the average Goodkind book (don't get me started on that guy).

[puts soapbox away]

I'd like to add Micheal Moorcock (Elric, Corum, etc) and Fritz Lieber (Fafhrd and Grey Mouser) to our growing list of 'must-read' fantasy authors. Both authors portray a dark fantasy world that blends well with a lot of the FfH back story. Plus both favor short novel with concise chapters, great for some quick lunch reading

Lastly, anyone have some good suggestions while we wait for Martin's Dance of Dragons to arrive? I'm afraid he's ruining me for most modern fantasy.

 

[Chandrasekhar]

What to do while waiting for Dance of Dragons? Re-read the other four books. Heck, it's what I'm doing.

 

[wig]

What to do while waiting for Dance of Dragons? Re-read the other four books. Heck, it's what I'm doing.

Good idea, but I've read them all twice (at least), as well as the Dunk and Egg stories. I'd like to shift my obsessive behavior to another series, but I'm finding it difficult at the moment.

I tried Erikson's Malazan series, but it just wasn't working for me. I tried another Feist book, but it was just his usual plot line in a new suit.

I've just started the Le Guin's Earthsea Cycle, a series I've neglected and which I'm enjoying so far; probably because it's on the other end of the fantasy spectrum from Martin's work.

 

[Corm]

Ok ok replace "better" with "more entertaining in a modern high fantasy stylee"



I dont disagree with you. Poor choice of words on my part.

 

[brianm]

I second the GRR Martin and Le Guin recommendations, but there's a hell of a lot of good stuff not mentioned yet:

Steven Brust's Vlad Taltos series - describing the life of a wisecracking assassin and mob boss in a fantasy world.

Glen Cook's Black Company books - chronicles of a mercenary company in a high-magic world, not always on the side of 'good'.

PC Hodgell's Kencyr series (starting with Godstalk) - probably the most underappreciated series currently going (but probably also the slowest. 4 books in ~30 years so far)

Lois McMaster Bujold's Chalion books.

Roger Zelazny - Lord of Light (Eastern religion in a blend of sci-fi and fantasy, and the Amber series. (And pretty much everything else he's written)

And straying a bit more from Epic fantasy:

China Mieville's New Crobuzon books - Sort of a Fantasy equivalent of the industrial revolution. Not for the weak of stomach - I'm not sure that theres a bodily fluid he hasn't used.

Guy Gavriel Kay - sort of alternate history, transplanted to a fantasy world. Excellently written.

Tim Powers - Puts more ideas into each novel than most authors use in a lifetime, and does it excellently. Mostly writes secret histories, creating a supernatural expanation around historical anomalies and facts. I have yet to read a better time-travelling werewolf ancient egyptian sorcerer novel than the Anubis Gates.

 

[Seten]

Yeah brianm!

I agree with your suggestion

Roger Zelazny made a great serie withe the amber prince , but it was eclipsed by dune.
If you're looking for fantasy with a machiavelian spirit , its for you

Glen cook -black compagny
For me its the best dark fantasy book , you mentioned high magic but i somewhat disagree , yes magic is the ultimate power in the book but its only used by really few people. Its mostly a book about steel.
This book is perfect if you want to follow band of brother in a badass way in a dark fantasy world

Then there is conan , if you're looking for epic stuff in barbarian ages

And also david gemmel.. sure he always make a lot of stuff , its always the same story , but on his hundred book 2 are really good : legend and the serie around parmenion

 

[Jupei]

You guys are such nerds

way to completely derail a thread about my favorite hero unit.

 

[MayNilad Man]

not nerds, bibliophiles.

 

[thomas.berubeg]

there's a fine line between the two

 

[feydras]

I've got to third the recommendation for Glen Cook's Black Company series and I agree it is definitely not high magic in the way i think of that phrase. It is all about low magic and that is what i love about it. There are a few ubermages but the main characters fear them and do their best to hide, manipulate, or ambush them as they know they would be squashed by them in a direct fight. Most of the action that takes place makes use of very intelligent mundane tactics sometimes mixed in with some minor magic used creatively. In that way it is the opposite of high magic, wizards are very rare and there are almost no 'magic items'. The books are dark and dirty with herioc characters not always acting heroically, but always in character. Lots of shades of gray. Epic war described from the grunt's perspective. Oh, and he kills main characters.
My take on the first (and best) book's plot: mercenary band gets hired by the equivalent of one of the Nazgul to fight a war on a continent they are unfamiliar with. They only have a loose idea of what they are fighting for and who when hired and spend most of the rest of the book rationalizing 'yeah, we are fighting on the bad guy/girl's side, but hey, we are mercenaries and
the other side isn't all that nice either.
He also does some fantastic stuff writing fantasy in a non-european setting in the last 4 or 5 books. The setting seems heavily influenced by India. Very interesting.

Now that i've caused most of you (if you are anything like me) to skim and skip my entry i'll say that my other favorite series is Martin's Song of Fire and Ice. Beautiful stuff.

My only problem with Tolkien is that he can take 7 pages describing the color of grass in a field and 2 paragraphs describing a major battle. Yeah, pacing. Btw, i loved the Similarian but find the Hobbit too childlike/folktaleish.

I've thus far avoided Wheel of Time because i've heard the story slows down immensely in the middle books and i also strongly dislike destiny type stuff. I like things more unpredictable. I've briefly played the RPG though and i really enjoyed the flavor of the magic system.

- feydras

 

[Chandrasekhar]

My only problem with Tolkien is that he can take 7 pages describing the color of grass in a field and 2 paragraphs describing a major battle. Yeah, pacing.

Hah, that's exactly my opinion on the subject.

I've thus far avoided Wheel of Time because i've heard the story slows down immensely in the middle books and i also strongly dislike destiny type stuff.

Ah, yeah, that reminds me of a point I wanted to bring up. The way that prophecy is dealt with in ASoIaF is really awesome, compared to Wheel of Time or really any other book series I've read. It's used sparingly, but ends up still being so... I'm not sure how to describe it, but it really gets your heart racing and your mind engaged.

 

[Go Boks]

My only problem with Tolkien is that he can take 7 pages describing the color of grass in a field and 2 paragraphs describing a major battle.

That is so completely unfounded, it is ridiculous. In my experience, Tolkien devotes several chapters to major battles, and I've never seen him use 7 pages on anything trivial. Maybe we are reading different editions?

I understand you are trying to be funny, but that is completely baseless.