Circumcision

[Leonel]

It's an abomination! If God intended our foreskins to be cut, he would have left it off the submitted plans!

I feel sorry for anyone that's been brutally mutilated in such a primitive and barbaric manner!

 

[Mise]

I don't see the point in it, but it shouldn't be made illegal

FGM is clearly abhorrent, though.

 

[MobBoss]

It's an abomination! If God intended our foreskins to be cut, he would have left it off the submitted plans!

I take it that you dont cut your hair or shave?

 

[El_Machinae]

You realize you lacking a very important part of flesh, right?

I know it's hard to judge from the other side, but my experience is that circumcised males just don't really mind that they were circumcised. I mean, yeah, it's a permanent mutilation and all, but in the end, it just doesn't bother me that I've been cut.

I'm generalising from my own experiences, yeah, I know, but I haven't seen statistics on it.

 

[Defiant47]

Like fingernails?

I take it that you dont cut your hair or shave?

Improper analogy: this isn't something that grows to an excess, and grows back when removed. This is a permanent modification to one's body.

 

[Mise]

El_Mac: Is that because you don't know what you're missing? It's easy to say having grown up with something missing that it wasn't really missed. I'm not saying you're disabled, but I'm sure -- and it is my hope! -- that many disabled people are perfectly happy with their bodies.

 

[hossam]

BTW, is it true what my turkish friend told me, that most muslims get a partial circumcision?

im not sure i understand what that means

 

[El_Machinae]

El_Mac: Is that because you don't know what you're missing? It's easy to say having grown up with something missing that it wasn't really missed. I'm not saying you're disabled, but I'm sure -- and it is my hope! -- that many disabled people are perfectly happy with their bodies.

Well, I'm not happy with my disability. I wish I could see colour. I frequently bemoan my colourblindness, and I look forward to a cure. And, from my perspective, the condition regarding my foreskin just isn't analogous. I just don't mind the lack of foreskin.

Maybe it's because sex is WHEEE! fun as it is, I don't think I'm missing out. In comparison, I frequently realise what I'm missing by not seeing the same colours y'all do.

Now, cosmetically, I grew up in a world where it was normal to be circumcised. Or not circumcised. So, there was no social issue to hold me down either.

 

[Narz]

It's hardly conclusive that it cuts off sensation, especially to a significant degree.

Um, nerve endings create sensation, when you remove lots of them you're going to lose some sensation.

(Comparing it to cutting off "half the sensation" in your arm is sensationalism, pure and simple)

Perhaps. I wouldn't really know not having any non-circumcized experience to compare to. My father on the other hand was circumcized at 13 (IIRC he got an infection). I imagine he probably masturbated before then & I could ask him about the difference but A : it won't make any difference to me now & B : I don't have the type of relationship with my dad where I can talk to him about that sort of thing. As a sidenote, if not for this incidence in my father's life I probably would not be circumcised since my mom said she decided to have it done so I'd "match" my dad.

The evidence on this point is conflicting and from the numbers usually involved, practically anecdotal.

Satisfaction polls aren't particular valid evidence. A poll of 100 women who's never orgasmed with their partner may show 73% say they are satisfied with their sex lives and a poll of 100 women who regularly orgasm with their partner may show 78% satisfaction. Does that mean there is no real difference between the two groups? No. Opinion polls using vague terms tell us little except how people's reality stacks up against preconcieved notions of what reality is supposed to be. A person with extremely high expectations may appear less satisfied than one with very low expectations but their experience of reality may in fact be much richer.

A better way to measure sensation during sex would be directly in their brain. Dunno if any such research has been done however.

Honestly, I don't think circumcision is all that great - it's not something that you have to, or even necessarily should, do. But I think that there's an awful lot of misinformation going around, and people tend to freak out about this issue a whole lot more than they need to. Of course, that goes for both sides - which is what makes it so entertaining, if bizarre - because when it gets down to it, what you're reallying arguing about is baby penises, which is really somewhat creepy.

It's creepy to want to protect the bodies of babies?

 

[LucyDuke]

And for the record, uncircumcised penises look pretty weird.

I gotta agree with this one.

 

[Narz]

I gotta agree with this one.

Just conditioning. I think girls with armpit hair look gross but logically I know it's just cause I grew up within stupid American culture.

 

[mitsho]

Well I was just saying that as an uncircumcised man myself, I prefer uncircumcised penises.

If you think about it, it makes logical sense, at least for those who masturbate. Most of the time you'll be masturbating you'll be looking at your own penis. It is only natural that you will then associate pleasure (and general preference) with your own type of penis more than another kind.

I on the other hand (as a gay man who has had a medical circumcision and thus knows the for and after somehow) like the uncircumcised penis, and I do like my own circumsized one as well. I guess that goes to show that sex isn't logical and preferences are subjective.

 

[Narz]

I think uncircumcized wangs are funny/ugly looking and also like my own (and always have since years before I ever masturbated). However, I'd sure I'd have liked it just fine in it's original condition as well, perhaps I also wouldn't have suffered from inorgasmia for 19 years had I been uncircumcised. As Defiant47 said, it's more than the foreskin removal that is the problem but the fact that the protection for the glans is gone meaning it's inevitably going to get desensitized rubbing up on your shorts & all. It's like if you stuck your tounge out all day everyday (which is supposed to be safe in your mouth).

BTW, I didn't know you were gay. I though I remember you saying something about women you hooked up with at the meetup. Anyway, did you think I was hawt?

 

[Miles Teg]

f not for this incidence in my father's life I probably would not be circumcised since my mom said she decided to have it done so I'd "match" my dad.

And here I thought I was the only one.

 

[Huayna Capac357]

I don't really care, but it is bad.

 

[Slim_Shady]

It's an abomination! If God intended our foreskins to be cut, he would have left it off the submitted plans!

I feel sorry for anyone that's been brutally mutilated in such a primitive and barbaric manner!

So you are assuming all of us believe in God?

 

[Elrohir]

Um, nerve endings create sensation, when you remove lots of them you're going to lose some sensation.

Yes, but does circumcision remove "lots," compared to what's left? All the studies I've shown tend to show conflicting results, with some saying there's loss of sensitivity, but with many others saying it's about the same, or even increased sensitivity. This is an area where there really hasn't been enough study to say for certain - which is why both sides here are way too dogmatic.

Perhaps. I wouldn't really know not having any non-circumcized experience to compare to. My father on the other hand was circumcized at 13 (IIRC he got an infection). I imagine he probably masturbated before then & I could ask him about the difference but A : it won't make any difference to me now & B : I don't have the type of relationship with my dad where I can talk to him about that sort of thing. As a sidenote, if not for this incidence in my father's life I probably would not be circumcised since my mom said she decided to have it done so I'd "match" my dad.

From what I can tell, there's no correlation between circumcision and sex drive or interest in sex. If circumcision caused a substantial loss of nerves that rendered sex significantly less enjoyable, one would think that you'd find circumcized men less interested in sex. (Perhaps not noticeably individually, but over millions of people, even a slight difference tends to add up) I don't see any evidence that this is the case.

The only exception that I'm aware of is that some studies have shown that circumcision does tend to decrease the frequency of masturbation somewhat. But I'm inclined to believe that this is less significant than most people think; I believe somewhere in the neighborhood of 70-80% of American men are circumcised, and going by the billions that are spent on porn in the US every year, I think we're doing OK on this front.

A better way to measure sensation during sex would be directly in their brain. Dunno if any such research has been done however.

Again, there really hasn't been all that much research on this subject, so we can't really say for certain. But the research that has been done seems to point towards this being not a very big deal. I'm certainly not arguing that circumcision is necessary, for should be the default - just that it's not some horrible abuse that must be outlawed.

 

[Miles Teg]

I gotta agree with this one.

Just out of curiosity, you think that circumcision is a bad thing (though not important enough to ban) but you think uncircumcised penises look funny?

I understand why, but it's an interesting juxtaposition

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

Would you circumsize your boy or not? Assume you and only you were given the choice; would you do it?

I do not understand this question. I do not intend to have a child, nor can I even conceive of a hypothetical scenario in which I would have a child. It just ain't happenin'.

 

[Leonel]

So you are assuming all of us believe in God?

Or BUUUUUUUUUUURN!!!