[BtS MOD] Wolfshanze 1850-1920 Enhancement Mod v2.0

[Ninja2]

I would caution against making the default AI for the Machine Gun the CITY_DEFENSE, better to use CITY_COUNTER. The reason is that the AI will probably favor the Machine Gun over Infantry for city defense, as it is a cheaper unit than Infantry. While this may be fine as far as defense goes, those Machine Guns are useless on offense, an so you're making the AI build an army which is less versatile.

In the unmodded BTS, Infantry uses CITY_DEFENSE as the default AI, and so the AI will know to build those units as the "backbone" of the army. This is fine, because the Infantry also has ATTACK in its AI list. So the computer will use Infantry both for attack and defense of cities.

 

[Wolfshanze]

I would caution against making the default AI for the Machine Gun the CITY_DEFENSE, better to use CITY_COUNTER. The reason is that the AI will probably favor the Machine Gun over Infantry for city defense, as it is a cheaper unit than Infantry. While this may be fine as far as defense goes, those Machine Guns are useless on offense, an so you're making the AI build an army which is less versatile.

In the unmodded BTS, Infantry uses CITY_DEFENSE as the default AI, and so the AI will know to build those units as the "backbone" of the army. This is fine, because the Infantry also has ATTACK in its AI list. So the computer will use Infantry both for attack and defense of cities.

I don't think I agree... I looked at a lot of AI routines for various units.

In unmodded BTS and in recent previous versions of the Wolfshanze Mod, the default AI for the MG was "CITY_SPECIAL".

In unmodded BTS, the AI almost never made MGs at all... a simple change in the AI Routines (without changing the DEFAULT AI) in the previous version of the Wolfshanze Mod made the AI spam MGs like crazy and include them in all stacks.

Obviously the DEFAULT AI is not the most important factor in what the AI produces... because no-change was made in the default AI between default BtS and the previous Wolfshanze Mod, but the other AI's having different values drastically altered the way the AI built/used the MGs.

Having said that, I did read-up on AI useage... from my understanding, the main difference between CITY_COUNTER and CITY_DEFENSE is that the CITY_COUNTER is more likely to "rally out" as in some sort of attack, where-as the CITY_DEFENSE is more static. I also looked at other units, Archers for instance are CITY_DEFENSE, where as Spearmen are CITY_COUNTER. I think MGs should be more like Archers and less like Spearmen in AI use... MGs are very good at defending cities.

Having said that, the other important changes I made were the "NON_AI" tags which haven't been used before on the MG... I used NO "AI_ATTACK" and NO "AI_CITY_ATTACK", meaning the AI will never build these units for attack stacks of any kind. In the last version of the Wolfshanze Mod, the AI would indeed build MGs for attack stacks even though the default AI was not CITY_DEFENDER... I really don't think CITY_DEFENDER is as important as you say it is, especially if I force the AI to never build them for attack purposes.

In my last version, the AI did overproduce MGs... I seriously think they will build them less and use them less with this version... my goal is the happy medium. Because in default Civ4, the AI ALMOST NEVER built MGs... and in my last version they built too many... this version should be somewhere inbetween... there's probably multiple ways to setup the AI to accomplish this... mine should be one of those.

PS
If anyone has downloaded this mod AFTER reading this post, you've got the new version... if you downloaded v2.84 before reading this post, you've probably got the older MG AI code. Anyways, the new code is posted if you want to update it, and I'd like any feedback on the AI's use of MGs with the new code... I don't really have the time to test it, but in theory the AI should use MGs more then default BtS and less then in previous versions of the Wolfshanze Mod... so if you've played a game and noted AI use of MGs, I'd like to know what you think... too much, too little, or just about right.

 

[blitzkrieg80]

i can speak from my last game which contained a super-stack of 120+ of Cossacks from Russia which had 20 MG so it was pretty damn balanced imo... the 120 unit stack was a little crazy, but the amount of MG made it an unattackable stack really which I thought was amazingly brilliant for the AI and this is 2.83- so i like whatever setting that is just gotta stop 120 units from being built- this was with my 1 shield on all terrain modification for the World War Wolfshanze scenario- i already made the terrain default again and changed the speed to normal.

btw, since having it a mini-mod keeps my scenario from being an easy inclusion with Wolfshanze mod, I was thinking- I don't even mod anything beyond 1 leaderhead which isn't used for a different faction and the NO SETTLER to counter NO RAZING... so I am thinking when I am sure the scenario is a more final state, I will take off the settings that makes it need to be a mod as another version which can be used with Wolfshanze directly- I really don't want it to be a mod but that is the only way to have no settlers AFAIK- if anybody knows how to do this without modifying the file, I would love to hear it.

 

[Wolfshanze]

i can speak from my last game which contained a super-stack of 120+ of Cossacks from Russia which had 20 MG so it was pretty damn balanced imo... the 120 unit stack was a little crazy, but the amount of MG made it an unattackable stack really which I thought was amazingly brilliant for the AI and this is 2.83- so i like whatever setting that is just gotta stop 120 units from being built- this was with my 1 shield on all terrain modification for the World War Wolfshanze scenario- i already made the terrain default again and changed the speed to normal.

v2.83 of the Wolfshanze Mod was (IMHO and at least a few others) a "little heavy" on the use of MG units... the first 44 downloads of v2.84 also had this same code, but I tweaked the AI as-of the timing of that post on the subject... so if you downloaded the mod after my time-stamp on the "I'm changing the AI on MGs), you'll get the new code for MGs... which should tame-down the MG use a bit, but not to pre-Wolfshanze Mod levels, which was almost non-existent.

I'm experimenting here... I think it should be less then what it was, but more then default Civ4... won't be able to tell till it gets playtested with the new MG AI code... if for whatever reason you prefered the older Wolfshanze Mod AI code to the new one, it is listed on the previous page and easy to change.

 

[aob86]

this maybe a dumb question or maybe someones already asked but i really like this mod and i was wondering if there was anyway to add custom civ's to this mod

 

[Wolfshanze]

this maybe a dumb question or maybe someones already asked but i really like this mod and i was wondering if there was anyway to add custom civ's to this mod

Sure... you can add as many as you want... already, Austria, Poland and Vietnam were added... if you want to add more, you just have to do the XML work, but it can be done.

 

[aob86]

Sure... you can add as many as you want... already, Austria, Poland and Vietnam were added... if you want to add more, you just have to do the XML work, but it can be done.

is there somewhere i can read up on how to do that?, not something ive done before you see

 

[aob86]

also just a thought about the fighters both fighter and jet fighter have an 100% intercept chance but thats like spitfire against euro fighter, besides the combat strength different should there not also be intercept difference? as spitfire didnt have built in radar but a euro fighter does and that also brings up an idea, for me an air unit cannot have 100% intercept without radar, ive seen this tech added in other mods so how about jet fighters only have 90% intercept chance and fighter only 70% chance unless youve discovered radar then your fighter gets an free promotion of 10% extra chance of interception

 

[aob86]

or even, ww2 radar was ground based so how about radar tech allows you to build a radar base in cities and that ups your interception chance

 

[aob86]

radar tech could also give ships extra visibility range as ships with radar have an obvious advantage to those who dont and maybe also radar tech can give bombers an promotion with say 10% less chance of interception

 

[Xenomorph]

In the future, instead of posting so many follow-ups, just edit your original post.

is there somewhere i can read up on how to do that?, not something ive done before you see

Check the tutorials forums. They have stuff there ranging from adding new civs to adding new individual units.

or even, ww2 radar was ground based so how about radar tech allows you to build a radar base in cities and that ups your interception chance

That would require python and/or SDK changes to implement. Keep in mind the scope of the game as well; everything has to generally cover at least several decades of history. "Modern" covers pretty much the entire 20th century.

radar tech could also give ships extra visibility range as ships with radar have an obvious advantage to those who dont and maybe also radar tech can give bombers an promotion with say 10% less chance of interception

Ships already have a promotion ot give them extra sight range, it's called Sentry. Radar would actually make you easier to intercept, since you are broadcasting your location to anyone with a radar listening device. Remember, radar works both ways (though it's more effective for the guy generating it).

 

[aob86]

Ships already have a promotion ot give them extra sight range, it's called Sentry. Radar would actually make you easier to intercept, since you are broadcasting your location to anyone with a radar listening device. Remember, radar works both ways (though it's more effective for the guy generating it).

what i meant to say was promotion would only work vs units without radar tech

 

[Xenomorph]

That would require Python/SDK changes so that the unit with a particular promotion could recognize if the enemy has a particular promotion. It's also superfluous, since it can just as easily be simulated by a higher combat value (and possibly a bonus vs earlier aircraft) than the non-radar equipped fighters.

 

[aob86]

That would require Python/SDK changes so that the unit with a particular promotion could recognize if the enemy has a particular promotion. It's also superfluous, since it can just as easily be simulated by a higher combat value (and possibly a bonus vs earlier aircraft) than the non-radar equipped fighters.

that sounds like a good idea actually

 

[rkade8583]

Yays! An update!

 

[blitzkrieg80]

ok, i have a peculiar event and question about it - I didn't modify buildings whatsoever in my World War Wolfshanze scenario, but for some reason- Christian temples (and higher level religious buildings) add 2 hammer to a city no matter what the state religion is? Am I missing something? This might be from 3.17 Beyond the Sword but the civilopedia doesn't say anything and I have never seen this before - i actually like it, but am puzzled why Christian temples get it for Muslim civs, ect... anybody heard of this before or have a clue? I checked the wonders and they don't account for this and the Organized Relgion Civic doesn't exactly explain it, esp for a diff. religion from the state...

I realize temples produce priests, but there is an actual +2 hammer on the temple bonus picture/description and as said, christian temples only rather than all themples..

 

[phungus420]

It's the AP. You get the hammer bonus from any AP religion building, one of the major benifits of the AP actually. It's "supposed" to not grant it unless you're of the state religion of the AP. But they must have fugged the code because it has never worked like that, in any patch version. So in short, it's probably a bug, but it has nothing to do with Wolf Mod.

 

[blitzkrieg80]

ah cool - AP as in Apostolic Palace or whatever? i get it now... it's in Rome with Christianity... sounds like I am just ignorant of Beyond the Sword (weird how the Civopedia doesnt ever mention it) thanks for that though! [not being able to play BTS because of constant crashing kind of does that] sorry for the hijack, Wulfmeister...

 

[phungus420]

@Wolf, I can't figure out why, but the barbs in your mod start with Optics. I don't think it's related to any python code, or your custom DLL. I've removed both, and still get this. This doesn't create problems most of the time, however for me I've been playing a custom mod which is merged with your mod. This is making it so that barbarian civs that newly spawn (Barbarian civ spawning makes it so barbarian cities that start producing culture spawn new civs) start with optics. Do you have any idea what file is causing the barbs to begin the game with optics so I can fix this?

Nevermind, I figured it out, it's in CivilizationsInfos.xml You might consider removing that line from the barbs starting techs, barbs automatically get gifted techs as the rest of the world progresses, and it seems odd to start them on the jump with a late midevil tech.

 

[Ket]

@wolf,

What are the SDK changes so that I can re-compile the DLL with better bts AI or are there source files available so it can be merged?